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To The Jesus Myth Theorist

dyanaprajna2011

Dharmapala
Not only that

the fact biblical jesus is so different from historical jesus, speaks volumes of the mythical content we have to work with

That's one of the main reasons why I stopped believing he was a historical person to begin with. Even after I left Christianity, even after I converted to Buddhism, I still continued to believe that there was a Jesus of Nazareth who actually existed, and was in some way a Jewish teacher, but the Bible stories about him were just myths. But after coming to the realization that, even if he did exist, that Christianity basically turned him into a myth, by taking a historical Jewish teacher, and adding to him myths from various surrounding pagan religions, I seen no reason to accept him as historical fact, and relegated him to the realm of myth along with all the others that had their myths added to him. The fact is I still think that there's a decent possibility that he did exist, but I simply find no reason to accept it, as it seems that once I do, I'd be lambasted into accepting the myths.
 

outhouse

Atheistically
That's one of the main reasons why I stopped believing he was a historical person to begin with. Even after I left Christianity, even after I converted to Buddhism, I still continued to believe that there was a Jesus of Nazareth who actually existed, and was in some way a Jewish teacher, but the Bible stories about him were just myths. But after coming to the realization that, even if he did exist, that Christianity basically turned him into a myth, by taking a historical Jewish teacher, and adding to him myths from various surrounding pagan religions, I seen no reason to accept him as historical fact, and relegated him to the realm of myth along with all the others that had their myths added to him. The fact is I still think that there's a decent possibility that he did exist, but I simply find no reason to accept it, as it seems that once I do, I'd be lambasted into accepting the myths.

I just follow that there was a traveling poor peasant teacher/healer who was baptized by John that wanted to reform judaism due to roman corruption, he fought against the outragious taxation by carrying nothing and having no money. Romans put him to death on a cross. later writers invented biblical jesus mythology from this historical person.


If we look at mythology through the eyes of valid known history and especially judaism, there is often a core of truth at the center of most mythical legends.
 

LegionOnomaMoi

Veteran Member
Premium Member
I've already read Schweitzer thank you very much.
So why call the myth theory a conspiracy theory? Certain versions may qualify, but most don't. Most just rely on throwing out the evidence as completely ahistorical. That's not a conspiracy. Wrong? Yes. Conspiracy? No.
 

fallingblood

Agnostic Theist
No wthats all a matter of perspective isnt it.

the jewish government in place fell, and was never seen again.

A new government had taken over with its own form of worship and theology thats stil in place today based on the Pharisees.

It was in fact crumbling in jesus time, and fell during the temple and rebuilt by the Pharisees.
Give me some scholars, or historians who agree with that. I do prefer actual scholars/historians, and books or journals.
The split started in jesus time though and that is the real point. A sect of judaism started traveling away from judaism due to roman corruption.
No, what we have is just one more group of Jews. It was just one more sect of Jews. They did not try to split off from Judaism. And they certainly weren't the only sect of Jews who distanced themselves from the Temple. But they remained a part of Judaism. Simply there is no sign that Judaism was crumbling. It may have been changing to a point, but that really was all.
False

Paul started christianity, not jesus

jesus started a division in judaism, Paul is the one who started mythical christ.

Paul didnt know jesus or the early church at all !!!! when he made his conversion.

For some reason a head hunter for the Sadducees while on a quest to murder more of this radical sect, MAGICALLY gains all of this knowledge on jesus and becomes a follower by the time he hits Damascus and is awaiting new directions from the lord's followers.

Paul created christianity not based on teachings from jesus or disciples but by imagination from his own accounts.
Actually, it is true. Paul didn't create Christianity. That is nothing more that ancient polemic that is based on poor research and biases. Paul was not a Christian. Christianity did not exist, nor do we even hear about it, until after Paul is dead. During the time of Paul, they weren't even called Christians. So no, Paul did not create Christianity. According to Paul, and any other source, Paul was a Jew.

Paul did not create a mythical Christ. Everything was there in place when Paul started. We can be fairly certain that what the Jerusalem church was teaching about Jesus was similar to what Paul was teaching. And the focus was on the risen Jesus. That was the common idea. And no, Jesus didn't start a division. He, like many other Jews, was participating within interJewish dialogue. That was extremely common back then. He may have been responsible for a new sect, but that hardly is creating a division.

And yes, Paul knew the early church. To suggest otherwise is simply foolish. If he didn't know the early church, who was he persecuting? And who did he later speak to?

There is no suggestion Paul murdered anyone, or that Paul was a head hunter for the Sadducees. If you want to continue claiming such, put up some sources.

