Transgender questions

[Shadow Wolf]

There's an anthropological tendency to focus more on privacy, more, in your country.
Here not. What's privacy? We don't even an Italian word for that. I recall this day, when there was a divorce trial and the doors of the courtroom were astoundingly open.
And from the corridor you could hear the divorcing wife speaking out loud of her sex life in detail, to convince the judge that the husband was not a performing spouse.
I burst out laughing.

Courts in America are public as a Constitutional right.

 

[Valjean]

Not

Courts in America are public as a Constitutional right.

Not since the Patriot Act.

 

[Valjean]

For example, two married gay men adopt a child. They are the adoptive parents.
But that child has a biological father and a biological mother.

There are biological parents, legal parents, and various kinds of de facto parents.

 

[Estro Felino]

There are biological parents, legal parents, and various kinds of de facto parents.

I presented a case. We are speaking of two biological parents who are alive and want to take care of their sons.
The Law cannot swap the roles of the two biological parents, saying that the father is the mother and vice-versa.

A heterosexual couple could do that too. By swapping their own clothes.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

I presented a case. We are speaking of two biological parents who are alive and want to take care of their sons.
The Law cannot swap the roles of the two biological parents, saying that the father is the mother and vice-versa.

Correct. It is not for the law to determine biology, nor is it for the law to determine the role or title any individual in any scenario wishes to use.

A heterosexual couple could do that too. By swapping their own clothes.

Wait... So whether or not someone is a father or mother is determined by clothing?

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Not

Not since the Patriot Act.

The Sixth Amendment still stands.
And let's not add to Estro's confusion. It's about as off and bad as these guys I picked up from Sweden and the UAE who both thought I'm from Texas based on how I talk (I sound more north and lack any sort of Southern drawl).

 

[Estro Felino]

Wait... So whether or not someone is a father or mother is determined by clothing?

According to that couple, yes.
In my opinion, no.
I will always say that that transman is the mother. Not the father.
Mothers can't be fathers.
That is a person who is perfectly aligned with their endocrine and sexual system.

It is unfair towards those trans people who had to undergo stressing and painful operations to make their body align with their psyche.

 

[Colt]

I'm known to post what some see as controversial things.... But inquiring minds want to know.
If you want others to understand, then be ready to tolerate questions.

If a person fully transitions, MtF, do they seek a male or female partner?

If a person doesn't fully transition, MtF, do they seek a male or female partner?

If a person fully transitions, FtM, do they seek a male or female partner?

If a person doesn't fully transition, FtM for do they seek a male or female partner?

It’s not a science. The 2 trans people that I know personally differ. One is a man who became a women in order to be a lesbian to be with women. The other is a female who became a man to be with females.

There is also the question of a lesbian who prefers a women that became a man as a partner? They prefer trans partners.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

According to that couple, yes.

No, that's not true. They are father and mother because of the gender roles they identify with. It has nothing to do with their clothing.

In my opinion, no.
I will always say that that transman is the mother. Not the father.

Then you're just wrong. That trans man is fulfilling the role of father and uses that label.

Mothers can't be fathers.

A trans woman can be a mother and a trans man can be a father.

That is a person who is perfectly aligned with their endocrine and sexual system.

Which has literally nothing to do with the definition or general use of the terms mother and father.

So, if you ever meet anyone who has an adopted child, would you refuse to call those people that child's mother or father?

It is unfair towards those trans people who had to undergo stressing and painful operations to make their body align with their psyche.

How is it unfair to them?

 

[Estro Felino]

How is it unfair to them?

Give me a definition of transsexuality I can rely on in the debate.
What is transsexuality to you?

 

[ImmortalFlame]

Give me a definition of transsexuality I can rely on in the debate.
What is transsexuality to you?

Firstly, it's transgender, not transsexual.

Secondly, a trans person is a person who identifies as a gender other than the biological one they were assigned at birth.

