To Punish, or Not to Punish

[VoidCat]

Hopefully. My daughter might have tried it again (she was the tiger in our tank) - I think the risk of her doing it again vs the reinforcement was important.

Obviously, I could be wrong but she certainly has no "bad memories" of our love correction.

Here's a serious thought. If the kid is too young to understand the consequences of their actions you don't hit them. If they are old enough to understand the consequences of their actions then there is no reason to hit them when you can explain what was wrong maybe provide redirection positive or negative but there is no reason to hit. You dont hit a dog, you don't hit your wife why then should we hit those who are most vurnerable those whose bodies ain't even fully developed and can easily be bruised and they are able to feel more pain than an adult's? To me spanking is an uncreative style of parenting. A good rule of thumb for parenting(that may have exceptions due to developmental differences) is if you wouldn't do said thing to an adult don't do it to a child. If it would harm an adult it'll likely harm a child who isn't as developed.

I don't see why resort to pain when there are 100s of other ways to deal with such situations.

 

[VoidCat]

@KenS
Im not a parent. But I've read numerous parenting books, am going for a degree in early childhood education, and have helped my grandma with her foster kids numerous times.

There are many many ways of disciplining children and every parenting book I've read states that hitting a child can be detrimental and that there's other methods of discipline. 100s even. Takes more creativity and respect for a child but there's usually no reason to hit a child unless you lack the education for other methods of discpline

 

[The Hammer]

Hopefully. My daughter might have tried it again (she was the tiger in our tank) - I think the risk of her doing it again vs the reinforcement was important.

Obviously, I could be wrong but she certainly has no "bad memories" of our love correction.

None that she Trusts you to talk about.

I didn't talk to my parents about stuff either because of their, "love corrections". I didn't trust they had my well-being in mind because of it.

 

[The Hammer]

 

[Sgt. Pepper]

Many an abuser justifies what they do the exact same way.

Son it's ok that I hit you, it's out of love, and you didn't listen the first time

Which can eventually turn into them thinking hitting out of love is ok.

I know I hit my wife, but she didn't listen the first time, I love her

"The abuse of spanking isn’t just in the act of hitting a child. In fact, perhaps the most abusive and damaging aspect of spanking is in the way it teaches children that someone can hurt you like that, and it can be rightly called love."

What You Teach Your Kids When You Hit Them

I've reported other parents to the police after I saw them smack their child in a public business. These parents whined about how they weren't hitting their children, but rather "disciplining" them by spanking them. A couple of the parents bellowed about how they are Christian and how they believe in "spare the rod, spoil the child," but luckily, the police officer didn't fall for such a pathetic excuse. As far as I'm concerned, there's absolutely no excuse for hitting a child and then hiding behind the biblical guise of disciplining a child. I absolutely refuse to turn a blind eye to an adult hitting a child. I know a few Christian parents who have the nerve to tell their children that hitting other people is wrong, but then they will hit their children and call it discipline done out of love. Such hypocrites, IMO.

 

[Kenny]

Here's a serious thought. If the kid is too young to understand the consequences of their actions you don't hit them. If they are old enough to understand the consequences of their actions then there is no reason to hit them when you can explain what was wrong maybe provide redirection positive or negative but there is no reason to hit. You dont hit a dog, you don't hit your wife why then should we hit those who are most vurnerable those whose bodies ain't even fully developed and can easily be bruised and they are able to feel more pain than an adult's? To me spanking is an uncreative style of parenting. A good rule of thumb for parenting(that may have exceptions due to developmental differences) is if you wouldn't do said thing to an adult don't do it to a child. If it would harm an adult it'll likely harm a child who isn't as developed.

I don't see why resort to pain when there are 100s of other ways to deal with such situations.

Ray, I think it really depends on ones approach.

I never suggested "hitting" and then extrapolating it to wives and dogs. I don't subscribe to hitting. Here the question would be how a correction would be viewed as "hitting".

Remembering when my I said to my wife, "I don't like fighting with you". She said, "We aren't 'fighting'".

The interpretation is "fighting" for her was literal fists as displayed with her parents at each other's throats. I was talking about arguing which my parents did.

Same word but a different world view.

Correction is not hitting.

With a child one could say, "you can't drive the car for 1 month"... you can't say that to your wife. So we really can't equate the two.

 

[VoidCat]

Ray, I think it really depends on ones approach.

I never suggested "hitting" and then extrapolating it to wives and dogs. I don't subscribe to hitting. Here the question would be how a correction would be viewed as "hitting".

Remembering when my I said to my wife, "I don't like fighting with you". She said, "We aren't 'fighting'".

The interpretation is "fighting" for her was literal fists as displayed with her parents at each other's throats. I was talking about arguing which my parents did.

Same word but a different world view.

Correction is not hitting.

With a child one could say, "you can't drive the car for 1 month"... you can't say that to your wife. So we really can't equate the two.

Spanking your child is hitting tho.

 

[syo]

I don't punish.

 

[Kenny]

@KenS
Im not a parent. But I've read numerous parenting books, am going for a degree in early childhood education, and have helped my grandma with her foster kids numerous times.

There are many many ways of disciplining children and every parenting book I've read states that hitting a child can be detrimental and that there's other methods of discipline. 100s even. Takes more creativity and respect for a child but there's usually no reason to hit a child unless you lack the education for other methods of discpline

Having successfully raise three children, perhaps my experience has value? They are loving, their own children are growing healthy and well balanced.

Looking at today's youth, have we digressed or created a better future?

Contentious study says spanking may benefit children

https://www.amazon.com/New-Strong-Willed-Child-James-Dobson/dp/141439134X

might be a good read.

