This is why I do not trust the police

[Shadow Wolf]

No, is that what happened to you? Were you driving at the time?

Yes to both.
ETA: for clarity, there was literally no where for me to run to or go to when this happened. Both times I was in a cop car, there isn't much hiding when it's a mile or two to the next intersection.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Yeah I've heard this before. The sad thing is people forget when it comes to Sherriff Deputies, before they become beat cops, they have a stint in the jails so a lot of them come out with that hardcore jail mentality. Cops in the Compton, Watts, Lynwood, Los Angeles areas have more bad than good. you guys don't understand because you're not out here. This is the third time I was stopped in my hospital uniform on foot. My shirt literally said "Emergency Department. What criminal is walking around with a work badge, and some hospital gloves looking to do crime? It's hard to not judge. I've been stopped wearing a philly hat. I've been stopped wearing a dodger hat. I've been stopped and asked if I'm on probation or parole simply for walking down the street.

We (I say we as in people in my city) get stopped so many times that we've become complacent to the injustices that affect us. I think the only thing that would open people's eyes is a documentary of everyday people who live in the inner city. I'm not talking about people who are hanging around trouble makers, but actual people who are profiled and to document how often people that look like me are always stopped. Look I'm 6'0 athletically built guy with tattoos but I'm educated and I work for a living. The problem is the being 6'0 and athletic build and tattoos I'm automatically a gang member in the eyes of law enforcement.

This cop gets it in this video

Different areas are going to have different training, and different environments. Here being Latino and of high school age would mark one as being in a gang. I will have to watch the video when I have some time.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Yes to both.
ETA: for clarity, there was literally no where for me to run to or go to when this happened. Both times I was in a cop car, there isn't much hiding when it's a mile or two to the next intersection.

One loses quite a few "rights" when one drives. Most states have it written in when you accept a licence that you are also allow police to test you if they feel suspicious. Why did he not just breathalyze you? In many states just refusing to take a breathalyzer test can cause instant suspension of one's license.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Why did he not just breathalyze you?

I don't know. But the sheriff that had me then, he's known throughout the mid-to-southern part of the county as an *******.

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

One loses quite a few "rights" when one drives. Most states have it written in when you accept a licence that you are also allow police to test you if they feel suspicious. Why did he not just breathalyze you? In many states just refusing to take a breathalyzer test can cause instant suspension of one's license.

When I'm pulled over for an RBT, if I'm not in a hurry, I make a point of making the cop in question record in writting that I will comply with his directions, but do so under protest as I believe the practice infringes on my right to a presumption of innocence.

 

[Subduction Zone]

When I'm pulled over for an RBT, if I'm not in a hurry, I make a point of making the cop in question record in writting that I will comply with his directions, but do so under protest as I believe the practice infringes on my right to a presumption of innocence.

I doubt if that would have any effect on a trial. In my youth I overindulged at times, not very often, and I was lucky I guess. Never got caught, never got in an accident. One time it was work related and I got nominated to drive since I was the least drunk out of four. Best to avoid drinking and driving altogether.

 

[Earthling]

What this means is never get involved to help someone else.

I understand why you might think that way, but I hope you don't continue in that thinking. Especially given your work. As the Latin term says: Abusus non tollit usum: abuse does not cancel use : misuse of something is no argument against its proper use.

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

I doubt if that would have any effect on a trial. In my youth I overindulged at times, not very often, and I was lucky I guess. Never got caught, never got in an accident. One time it was work related and I got nominated to drive since I was the least drunk out of four. Best to avoid drinking and driving altogether.

Oh, I never drink and drive, and I'm not suggesting trying it to avoid a brethalyser. It's just my way of letting the cops know the population isn't completely cowed by them. It's only a small thing, I know.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Oh, I never drink and drive, and I'm not suggesting trying it to avoid a brethalyser. It's just my way of letting the cops know the population isn't completely cowed by them. It's only a small thing, I know.

I don't think they will be too impressed. When people tell the cops "I know my rights" they rarely do. Still the ones that I have met both socially and in law enforcement issues, tend to take their job seriously. I have been lucky enough not to run into any that I would qualify as jerks.

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

I don't think they will be too impressed. When people tell the cops "I know my rights" they rarely do. Still the ones that I have met both socially and in law enforcement issues, tend to take their job seriously. I have been lucky enough not to run into any that I would qualify as jerks.

