Trump's Obama Conspiracy Theory

[metis]

You don't need evidence to prove what ultimately is common sense, and has already proven to never and I mean NEVER work. The Muslims coming to this country do not identify themselves as American's as a rule, and they never integrate.

That is complete unadulterated nonsense matched with pathetic bigotry.

I live in an area of the country that has the largest Middle eastern population in the U.S., many I had as students, many I've worked with, many that I've talked with at interfaith conferences, and let me tell you that what you have written is a bigoted lie. Yes, there are some who are not willing to mix in, but that typically lasts one generation. Plus, you should know that many left their old homeland for a reason.

So, in response to the above, you exhibit no "common sense" and lie about that they "never integrate". What a sack of dung that is.

 

[Mindmaster]

That is complete unadulterated nonsense matched with pathetic bigotry.

It's not bigotry when 25% of them want to kill you.

 

[Altfish]

It's not bigotry when 25% of them want to kill you.

Can you give me a source for that figure?

 

[metis]

It's not bigotry when 25% of them want to kill you.

Where did you get that figure from, plus even if we use your figure, what about the other 75%? I'll tell ya right now that you figure is nonsensical because, if it were true in my area, the body count would be staggering.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

1) Illegals First
2) Refugees First
3) There isn't any radical Islam that's trying to kill everyone!
4) Let's take away everyone's guns because there is a small chance they might prevent the mass shootings, and then we can't make more draconian laws
5) Profit!

1. Is that he's called the "Deporter in Chief?"
2. How so? It also doesn't help that US history includes a nasty bit about sending a boat load of Jewish refugees back to their deaths.
3. Blatantly wrong, as he has acknowledged radical Islam and the threat posed by terrorists. However, in his shoes, I wouldn't want to acknowledge them as Muslim...there is no way in hell I would dignify them in such a way and acknowledge them by giving them what they want, which is partly to be recognized as an Islamic state. Screw that! They're pieces of ****, they're raving lunatics, and I wouldn't even execute prisoners because they want to become martyrs.
4. He has never, not once, suggested total disarment. He has called for stricter gun laws, and anyone with half a brain can see this is clearly needed. Do not forget Orlando is at least the second mass shooting involving someone who was being watched by the FBI who was able to legally purchase their guns.
5. Welcome to Capitalism, Citizens United, and corporate control of politics. Every president that has been since I was born, starting with Reagan, put a huge emphasis on big business and profits.

 

[Mindmaster]

The fact that you have to use all of your time to fabricate a made up story instead of providing me with legitimate evidence speaks very loud volumes to how weak your argument is.

Why are you afraid to call a duck a duck? It is what it is, I'm not responsible for the situation. I just don't care to apologize for that which is obviously cruel and unreasonable. Are some Muslims harmless? Yes, a lot. But, the problem is 15-25% of them are not so that means if you go to the average Mosque a good percentage of them are dangerous to others. Should we ignore that? Is it bigoted to acknowledge it?

You know what, I don't care what people think of me. I'm not a bigot because I see cruelty and call it. I'm not a bigot because all people aren't nice and we have to deal with them appropriately, and I'm not biased because Obama is weak on this issue and trying to experiment on the public at large and I call it. This is just the whole nation-building experiment in reverse, but instead of fixing up their land we're putting them here. It doesn't work, it never did, and it never will. Please state once example where nation-building worked? This is why I am against it. This is just reverse-nation building, and we know it doesn't work. You can't take a culture that hates you and that is going away over stupid altruistic end.

Obama's assertion that it's safe to do this is simply illogical because it depends on 100% of incoming Syrian refugees to be altruistic and peaceful people to not be harmful to our country. We're just not there yet, and what if it never happens?

 

[metis]

Why are you afraid to call a duck a duck? It is what it is, I'm not responsible for the situation. I just don't care to apologize for that which is obviously cruel and unreasonable. Are some Muslims harmless? Yes, a lot. But, the problem is 15-25% of them are not so that means if you go to the average Mosque a good percentage of them are dangerous to others. Should we ignore that? Is it bigoted to acknowledge it?

You know what, I don't care what people think of me. I'm not a bigot because I see cruelty and call it. I'm not a bigot because all people aren't nice and we have to deal with them appropriately, and I'm not biased because Obama is weak on this issue and trying to experiment on the public at large and I call it. This is just the whole nation-building experiment in reverse, but instead of fixing up their land we're putting them here. It doesn't work, it never did, and it never will. Please state once example where nation-building worked? This is why I am against it. This is just reverse-nation building, and we know it doesn't work. You can't take a culture that hates you and that is going away over stupid altruistic end.

Obama's assertion that it's safe to do this is simply illogical because it depends on 100% of incoming Syrian refugees to be altruistic and peaceful people to not be harmful to our country. We're just not there yet, and what if it never happens?

