"Trump will be the Nominee and the GOP (Unfortunately) will be Fine"

[Shadow Wolf]

Ahem....he didn't close GITMO, & he initially ran in opposition to gay marriage.

Obama just submitted a plan to close it, but it isn't predicted to go through. Gay marriage is something he flipped around on a few times.

And this health care thing isn't going too well.

It's not ideal, but it's going pretty good for many us - far, far, far better than what we had before.

 

[Revoltingest]

Obama just submitted a plan to close it, but it isn't predicted to go through. Gay marriage is something he flipped around on a few times.

It's not ideal, but it's going pretty good for many us - far, far, far better than what we had before.

He certainly tried.

This very month.....but he's been in office nearly 2 full terms.

But eventually speared headed legislation in favor.

After standing in the way.
I do give him credit for "evolving" to being more libertarian....finally.

Tell that to the 8 million people who use the market place.

I know people whose costs have gone up, while coverage has gone down.
And coping with the massive & inept bureaucracy has been fun.

Started by who, again?

Bush & Congress.
Does the fact that he didn't start the wars excuse his continuing them,
when all results were pointing towards its being a continuing waste?
He can't blame Bush forever.

Btw, I think his greatest achievement is not invading Iran.
To not do something, thereby avoiding a disaster, is so often overlooked a great thing.
I don't fathom why Dems, with their failure to praise, disrespect him regarding this.

 

[tytlyf]

The only person Trump scares are the republican establishment elites who rely on government freebies. MIC, Oil, etc.(People who spend hundreds of millions buying up the republican party) Rush has admitted that they would sabotage Trump if he won the nomination. Fox and Rush are trying their darndest to make people hate him, but that's because they work for the establishment.

 

[Quetzal]

This very month.....but he's been in office nearly 2 full terms.

But he is acting on his political platform. Just because it wasn't fast enough for you is irrelevant.

After standing in the way.
I do give him credit for "evolving" to being more libertarian....finally.

Again, let his action and evolution here speak louder than biased words.

I know people whose costs have gone up, while coverage has gone down.

And I know folks who now have insurance who never had it before. I guess we call this one a draw.

Bush & Congress.
Does the fact that he didn't start the wars excuse his continuing them,
when all results were pointing towards its being a continuing waste?
He can't blame Bush forever.

And he has reduced our presence there by a sizable margin. In fact, isn't the only thing left over there the security force involved in training? Sounds like we are well on our way to a conclusion. Can't blame Obama forever.

 

[Revoltingest]

But he is acting on his political platform. Just because it wasn't fast enough for you is irrelevant.

It's relevant to me.

And I know folks who now have insurance who never had it before. I guess we call this one a draw.

Works for me!

And he has reduced our presence there by a sizable margin. In fact, isn't the only thing left over there the security force involved in training? Sounds like we are well on our way to a conclusion. Can't blame Obama forever.

Remember that I'm an extremist.
Were I prez, I'd have started pulling out my first day in office.

 

[Quetzal]

It's relevant to me.

...FINE! I wish he had done it sooner too.

Remember that I'm an extremist.
Were I prez, I'd have started pulling out my first day in office.

I can't remember what I had for breakfast, so I honestly don't remember what his immediate actions were.

 

[metis]

Not to derail the thread, but there are some fallacies believed by some in regards to the ACA, so let me quote this dealing with the CBO analyses:

The 2011 comprehensive CBO estimate projected a net deficit reduction of more than $200 billion during the 2012–2021 period: it calculated the law would result in $604 billion in total outlays offset by $813 billion in total receipts, resulting in a $210 billion net reduction in the deficit.

The CBO reported in June 2015 that repeal of the ACA would increase the deficit between $137 billion and $353 billion over the 2016-2025 period in total, depending on the impact of macroeconomic feedback effects. In other words, ACA is a deficit reducer, as its repeal would raise the deficit. CBO also reported that repeal of ACA would likely raise economic output, mainly by boosting the supply of labor as low-income persons would have more incentive to work without healthcare coverage provided by ACA.-- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patie...BO_estimates_of_revenue_and_impact_on_deficit

 

[freethinker44]

If that person is Trump then we need to begin to accept the fact that this country is full of people who are just like him. Not a very comforting thought at all.

I wouldn't assume that people are just like Trump. I think confirmation bias is a big factor in politician popularity. So I think a lot of people admire a specific attribute of a candidate and then project their own values on to them.

