To Be Superior or Not To Be Superior

[osgart]

Thank you for sharing your views
I agree with all. I like your:
"Virtuous Supremacy"

Superiority doesn't have to be a spiteful, arrogant looking down on others that may have inferior existence and/or conditions. I just think equality is way more desirable than superiority and a righteous Lord would be about making things equal for all.

 

[blü 2]

people often have ideas about right and wrong and humans are involved in politics so there’s really no way around that. Most Christians believe that Jesus rose from the dead and will return to judge the Earth and then establish a new earth.

Yes, notwithstanding Jesus' promise in all three synoptic gospels that the Kingdom would be established on earth within the lifetime of some of his hearers (Mark 9:1, Mark 13:28, Matthew 10:23, Matthew 16:28, Matthew 24:32, Luke 9:27). That looks like a thoroughly demonstrated lemon to me ─ or do you know of some 2000 year old Levantines living in the Bronx or wherever?

 

[stvdv]

It means that there are no limits to what can be done everywhere in existence.

Thank you, makes sense

Whatever the eternal source is we would have come in contact with however it acts on existence if it were omnipotent.

That is, assuming our senses can perceive it
And assuming we can recognize it
Meaning we should know it

Whatever brought life into existence be it matter/energy or intelligence of some kind is apart of the eternal source.

Maybe, maybe not.
Maybe it's too much to comprehend in our 3D world and understanding, like you also describe below; makes sense to me

I think there is way more to reality than what can be observed,

and way less than what a God would be able to do.

I guess you have Abrahamic kind of God in mind
Then I agree, esp. considering the Universe is immense, the earth is like nothing compared to the whole Universe

Knowing the Universe is so immense it makes sense to me, that "understanding the Universe" is way beyond tiny human's understanding

 

[Jimmy]

Yes, notwithstanding Jesus' promise in all three synoptic gospels that the Kingdom would be established on earth within the lifetime of some of his hearers (Mark 9:1, Mark 13:28, Matthew 10:23, Matthew 16:28, Matthew 24:32, Luke 9:27). That looks like a thoroughly demonstrated lemon to me ─ or do you know of some 2000 year old Levantines living in the Bronx or wherever?

He makes no mention of it being within their lifetime.

 

[blü 2]

He makes no mention of it being within their lifetime.

You must be using an unusual edition of the NT. Mine (RSV) says, for instance, and with emphasis added ─

Mark 9:1 And he said to them, “Truly, I say to you, there are some standing here who will not taste death before they see that the kingdom of God has come with power.”

Mark 13:28 “From the fig tree learn its lesson: as soon as its branch becomes tender and puts forth its leaves, you know that summer is near. 29 So also, when you see these things taking place, you know that he is near, at the very gates. 30 Truly, I say to you, this generation will not pass away before all these things take place.

Matthew 10:23 When you are persecuted in one place, flee to another. Truly I tell you, you will not finish going through the towns of Israel before the Son of man comes.

Matthew 16:28 Truly, I say to you, there are some standing here who will not taste death before they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom."

Matthew 24:32 “From the fig tree learn its lesson: as soon as its branch becomes tender and puts forth its leaves, you know that summer is near. 33 So also, when you see all these things, you know that he is near, at the very gates. 34 Truly, I say to you, this generation will not pass away till all these things take place.

Luke 9:27 But I tell you truly, there are some standing here who will not taste death before they see the kingdom of God.”​

I'm not sure how you managed to miss all of those. Perhaps you might make a booking with your optometrist?

 

[Jimmy]

You must be using an unusual edition of the NT. Mine (RSV) says, for instance, and with emphasis added ─

Mark 9:1 And he said to them, “Truly, I say to you, there are some standing here who will not taste death before they see that the kingdom of God has come with power.”​

​

Mark 13:28 “From the fig tree learn its lesson: as soon as its branch becomes tender and puts forth its leaves, you know that summer is near. 29 So also, when you see these things taking place, you know that he is near, at the very gates. 30 Truly, I say to you, this generation will not pass away before all these things take place.​

​

Matthew 10:23 When you are persecuted in one place, flee to another. Truly I tell you, you will not finish going through the towns of Israel before the Son of man comes.​

​

Matthew 16:28 Truly, I say to you, there are some standing here who will not taste death before they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom."​

​

Matthew 24:32 “From the fig tree learn its lesson: as soon as its branch becomes tender and puts forth its leaves, you know that summer is near. 33 So also, when you see all these things, you know that he is near, at the very gates. [/b]34 Truly, I say to you, this generation will not pass away till all these things take place.[/b]​

​

Luke 9:27 But I tell you truly, there are some standing here who will not taste death before they see the kingdom of God.”​

I'm not sure how you managed to miss all of those. Perhaps you might make a booking with your optometrist?