You're theory about Paul is just as bad as the Jesus myth people. There similarity being that neither rest on any serious scholarship, are extremely biased, and only show a blind prejudice, as well as a complete ignorance on the subject. Now, if I'm wrong, put up some scholars or historians who agree with you. And when I say that, I mean in this century. Preferably in the latter half of this century. As in, nothing extremely outdated.
 

outhouse

Atheistically
Give me some scholars, or historians who agree with that. I do prefer actual scholars/historians, and books or journals.


I dont think anyone will deny that the temple fell.

I dont think anyone will argue the Sadducees who ran the temple and the money and banking system amounting to the jewish governement was gone after the fall of the temple.

I dont think anyone argues the Pharisees picked up the pieces afterwrads
 

outhouse

Atheistically
No, what we have is just one more group of Jews. It was just one more sect of Jews. They did not try to split off from Judaism. And they certainly weren't the only sect of Jews who distanced themselves from the Temple. But they remained a part of Judaism. Simply there is no sign that Judaism was crumbling. It may have been changing to a point, but that really was all.

none the less, it was a split within judaism, and it was small sect at that while jesus was alive.

Jesus wanted to reform judaism and his sect wanted away from the mainstream corrupted judaism the temple offered.
 

outhouse

Atheistically
And yes, Paul knew the early church. To suggest otherwise is simply foolish. If he didn't know the early church, who was he persecuting?

only through oral tradition, yet he lied about that and stated he only knew about it from the ghost of jesus.


the one meeting he had, he was sent packing asked to never return ever
 

outhouse

Atheistically
There is no suggestion Paul murdered anyone, or that Paul was a head hunter for the Sadducees.


look up a word called persecuting.


then ask youself who would be out to murder christians?
 

fallingblood

Agnostic Theist
I dont think anyone will deny that the temple fell.

I dont think anyone will argue the Sadducees who ran the temple and the money and banking system amounting to the jewish governement was gone after the fall of the temple.

I dont think anyone argues the Pharisees picked up the pieces afterwrads

If you can't provide sources, that's fine, just say so. I don't need excuses. Also, it would be nice if you didn't make a plethora of different responses to me, as it simply clutters things up. Not to mention, I won't address them until you can supply some sources. If you can't, then I don't think you have a case.
 

CynthiaCypher

Well-Known Member
none the less, it was a split within judaism, and it was small sect at that while jesus was alive.

Jesus wanted to reform judaism and his sect wanted away from the mainstream corrupted judaism the temple offered.

Can you provide any evidence that Jesus was indeed a reformist?
 

fallingblood

Agnostic Theist
These people are not Schweitzer.

Nor are they even remotely informed. I personally believe that the vast majority of people who deny Jesus existed (and I'm talking more along of the Zeitgeist type arguments), are proposing nothing more than a conspiracy theory. And it turns into a conspiracy theory around Paul as well.

However, there are some that simply don't care. They reject Jesus, and that is just that. Those people, I wouldn't say are conspiracy theorists. They generally are more agnostic to the idea, and simply just don't care.
 

CynthiaCypher

Well-Known Member
Nor are they even remotely informed. I personally believe that the vast majority of people who deny Jesus existed (and I'm talking more along of the Zeitgeist type arguments), are proposing nothing more than a conspiracy theory. And it turns into a conspiracy theory around Paul as well.

However, there are some that simply don't care. They reject Jesus, and that is just that. Those people, I wouldn't say are conspiracy theorists. They generally are more agnostic to the idea, and simply just don't care.

I am getting that too, They believe that Paul created this elaborate religion just out of thin air. He must have been the L.Ron Hubbard of his time and greater since he got Josephus and others in on it.
 

fallingblood

Agnostic Theist
I am getting that too, They believe that Paul created this elaborate religion just out of thin air. He must have been the L.Ron Hubbard of his time and greater since he got Josephus and others in on it.

And at the same time, did not even profit from such a creation. Instead, he was beaten, and probably eventually killed. Which is sad if he was just creating an elaborate religion, as he obviously didn't do it right. I know if I was going to try, I'd make sure it was entertaining, and would make me big money. I would also post it on Wikipedia.
 

CynthiaCypher

Well-Known Member
And at the same time, did not even profit from such a creation. Instead, he was beaten, and probably eventually killed. Which is sad if he was just creating an elaborate religion, as he obviously didn't do it right. I know if I was going to try, I'd make sure it was entertaining, and would make me big money. I would also post it on Wikipedia.

And with a intellect like Paul's you would definitely try not to be killed or embarrass yourself. I mean his enemies could have just embarrassed him by telling everyone he made it all up.

He believed the things he was preaching.
 
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