Again, where did you get that 25% figure from? Link please?

 

[Mindmaster]

Where did you get that figure from, plus even if we use your figure, what about the other 75%? I'll tell ya right now that you figure is nonsensical because, if it were true in my area, the body count would be staggering.

http://www.pewforum.org/files/2013/04/worlds-muslims-religion-politics-society-full-report.pdf

Basically, the short of that is:

In this Pew Research poll from 2011: Page on pewforum.org, the percentages of Muslims that condone some level of violence in the name of Islam is about 28% and about 19% among US Muslims. Here is the full (more precise) quote: More than eight-in-ten American Muslims say suicide bombings and other forms of violence against civilian targets are never justified (81%) or rarely justified (5%) to defend Islam from its enemies. Worldwide, most Muslims also reject this type of violence, with a median of 72% saying such attacks are never justified and 10% saying they are rarely justified. Just 1% of U.S. Muslims and a median of 3% of Muslims worldwide say suicide bombings and other violence against civilian targets are often justified, while 7% of U.S. Muslims and a global median of 8% of Muslims say such attacks are sometimes justified to defend Islam.

Don't hate the messenger, and also a small percentage of people who support the radical message actually act on it. But, when they do... They do not kill just one person, usually...

 

[Acim]

Well, here he goes again:

Donald Trump seemed to repeatedly accuse President Obama on Monday of identifying with radicalized Muslims who have carried out terrorist attacks in the United States and being complicit in the mass shooting at a gay nightclub in Orlando over the weekend, the worst the country has ever seen.

"Look, we're led by a man that either is not tough, not smart, or he's got something else in mind," Trump said in a lengthy interview on Fox News early Monday morning. "And the something else in mind — you know, people can't believe it. People cannot, they cannot believe that President Obama is acting the way he acts and can't even mention the words 'radical Islamic terrorism.' There's something going on. It's inconceivable. There's something going on."...

For months, Trump has slyly suggested that the president is not Christian and has questioned his compassion toward Muslims. Years ago, Trump was a major force in calls for the president to release his birth certificate and prove that he was born in the United States. On the campaign trail, Trump has repeatedly stated as fact conspiracy theories about the president, his rivals and Muslims, often refusing to back down from his assertions even when they are proven to be false... -- https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...ent-obama-was-involved-with-orlando-shooting/

BTW, on "Morning Joe" today, former representative Joe Scarborough (R-Florida) was totally livid saying that Trump simply cannot be allowed to become president, and he says that there's no way that Ryan and McConnell should continue to endorse Trump because it puts the country and the Republican Party at stake..

What say you?

I'm trying to discern what the conspiracy theory is that is noted in this thread's title.

 

[Acim]

It's not really as you say... Let's put it into a simpler analogy.

Let's say your uncle wants to come live with you from Iowa and he is bringing his family. He beats his wife and rapes her. He has a two sons and a younger daughter as well who are innocent in the entire conflict. You know that none of the bad things would go on under your watch, but you can only be in the home for about eight hours of the day. You don't get along with the uncle at all and he hates you because you're a Democrat, but you love his wife and kids and know they are peaceable. The wife and the kids will never testify against the uncle and they won't move in without him due to fact that they love him. Do you let the uncle move in with his family now? How about after you see that the eldest son as taken to raping the daughter after seeing how his old man treats women? Do you think you can protect the children from being turned into abusers yourself? How about if the old man threatened to kill you because of your beliefs and interfering with his ideology?

The story is fictional, but it illustrates all of the problems with radical Islam and all of the problems with what the President is doing. You think it's biased against the President when he shelters trouble elements? It's not bias, bigotry, or anything else that governs my opinions of this. The Muslims are not turning in the violent elements, and the result is we get to sit and watch as they train more violent elements. Except this time, it's in our own country instead of where they are from. Have you ever watched TV overseas and seen the anti-American commentary? Do you realize the affect local media has on American's and how much do you think it affects them?

You don't need evidence to prove what ultimately is common sense, and has already proven to never and I mean NEVER work. The Muslims coming to this country do not identify themselves as American's as a rule, and they never integrate.

I like your analogy, but don't feel like it gets as close as it could. I see it more like:

Let's say you are in a room with 14 other people and there's a door where others can enter or you can leave, but an administrator at the door checks people in and out in an official way. Out of the 15 people in the room, 3 have said one person in the room deserves to be the room's leader, 3 others have said a different person deserves to be the room's leader and the remaining 9 haven't made that determination. The 6 that think a leader is mandatory flip a coin, and now there's a leader in the room, according to the six. A few minutes later, a head count shows there are now 18 people in the room. When double checking with the administrator by the door, it is determined the 3 additional people didn't come in through the official entry way. Of the 18 people now in the room, 10 of them have no problem with the amount of people in the room, 8 of them are raising various points about the room getting crowded and perhaps we might not have enough resources. It is acknowledged that anyone who doesn't wish to be in that room are free to go, but the 8 simply concede with the idea that from now on, we might want to be sure that anyone coming into the room comes through the official entry way.