Can you answer my other questions? If you met a couple who adopted a child, would you refuse to refer to the couple as either the child's mother or father?

 

[Estro Felino]

Firstly, it's transgender, not transsexual.
Secondly, a trans person is a person who identifies as a gender other than the biological one they were assigned at birth.
Can you answer my other questions? If you met a couple who adopted a child, would you refuse to refer to the couple as either the child's mother or father?

No, I would never refuse to do that. I would use the terms mother and father. But that's a completely different situation.

As for your definition, someday Mike Tyson can say they identify as a woman, and that makes him a transwoman?

 

[ImmortalFlame]

No, I would never refuse to do that. I would use the terms mother and father. But that's a completely different situation.

But by doing so you are acknowledging that whether or not someone should be referred to as a mother or a father has literally nothing to do with the role they played in the birth of that child.

So, what does determine it?

As for your definition, someday Mike Tyson can say they identify as a woman, and that makes him a transwoman?

Yes.

Although it's important to note that "saying you identify" as something is different to ACTUALLY identifying as something. But, if Mike Tyson genuinely identified as a woman, they would be a woman.

 

[PoetPhilosopher]

I haven't read this whole thread, but I thought the subject of transitioning and lesbianism came up, if I recall (and if it wasn't another thread), and I can't help but feel if such questions are actually ones about convenience, like asking....

"Why transition from male to female if your chances will be worse with your preferred gender (women) you date upon transitioning? Should you prefer women."

And I actually have some personal experience on the matter, and would say that the chances aren't really worse. A lot of women are bi whether they are outward about it at all or not, and a lot of women feel a bit more comfortable (at times) around other women or even just non-masculine personalities in general, sharing things with them they probably wouldn't normally share with cis men - even in cases when they are interested in that other woman or non-masculine personality romantically.

Then add to that that when it comes to things like online dating, the dating pool is saturated with men, and has fewer women. And I'd say that, in this day and age, things run the potential to be about equal when it comes to finding a partner.

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

I rely on biology.
During sex, there is always a passive part (which is feminine) and an active part (which is masculine).
If there were not such a pattern, we wouldn't be such an overpopulated world...
I mean ...it means that heterosexual intercourse is extremely predominant.

That said, I totally disagree with the drift that the US is going through: in the US gender has become a social construct based upon stereotypes.
In my country gender is based upon sex and biology.

So, there are no trans people in Italy?

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

Since I brought up the topic of lesbians here, I would like to know why heterosexual men are so obsessed with lesbians.
I will never understand that: lesbians are ciswomen who are into vagina havers (ciswomen), so they will never be interested in them.

Genital preferences do matter.

Male arousal, studies find, is strongly visual, and when men engage in sexual activity or even anticipate it, brain structures once thought to have little connection to sex spring into action. The same brain regions, however, remain relatively quiet when women are aroused. Because they are visual, watching two women engaging in sexual activities they enjoy, they are much more likely to be aroused.

 

[Estro Felino]

Male arousal, studies find, is strongly visual, and when men engage in sexual activity or even anticipate it, brain structures once thought to have little connection to sex spring into action. The same brain regions, however, remain relatively quiet when women are aroused. Because they are visual, watching two women engaging in sexual activities they enjoy, they are much more likely to be aroused.

I think heterosexual males are aroused by what they can't have.
And enjoy being rejected.
Because there are lots of nymphos out there, who would literally sleep with anyone. But men tend to be scared by them and flee.

Men are the most complex creatures on Earth.

 

[Father Heathen]

I think heterosexual males are aroused by what they can't have.
And enjoy being rejected.
Because there are lots of nymphos out there, who would literally sleep with anyone. But men tend to be scared by them and flee.

Men are the most complex creatures on Earth.

These ***-pulls are getting tiresome.

 

[Estro Felino]

These ***-pulls are getting tiresome.

This is a very enlightening video.

 

[Father Heathen]

This is a very enlightening video.