It's not an "I know my rights" type exercise. Like I say, I comply with their instructions.

 

[HonestJoe]

While I somewhat support the point the OP is trying to make, isn't the generic assertion of not trusting (any) police exactly the same kind of profiling that is implied in police officers not trusting any black people?

 

[Buddha Dharma]

I think we always have to be skeptical of law enforcement, and keep them up to task- even in the best of scenarios. Because it's easy to misuse such a position, and because- law enforcement can actually be enforcing unjust laws. Then it isn't living up to the ideal of justice.

It is noted that at the Nuremburg trials many of the Nazis answered the accusations with 'simply following orders'. I think these are good points of consideration for why we always need to objective toward law enforcement.

 

[Earthling]

I would not judge all cops by one incompetent cop. Odds are that the cops you talked to will have a little talking with the one that screwed up. People will tend to profile. It is instinctual and hopefully they are training people to avoid that, though there will always be some that screw up.

It isn't about one cop, if it were about one cop we wouldn't be having this discussion, with such a wide variety of people having the same opinion and experience. It's about a system that is corrupt and broken. It's about a nation of statutes, acts and regulations and hidden taxes (fines and licences) instead of laws. Then each cop has to follow the pack for survival and protection of their own. It becomes us against them when it was meant to be protect and serve. It's about fear. Its about racism incorporated by greed. It's about privatization of a prison state. It's about a need to fulfill a quota - stats - created by corrupt politics that derives profits from arrests and the systematic and unfair incarceration of dark skinned people for private gain and the political manipulation that encourages it for profit and control.

 

[Stevicus]

*The following recently happened and is an anecdote however given the climate that many black and brown individuals face in the inner city, this event is indicative of the type of profiling that goes on.

I was recently stopped yesterday and placed in the back seat of a police car for investigatory reasons. now to get here let me dial it back to the beginning. Prior to going to work, I was having car trouble at my house as my car wouldn't kick over so no worries I ended up calling uber on my phone app and sure enough I was on my way. Now twelve hours later, I needed a ride back home and one of the RNs in my department didn't mind helping me out to drop me off. Now during my shift, my uncle was recently hospitalized for high fever and incontinence so to check on him I prompted my co-worker to drop me off on his street which was a block over from my house. While walking, I had spotted two L.A. County Sherriff deputies patrolling his street doing all kinds of U-Turns in apparent attempt to look for someone. I made eye contact with one, waved my hand in a salutation and kept it moving.

Approximately not even a minute later as I was coming up to my uncle's house the same deputy whom I've made eye contact with drove and jumped the side walk I was on only to hop out and ask me if I was the one that had witnessed a car accident a couple days ago. I concurred that an accident did occur around that time in which I administered assistance to a young lady who was disorient and who appeared to have been released from my hospital (she word blue "scrub" pants and our hospital socks not to mention I asked her if she was released and she did acknowledge in the affirmative, and she was also a psychiatric patient). Apparently according to this deputy the detective working on that case wanted to identify me because apparently in that major cross street there are several cameras somehow they singled me out among others who were there.

The deputy then told me to turn around and place my hands in an upside down prayer position while being detained and searched. I asked the officer why am I being detained, and according to the officer, he stated I was being detained because the detective wanted to identify me. I informed the officer that I'm a hospital employee, and I just got off of work and was visiting my uncle. Apparently, the officer knew I was obviously an employee considering in my right back pocket I had hospital gloves, and my badge as he placed it on the hood of his vehicle. The officer then placed me in the back seat of his patrol vehicle (I'm 6ft and 230lbs and this was extremely uncomfortable) where I was to wait while he called the detective. Shocked as I was, I tried to recall the events of that accident to see if I had done anything wrong.

While the officer was on the phone I overheard him say to whoever he was speaking to on the phone that "I didn't run his name for any criminal background." The officer hung up the phone, asked me my name and date of birth and ran my name. I asked the officer why is my name being ran. the officer said, "to identify who you are." Who knew that doing a good deed would land me in the back seat of a patrol vehicle. Now in my mind if this was a mishap of information and considering I was never questioned on scene and also considering I assisted the officer upon arrival, I didn't realize I'd be criminally investigated for something that had nothing to do with me. After running my name nothing popped up he shut his computer off and let me out and I was free to go.