Outside of the room are a whole lot of people, and a group known as the Peace People. Some of them wish to come into the room. In fact, 2 of the members in the room are already members of the Peace People and welcome more of that group into the room. But news reports say that there's a faction of the Peace People known as Jerks who claim to be Peace People, but are really subverting that group to go along with the idea that the best way to achieve Peace is to kill all persons who are non Peace People. The leader in the room says "all Peace People are welcome in this room and are really the kind of people we wish to have here. Heck, we already have 2 of them with us now. Come on in!" The other (defeated) leader says, "Not so fast. We ought to pay attention to news about the Jerks and not just let any one claiming to be Peace People into this room. Wouldn't you agree Mr. Leader?" And the leader says, they're all Peace People. Other members in the room ask the leader about the Jerks, what he thinks about them. The Leader says, "they are all Peace People. And...." What's that, another head count shows 20 people are now in the room and administrator by the door says they didn't come in that way. Anyway, continue Mr. Leader, "....as I was saying we welcome all Peace People into the room." The 5 newest members in the room fully support the leader's rhetoric and thinks everyone ought to be welcome. Why not? Everyone is a Peace Person, right?

Another newsflash, the Jerks just killed a whole bunch more people outside of the room. Proud of their killings. Getting rid of the non Peace People. Back in the room, some members are suggesting we really ought to be keeping better track of who comes in, and right about now, it doesn't make sense to let so called Peace People into this room when anyone of them could be a Jerk who could kill us all. Heck, we're not even sure if the leader of the room believes Jerks exist. He has yet to utter them by name. So, the members ask for clarification, and if the leader is willing to allow Jerks to come in, specifically asking about Jerks. And the leader says, "They are all Peace People and ....." Newsflash, Jerks just killed many dozens outside of the room, but continue Mr. Leader, "...as I was saying, they are all welcome. How many times do I need to repeat this? We welcome all Peace People." Then someone in the room asks if the leader is a Peace Person. And the leader says, "nope, I just sympathize with the Peace People and don't want to give off the appearance of offending anyone who claims to be part of their group. You understand, right? Now, if you'll all kindly give me your guns, I think it would set the right tone when they arrive. Oh, there they are at the door. Let me go welcome them in."

 

[Quetzal]

Why are you afraid to call a duck a duck?

You first have to convince me the duck is actually, a duck. It is called the burden of proof. Until you can do so, this conversation is fruitless.

 

[Mindmaster]

Ok, explain this to me:

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/feb/6/wh-gives-names-muslim-leaders-who-met-obama/

The White House has finally divulged the names of American Muslim leaders who met with President Obama this week, including Imam Mohamed Magid, who has advised the administration on formulating responses to incidents that Islamists consider offensive.

So, who is Mohammed Magid?

http://www.isna.net/mohamed-magid.html

Imam Mohamed Hagmagid is a Sudanese-born American who came to the United States in 1987.
He attained his religious education in various Islamic disciplines as a Resident Scholar at Al-Medina Institute. Currently serving as the Executive Director of the All Dulles Area Muslim Society (ADAMS), Imam Magid helped establish exemplary religious services for Muslim communities across the nation to emulate. He has much experience serving the nation-wide Muslim community as ISNA's East Zone representative and as ISNA Vice President prior to his election in September 2010 as ISNA President. Imam Magid has a long history of commitment to public service through organizations, such as The Peaceful Families Project, Annual Twinning of Mosques and Synagogues, Fairfax Faith Communities in Action, Interfaith Conference of Metropolitan Washington Assembly and the Buxton Interfaith Initiative.

Ok, so President of ISNA...

Wait, I remember that name...

http://www.clarionproject.org/Muslim_Brotherhood_Explanatory_Memorandum

Page 18, ISNA is listed as an affiliate of The Muslim Brotherhood.

So, Obama is taking his cues from terror affiliates?

Points to the duck!

 

[Quetzal]

Ok, explain this to me:

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/feb/6/wh-gives-names-muslim-leaders-who-met-obama/



So, who is Mohammed Magid?

http://www.isna.net/mohamed-magid.html



Ok, so President of ISNA...

Wait, I remember that name...

http://www.clarionproject.org/Muslim_Brotherhood_Explanatory_Memorandum

Page 18, ISNA is listed as an affiliate of The Muslim Brotherhood.

So, Obama is taking his cues from terror affiliates?