 

[Kenny]

None that she Trusts you to talk about.

I didn't talk to my parents about stuff either because of their, "love corrections". I didn't trust they had my well-being in mind because of it.

Don't know what experiences you had or how they did it. My children had open communication, trusted us, and loved their childhood.

Hopefully you learned a better way for your children.

Our children continued our tradition so it must have been good in their sight.

 

[Sgt. Pepper]

Having successfully raise three children, perhaps my experience has value? They are loving, their own children are growing healthy and well balanced.

Looking at today's youth, have we digressed or created a better future?

Contentious study says spanking may benefit children

https://www.amazon.com/New-Strong-Willed-Child-James-Dobson/dp/141439134X

might be a good read.

Both of the sources you cited are Christian-based, and therefore should be considered biased towards the biblical teaching of "spare the rod, spoil the child." Sorry Ken, but I won't accept any Christian-based "studies" that suggest hitting a child.

 

[Kenny]

Both of the sources you cited are Christian-based, and therefore should be considered biased towards Christian teachings about "sparing the rod."

yet one is based on statistics. And the other a psychologist.

Can I also say your sources are secular based and therefore be considered biased toward "sparing the rod"? Or is it a one way street.

 

[The Hammer]

Having successfully raise three children, perhaps my experience has value? They are loving, their own children are growing healthy and well balanced.

Looking at today's youth, have we digressed or created a better future?

Contentious study says spanking may benefit children

https://www.amazon.com/New-Strong-Willed-Child-James-Dobson/dp/141439134X

might be a good read.

The evidence is still on my side: The Effect of Spanking on the Brain


Edited: Physical punishment of children: lessons from 20 years of research

 

[Sgt. Pepper]

The evidence is still on my side: The Effect of Spanking on the Brain

Edited: Physical punishment of children: lessons from 20 years of research

I will continue to trust these sources rather than a Bible-based justification of hitting children as a form of discipline. I never raised a hand against any of my children to discipline them, so I know for a fact that hitting children as a form of discipline isn't necessary.

 

[The Hammer]

Also adding that up until very recently, I was very much on board with corporal punishment.

But the more reading I do on others research, the more I've softened my approach and heart.

 

[Sgt. Pepper]

Spanking your child is hitting tho.

Yes, it is, and I don't care how Christians (or other people) sugarcoat the excuses of why they think it's OK to hit a child.

 

[Sand Dancer]

I'm a stay-at-home mother of multiple aged children, and during all the years raising them, my husband and I never spanked them, to the absolute disapproval of my Christian in-laws and other Christians in our church. My husband and I were criticized and berated by other Christians for "sparing the rod," and we were repeatedly told that our children would be uncontrollable and they would grow up rebellious and turn against God. Well, all the doom and gloom predictions of not physically hitting my children in order to discipline them never came to pass. My children aren't, by any means, perfect, but they're good kids who are compassionate and hard-working young people. They respect my husband and me, as well as each other and other people. They're also spiritual and go to church when they can. I grew up in an extremely abusive home, and I was dead-determined not to be abusive like that towards my own children.

My husband and I had a long discussion about how to discipline our oldest son (now 28) when he was a toddler. We decided that we'd use positive reinforcement instead of spanking him to change his behavior. We continued to use positive reinforcement to teach our children while they were growing up. We still use it on occasion with our teenage daughters and sometimes with our older children, who are young adults. We remind our kids that we respect each other and that we need to listen to each other without getting angry. It works every time. I don't care what the Bible says about "sparing the rod," because my family is living proof that that's hogwash.

Some of our Christian friends told us to use a large glue stick on our son, which we tried twice before chucking it. It was too stressful. I cried too. It left little welts on his bottom (he was about 8 or 9, not a baby, but still). How horrible. I threw them away. Time outs are what we used before and after that short time with the "rod."

 

[Kenny]

The evidence is still on my side: The Effect of Spanking on the Brain


Edited: Physical punishment of children: lessons from 20 years of research

LOL... I think this is a no win. I think it can be good (if done right) and bad (if not done right)
"
Yet some researchers remain skeptical. Studies suggest, for instance, that the effects of spanking can differ depending on the circumstances. Two studies have found no associations between spanking and mental health problems among kids who were spanked less than once or twice a month; other research has shown that spanking has much less of a negative effect on preschool kids than on infants and adolescents. So the conclusion from the meta-analysis that spanking itself is dangerous might be overly simplistic. “I think it's irresponsible to make exclusive statements one way or another,” says Christopher Ferguson, a psychologist at Stetson University in Florida.

New Study Finds Spanking Is Good for Kids - The New American

How about "Let love rule and do the best you can?"

 

[Aštra’el]

How about "Let love rule and do the best you can?"

Absolutely. My parents were great role models and loved my siblings and I with every fabric of their being. Yet, even they knew there were situations that warranted physical punishment. Looking back, I understand it, and I wouldn’t change a thing.

 

[Kenny]

Absolutely. My parents were great role models and loved my siblings and I with every fabric of their being. Yet, even they knew there were situations that warranted physical punishment. Looking back, I understand it, and I wouldn’t change a thing.

That is so wonderful!!!

I think, basically, this is what happened. I remember the "revolution" of Don't Spank by Dr. Spoke. It was the craze of that day (1989)

Because he was a "Dr." - everyone followed suit. (The result are the snowflakes of today that need a safe space in college).

Soon, it started replicating college educators had the "don't spank" engine spewing out more and more Dr.'s indoctrinated in their way of thinking.

And yet.... as you noted, parents really have a better education when love is their modus of operandi.




Happy for you! I was the same.