 

[Revoltingest]

I can't remember what I had for breakfast, so I honestly don't remember what his immediate actions were.

He immediately continued the Bush agenda.
I know.....yuck!

 

[Quetzal]

He immediately continued the Bush agenda.
I know.....yuck!

Well, maybe if Trump waddles his way into the Oval Office, he will continue the Obama agenda.

 

[metis]

I wouldn't assume that people are just like Trump. I think confirmation bias is a big factor in politician popularity. So I think a lot of people admire a specific attribute of a candidate and then project their own values on to them.

I think this is all too often true with a great many. One unfortunate reality in American politics as so much has become a popularity contest minus serious discussion and debate on real issues, along with a "what's in it for me and a to hell with you" attitude.

 

[Skwim]

Clinton or Sanders couldn't have a better opponent to insure their win in November.

"Never mind him. I'm the one talking here!"


.​

 

[Revoltingest]

Well, maybe if Trump waddles his way into the Oval Office, he will continue the Obama agenda.

Possibly.
But I doubt Trump would be as slow as Obama, who never showed any leadership
prior to office. He was more of a consensus finder in his limited experience.
For better or worse, I'd expect Trump to be more active.

 

[metis]

Clinton or Sanders couldn't have a better opponent to insure their win in November.

​

You might think twice about betting your house on that.​

 

[Quetzal]

Possibly.
But I doubt Trump would be as slow as Obama, who never showed any leadership
prior to office. He was more of a consensus finder in his limited experience.

Let's be fair here. When an entire party says "I don't care what he says, we are not approving it", how much is really going to get done?

 

[Revoltingest]

Let's be fair here. When an entire party says "I don't care what he says, we are not approving it", how much is really going to get done?

That's a common Democratic complaint, because they feel entitled to have their way.
But if they don't meet the Pubs sufficiently half way, they're going to find opposition.
The quote strikes me as naught but bellyaching.

 

[Quetzal]

That's a common Democratic complaint, because they feel entitled to have their way.

There is a difference between compromise and straight up heel dragging due to party politics. Which is something that occurred fairly often.

 

[Revoltingest]

Clinton or Sanders couldn't have a better opponent to insure their win in November.

"Never mind him. I'm the one talking here!"


.​

Him....running against her.....

We're in for it.

 

[Skwim]

Him....running against her.....

We're in for it.

.​

 

[Laika]

I probably should worry less about Trump and more about the effects of his base of support. I am sort of resigned to the idea that he may become the Republican nominee, but after that it all gets messy. You don't know how the ability to mobilise support will play out and what the numbers would be on election day. thats unnerving.

There are two things that worry me. The first is that Trump mania represents a sustained shift towards the authoritarian right in the US and that we are slowly losing many of the "good" things about America. I worry that by a combination of christian fundamentalism and corporate propaganda we are giving up the goals of the enlightment and being pulled into a new dark age, where fear, paranioa and unreason are in control. the nightmare is a high tech society with a population that is systematically and deliberately misinformed by propaganda so they are easily manipulated by corporations and governments as passive consumers of their "products". regardless as to whether its offically a democracy or a dictatorship- the result is the same.

The second, is that the base of support he represents will become the face of America's imperial power and will be the blueprint for how the US behaves in the world. Suddenly North Korea's behaviour starts to look like a reasoned, measured and proportionate response to the long-term threat of US aggression or even that ISIL understood the depth of xenophobia beneath that mask of American political sanity. even though I live in the UK, I find the possibility frightening. I am genuinely stumped to know what I would do if Trump were in the White House as it is unlikely that "freedom and democracy" would resemble what they are now after four or eight years. It is however hard to tell if any of the candidates would reverse the trend and Sanders is a best guess, but still a long shot. we badly need American leadership to deal with Climate Change and to tackle international problems if we are to prevent a slide into an extremely grim century. otherwise, there's no where left to run if America become a police state- or even more blatently than it was under Bush and has essentially remained under Obama.

If people feel I'm exaggerating or being unfair you are welcome to say and point out where I am wrong. I don't believe Trump supporters as individuals are bad people, or that they don't have legitimate greviences, hopes and fears driving their support; but in combination the effect could be disasterous. we are sleepwalking into this and I'm not sure I'm going to like what we are about to wake up to.