With a smile on his face, he apologized and went about his business. This is one of many examples. I've been stopped on foot and was frisked without provocation. I don't even wear hats any more since certain hats are associated with certain gangs. More importantly, what bothers me wasn't the fact I was questioned, what bothers me was that I was questioned with my hospital attire on and treated as if I committed a crime. Of course I could have pressed the issue but usually complaints really don't get you nowhere but many of us in these communities get our rights violated and sadly enough, we've become complacent.

I generally don't trust police either. I think a lot of the problem is that people put far too much trust and authority in them, simply because of their uniform or badge. I've heard of the phenomenon where some people get drunk with power the minute they put on a badge or uniform, but it's also true from the other side, where people automatically give deference and respect merely because of a badge or uniform.

It's similar with the pseudo-patriotic mentality of "support the troops" or that "they're fighting for our freedom."

The idea is that we are expected to respect their authority "just because," and it's this mentality which gives cops license to do what they do. If more people would question them, call them to account, and stop running interference on their behalf when others question/criticize the police, then I have a feeling that we'd get better behavior out of the police department.

Actually, that would probably be true about the entire government as a whole, if only people would question authority more often. The trouble is that too many are all too willing and eager to run interference on behalf of the cops or the military or the intel agencies or other aspects of the government. There is too much faith that "the system works," and it's this faith which leads to the kinds of abuses we've been seeing.

 

[rocala]

Because they are all trained in the same wa

And your qualification to write about the police of this world is what exactly?

 

[Stevicus]

It's also stories like this which make one wonder: Video shows cop-suspect trackside scuffle before train kills man

What strikes me is that they said it took "months" before the police would actually release the video footage. It's that kind of stonewalling and refusal to release information that also makes the police look bad.

If it's really just a few bad apples, then the police should have nothing to hide. There's nothing to gain by maintaining this culture of secrecy and their lack of transparency.

 

[Earthling]

And your qualification to write about the police of this world is what exactly?

My qualifications? A citizen and observer. Or should I graduate the Maritime School of Critics of the police state? Get a degree to frame and hang on my wall. Would that impress you? Are you qualified to ask me stupid questions? Did you graduate the Academy Of Stupid Questions?

 

[rocala]

A citizen and observer

A citizen of what? What citizenship do you hold that entitles you to make derogatory statements of people doing a particular job in countries, cities etc that you have never been to, and in some cases probably never even heard of.

 

[Subduction Zone]

It isn't about one cop, if it were about one cop we wouldn't be having this discussion, with such a wide variety of people having the same opinion and experience. It's about a system that is corrupt and broken. It's about a nation of statutes, acts and regulations and hidden taxes (fines and licences) instead of laws. Then each cop has to follow the pack for survival and protection of their own. It becomes us against them when it was meant to be protect and serve. It's about fear. Its about racism incorporated by greed. It's about privatization of a prison state. It's about a need to fulfill a quota - stats - created by corrupt politics that derives profits from arrests and the systematic and unfair incarceration of dark skinned people for private gain and the political manipulation that encourages it for profit and control.

And yet the vast majority of supposed abuses are not when investigated .

Policing is a high risk job and errors will be made. Two things make policing more difficult in the U.S. than in other countries. Our high diversity is both a strength and a weakness. On the downside diversity tends to create communities where people feel that they are opposed to others. Europe is just beginning to run into that sort of problem in areas of high immigrants. Unfortunately @Epic Beard Man was a victim of this sort of us against them mentality that a cop had. The system is far from broken, it could definitely be improved, but we are going to have these sorts of problems due to our diversity as a nation.

By the way, fines and licenses are not hidden taxes. That is the sort of claim that one of the loony Sovereign Citizens would claim. As a supposed Christian you should be following the Bible, especially the New Testament in these matters.

 

[Earthling]

A citizen of what? What citizenship do you hold that entitles you to make derogatory statements of people doing a particular job in countries, cities etc that you have never been to, and in some cases probably never even heard of.

I'm a citizen of these United States Of America, mister! And as such I have the inalienable right to make derogatory statements of people doing a particular job in this county, so you better watch out or I shall practice this upon the as well!