Believe it or not, mostly the statements of Jesus are regarding our time.

 

[Jimmy]

You must be using an unusual edition of the NT. Mine (RSV) says, for instance, and with emphasis added ─

Mark 9:1 And he said to them, “Truly, I say to you, there are some standing here who will not taste death before they see that the kingdom of God has come with power.”​

​

Mark 13:28 “From the fig tree learn its lesson: as soon as its branch becomes tender and puts forth its leaves, you know that summer is near. 29 So also, when you see these things taking place, you know that he is near, at the very gates. 30 Truly, I say to you, this generation will not pass away before all these things take place.​

​

Matthew 10:23 When you are persecuted in one place, flee to another. Truly I tell you, you will not finish going through the towns of Israel before the Son of man comes.​

​

Matthew 16:28 Truly, I say to you, there are some standing here who will not taste death before they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom."​

​

Matthew 24:32 “From the fig tree learn its lesson: as soon as its branch becomes tender and puts forth its leaves, you know that summer is near. 33 So also, when you see all these things, you know that he is near, at the very gates. [/b]34 Truly, I say to you, this generation will not pass away till all these things take place.[/b]​

​

Luke 9:27 But I tell you truly, there are some standing here who will not taste death before they see the kingdom of God.”​

I'm not sure how you managed to miss all of those. Perhaps you might make a booking with your optometrist?

Idk. Perhaps @InChrist can answer you more in a bookish way.

 

[stvdv]

Yes, notwithstanding Jesus' promise in all three synoptic gospels that the Kingdom would be established on earth within the lifetime of some of his hearers (Mark 9:1, Mark 13:28, Matthew 10:23, Matthew 16:28, Matthew 24:32, Luke 9:27). That looks like a thoroughly demonstrated lemon to me ─ or do you know of some 2000 year old Levantines living in the Bronx or wherever?

Their lifetime makes more sense than in our lifetime, because usually the Masters tell us to live in the present, in the now. Forget the past, and don't worry about the future. Much more practical, people who live in the past or in the future easily develop mental problems, Masters know that, so it's not even smart to superimpose verses clearly written in their time, onto our time, IMO

 

[беспокойный путешественни]

"Science supremacy" is a weird way to phrase it in my opinion.

 

[stvdv]

Believe it or not, mostly the statements of Jesus are regarding our time.

Well, the practical statements are timeless:
1) Do not judge thy neighbor
2) Love thy neighbor as thyself
3) The Golden Rule
etc

 

[blü 2]

Believe it or not, mostly the statements of Jesus are regarding our time.

No, they're not. The Greek is as unambiguous as the English.

Jesus said the Son of Man would establish the Kingdom on earth in the lifetime of some of his hearers. No one in the NT contradicts him, and Paul and John are merely silent on the point.

Either that, or produce those still-living 2000 year old Levantines who heard Jesus speaking.

 

[stvdv]

"Science supremacy" is a weird way to phrase it in my opinion.

I phrased it that way because:
Some Religious people believe their Religion is Superior than other Religion, and also Superior than Science

Similarly, Scientists could believe that their Science is Superior than Religious Scriptures

This thread is about Supremacy, Hence:
Religious Supremacy
Science Supremacy

I hope this clarifies it

 

[Jimmy]

Well, the practical statements are timeless:
1) Do not judge thy neighbor
2) Love thy neighbor as thyself
3) The Golden Rule
etc

I think the whole book is about our time, especially the “Jesus” parts. I also think that’s what a lot of Christians think. Don’t forget, I believe the world began in 1979.

 

[blü 2]

Idk. Perhaps @InChrist can answer you more in a bookish way.

It's your claim. It seems to me it's up to you to maintain it, rather than to claim someone else might be able to.

The words are unambiguous and found in three of the four gospels. The Kingdom would be established in the lifetime of some of Jesus' hearers.

And of course it wasn't.

 

[Jimmy]

It's your claim. It seems to me it's up to you to maintain it, rather than to claim someone else might be able to.

The words are unambiguous and found in three of the four gospels. The Kingdom would be established in the lifetime of some of Jesus' hearers.

And of course it wasn't.

Well I guess you won. The whole Bible is a farce. Thanks for enlightening me.