Points to the duck!

I will take grasping at straws, for 400, please.

 

[Mindmaster]

You first have to convince me the duck is actually, a duck. It is called the burden of proof. Until you can do so, this conversation is fruitless.

I will take grasping at straws, for 400, please.

Is it better if a brown lady says it?

 

[Quetzal]

Is it better if a brown lady says it?

The more outlandish the claim, the more work you will have to take the prove it. I do not buy into conspiracy theories very often. You have your work cut out for you if you wish to gain my support.

 

[Mindmaster]

The more outlandish the claim, the more work you will have to take the prove it. I do not buy into conspiracy theories very often. You have your work cut out for you if you wish to gain my support.

Ok, https://counterjihadreport.com/tag/imam-mohamed-magid/ :

The face of ADAMS continues to be Imam Mohamed Magid, the Executive Director of ADAMS and the previous leader of the Islamic Society of North America (ISNA), identified by the U.S. government as a financial support entity for Hamas – a designated terrorist organization – and the “nucleus” for the Muslim Brotherhood’s Islamic Movement in North America.

http://www.breitbart.com/national-s...unter-extremists-who-are-actually-extremists/

In 2002, federal officials raided ADAMS in an initiative called “Operation Green Quest,” where the mosque was suspected of supporting terrorist operations. Federal documents revealed that officials believed ADAMS was “suspected of providing support to terrorists, money laundering, and tax evasion.”

Magid is also the former president of the Islamic Society of North America (ISNA), which was established by members of the Muslim Brotherhood, an Islamist terror group that goes by the motto “Allah is our objective, the Koran is the constitution, the Prophet is our leader, Jihad is our way, death for the sake of Allah is our wish.” In the 2007 Holy Land Foundation terror financing trial, a federal judge found that “the [U.S.] government has produced ample evidence to establish” the association of ISNA “with Hamas,” the Palestinian terror group that rules the Gaza Strip.

I guess we shouldn't be worried that this guy has fireside chats with Obama?

 

[tytlyf]

Yes we do, especially because most of us have the notion that you cannot lead from the back row.

Think what you want, there are more radical Islamists than there are people in the entirety of the United States. You don't think that is a problem?

I think I'll let a Lebanese woman, who immigrated here legally, tune you up on history a bit.

Bahahha, Bridgitte is the last person anyone should listen to. She's a puppet for the Koch Heritage Foundation.

 

[Mindmaster]

Bahahha, Bridgitte is the last person anyone should listen to. She's a puppet for the Koch Heritage Foundation.

Source?

 

[tytlyf]

Source?

She always appears on the usual offender stations. That goes for the Heritage foundation, Fox and many RW outlets. Vile woman, she's like a muslim $arah Palin grifting for a living.

http://www.rightwingwatch.org/conte...brigitte-gabriel-smears-her-fundraising-email
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articl...-panel-features-two-leading-islamophobes.html

They're propagandists, scaring people for support/cash.

https://www.splcenter.org/fighting-hate/intelligence-report/2015/acting-out

 

[Mindmaster]

She always appears on the usual offender stations. That goes for the Heritage foundation, Fox and many RW outlets. Vile woman, she's like a muslim $arah Palin grifting for a living.

http://www.rightwingwatch.org/conte...brigitte-gabriel-smears-her-fundraising-email
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articl...-panel-features-two-leading-islamophobes.html

She's never been a Muslim, despite the Arab name, etc. She was a Christian since birth as far as I can tell in a country that hates Christians. I have no doubt her opinion is largely formed on being from a region that wouldn't have been nice to her at all. She has been in some terrible situations, and regardless of her affiliations, I am sure she speaks from experience mostly. Anyway, Islamophobia is valid if you are LGBT, have no or a different religion, or are American. (P.S. They want to kill you, well at least 1 in 4 do.) She's not politically correct, and I'm not either. However, most of the information she has lines with what I have. I haven't heard her say anything too controversial that I've not found elsewhere. Sometimes, it's just easier to link a video.

Anyway, there is just funny logic afoot. Her opinions are invalid because the foundation that pays her is paid by Koch brothers? Ok, so using that logic Obama's comments are invalid because I know he speaks with and consults with ISNA imams, which makes him a terrorist too. And, I must be an Islamophobe because I agreed with one or two videos she is in, and yadda... This is just crazy... There is a clear trail of Obama being weak on the radical Islam issue, and he's been caving to pressure from jihadists to do what they want. He is not working for us, and I think we need to know why.

Most of the Republicans don't trust Fox News these days, either. That ship has sailed. I have to do "Voltron news", you know where you take about 10% of what MSM says and combine it into the actual news story. I find it completely annoying, if one outlet would just stop printing lies my life would be so much easier.