 

[Jimmy]

You must be using an unusual edition of the NT. Mine (RSV) says, for instance, and with emphasis added ─

Mark 9:1 And he said to them, “Truly, I say to you, there are some standing here who will not taste death before they see that the kingdom of God has come with power.”​

​

Mark 13:28 “From the fig tree learn its lesson: as soon as its branch becomes tender and puts forth its leaves, you know that summer is near. 29 So also, when you see these things taking place, you know that he is near, at the very gates. 30 Truly, I say to you, this generation will not pass away before all these things take place.​

​

Matthew 10:23 When you are persecuted in one place, flee to another. Truly I tell you, you will not finish going through the towns of Israel before the Son of man comes.​

​

Matthew 16:28 Truly, I say to you, there are some standing here who will not taste death before they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom."​

​

Matthew 24:32 “From the fig tree learn its lesson: as soon as its branch becomes tender and puts forth its leaves, you know that summer is near. 33 So also, when you see all these things, you know that he is near, at the very gates. 34 Truly, I say to you, this generation will not pass away till all these things take place.​

​

Luke 9:27 But I tell you truly, there are some standing here who will not taste death before they see the kingdom of God.”​

I'm not sure how you managed to miss all of those. Perhaps you might make a booking with your optometrist?

Maybe this will help you understand the Christians viewpoint.

Christians believe Jesus will return despite some interpretations suggesting his return would be within the lifetime of the original disciples because they interpret the biblical passages about his return as referring to a future event, not necessarily a near one, and focus on the overall message of hope and promise that Jesus's eventual return signifies, rather than the exact timing

 

[stvdv]

It's your claim. It seems to me it's up to you to maintain it, rather than to claim someone else might be able to.

The words are unambiguous and found in three of the four gospels. The Kingdom would be established in the lifetime of some of Jesus' hearers.

We don't know what was meant by "Kingdom", it could be literally, temporarily, figuratively, Spiritually or any combination or ...

Humans think in terms of worldly kingdom, but don't forget Jesus, as a Prophet, focused much more on the Spiritual world, see all the figurative stories

And of course it wasn't.

Hence we don't no if "it wasn't"

 

[Jimmy]

You must be using an unusual edition of the NT. Mine (RSV) says, for instance, and with emphasis added ─

Mark 9:1 And he said to them, “Truly, I say to you, there are some standing here who will not taste death before they see that the kingdom of God has come with power.”​

​

Mark 13:28 “From the fig tree learn its lesson: as soon as its branch becomes tender and puts forth its leaves, you know that summer is near. 29 So also, when you see these things taking place, you know that he is near, at the very gates. 30 Truly, I say to you, this generation will not pass away before all these things take place.​

​

Matthew 10:23 When you are persecuted in one place, flee to another. Truly I tell you, you will not finish going through the towns of Israel before the Son of man comes.​

​

Matthew 16:28 Truly, I say to you, there are some standing here who will not taste death before they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom."​

​

Matthew 24:32 “From the fig tree learn its lesson: as soon as its branch becomes tender and puts forth its leaves, you know that summer is near. 33 So also, when you see all these things, you know that he is near, at the very gates. 34 Truly, I say to you, this generation will not pass away till all these things take place.​

​

Luke 9:27 But I tell you truly, there are some standing here who will not taste death before they see the kingdom of God.”​

I'm not sure how you managed to miss all of those. Perhaps you might make a booking with your optometrist?

Oh also I think Jesus was referring to his first resurrection.

 

[blü 2]

Well I guess you won. The whole Bible is a farce. Thanks for enlightening me.

You speak as though I'm somehow at fault for pointing to the actual text of the NT. All ancient texts are records of their time and place and the thinking of their authors.

The NT is a set of documents written, it appears, in the case of Paul, between 50 CE and c. 57 CE (say in the third decade after the traditional date of Jesus' death), and in the case of the gospels, Mark not earlier than 75 CE (more than four decades after) through to John, in the 90s CE. The actual identity of the various authors is unknown, despite the names given in an attributive manner to the gospels. None of them ever met a historical Jesus, so all of them were dealing with hearsay, tradition, possibly some other writings that are lost, and in the case of the gospels after Mark, with the gospels written earlier. They are also all written in the Greek of their time and place, the administrative language of the Roman Empire in the East, rather than the local Semitic.

I commend the approach that historians take to any historical document ─ what, when, where, who, why?

 

[Jimmy]

You speak as though I'm somehow at fault for pointing to the actual text of the NT. All ancient texts are records of their time and place and the thinking of their authors.

The NT is a set of documents written, it appears, in the case of Paul, between 50 CE and c. 57 CE (say in the third decade after the traditional date of Jesus' death), and in the case of the gospels, Mark not earlier than 75 CE (more than four decades after) through to John, in the 90s CE. The actual identity of the various authors is unknown, despite the names given in an attributive manner to the gospels. None of them ever met a historical Jesus, so all of them were dealing with hearsay, tradition, possibly some other writings that are lost, and in the case of the gospels after Mark, with the gospels written earlier. They are also all written in the Greek of their time and place, the administrative language of the Roman Empire in the East, rather than the

I commend the approach that historians take to any historical document ─ what, when, where, who, why?

Paul wrote 17 years after Jesus died. Cool. Didn’t know that.