Undercover atheists in LDS Church

[Breathe]

Apparently they gave the Church a high rating on the "dangerous" scale, especially for women.:sarcastic

What kind of Mormon church are they going to?
I've been to a Mormon church. I wouldn't consider it even remotely dangerous, lol.


However - I found that they do display incredibly high level of ignorance of the religion of Sikhism in that podcast. They know almost nothing about it, one was too short-sighted to even bring their glasses, and the other doesn't even make mention of the text that was on the slides.

What gives them any ability to claim how weird a religion is or not, if they can't even get a grip on the teachings of the religion before doing the show? Anyone can spout off whatever nonsense they want and pass judgement on a religion, but they should not be listened to if they know nothing about what it teaches.

I doubt they even wanted to learn about the claims or views in the first place.

 

[Splarnst]

What about doing your homework? Sounds like you've been getting your information from the same kind of website that would tell explain the Catholic doctrine of transsubstantiation as "cannibalism."

How about LDS.org?

“God Himself was once as we are now, and is an exalted man, and sits enthroned in yonder heavens!”
Source: http://lds.org/ldsorg/v/index.jsp?v...M100000176f620a____&hideNav=1&contentLocale=0

“Then shall they be gods, because they have no end; therefore shall they be from everlasting to everlasting, because they continue; then shall they be above all, because all things are subject unto them. Then shall they be gods, because they have all power, and the angels are subject unto them.”
Source: Doctrine and Covenants 132:20*

You're the one who hasn't done their homework.

 

[Splarnst]

Dude, they rate things by things like "creepiness factor".
What the hell is that, if not mockery?

Mockery is intended to be funny and/or intentionally hurtful. This is neither. It's negative, but that's not mockery.

 

[angellous_evangellous]

Mockery is intended to be funny and/or intentionally hurtful. This is neither. It's negative, but that's not mockery.

That's a rather optimistic view of mockery. It assumes two things (1) that the mocker knows what he/she is doing and (2) that idiots can't mock.

 

[outhouse]

They Do It So You Don’t Have To | Friendly Atheist

Looks like an atheist couple recently went through all the motions to join the LDS Church so they could talk about it on a podcast. Do you think think it is ethical for people to lie to others just to get an inside look at their beliefs?

your religion had its chance to show some light on these poor atheist and convert them.

in the absense of any light, evidence or proof of anything, you could not convert them.


IfI look at this as you blew your shot to convert them. You had nothing better to offer them, that would take them away from there default position of no theism.


maybe your chance was small as they were not really intrested in joining, but you had a chance and failed.

Maybe a god sent them your way for a reason

 

[Splarnst]

That's a rather optimistic view of mockery. It assumes two things (1) that the mocker knows what he/she is doing and (2) that idiots can't mock.

I wouldn't characterize the definition as “optimistic,” and I'm not completely sure what you mean in this instance.

My definition does include an element of intentionality, but it does not assume that idiots can't mock. Idiots are as capable as anyone of intending to be funny and/or offensive; whether they succeed is a different question.

In any case, I don't consider calling something creepy "mockery."

 

[waitasec]

They Do It So You Don’t Have To | Friendly Atheist

Looks like an atheist couple recently went through all the motions to join the LDS Church so they could talk about it on a podcast. Do you think think it is ethical for people to lie to others just to get an inside look at their beliefs?

the mere fact that you have to be secretive in order to gain access to inside information means the entire program is secretive, and one wonders why that is the case for a religious institution...the vatican is suspect as well.

 

[McBell]

the mere fact that you have to be secretive in order to gain access to inside information means the entire program is secretive, and one wonders why that is the case for a religious institution...the vatican is suspect as well.

Please be so kind as to present where this "fact" can be referenced.

 

[waitasec]

Please be so kind as to present where this "fact" can be referenced.

here
They Do It So You Don’t Have To | Friendly Atheist

they did it...

or are you insinuating they didn't do it?

 

[McBell]

here
They Do It So You Don’t Have To | Friendly Atheist

they did it...

or are you insinuating they didn't do it?

I am asking for something more than a pile of unsubstantiated claims made by individuals who show an obvious bias against the Mormon Belief System.

Now if you do not have anything that would qualify, you can just say so.

Do you really think your linked page actually supports your claim?

 

[waitasec]

I am asking for something more than a pile of unsubstantiated claims made by individuals who show an obvious bias against the Mormon Belief System.

Now if you do not have anything that would qualify, you can just say so.

Do you really think your linked page actually supports your claim?

fair enough, i get you...

 

[McBell]

fair enough, i get you...

Do not get me wrong, I do not know of any such "secret" beliefs.
But I do not delude myself into the attitude that if I do not know about them, they do not exist.
I can say that I have been to several Mormon Churches ard have not once heard tell of or seen any evidence of any such "secret" beliefs and in fact have only heard tell of them from anti-Mormon literature, anti-Mormon propaganda, and people parroting them.

However, I do know there are a few ceremonies (for lack of a better term) that most Mormons (the ones I know) prefer non-Mormons not be present for.
Now I understand how these might be perceived as "secret" beliefs.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

They Do It So You Don’t Have To | Friendly Atheist

Looks like an atheist couple recently went through all the motions to join the LDS Church so they could talk about it on a podcast. Do you think think it is ethical for people to lie to others just to get an inside look at their beliefs?

How did they lie?

I've listened to their Part 1 and am into the beginning of Part 2 and I haven't spotted one yet. Did you have something specific in mind?

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

It seems to me that they were careful not to explicitly lie. They said that their policy for the show is when directly challenged, they would answer honestly.

Here's a bit from Carrie's talk after her baptism:

If you had asked me the day before I met the elders what happens when you die, I would've said "well, your body goes into the ground, and you decompose, and so does your personality - that's it."

If you asked me a week or two after I met the elders "what happens when you die?" I would say "well, I think your body goes into the ground and decomposes, and so do you. I think."

And if you asked me maybe a month after I met the elders "what happens when you die?" I would've said, "well, I don't know! No one's reported back, have they?"

And if you asked me today, I would probably say "I have a couple books I think you'd like."

Strictly speaking, none of this was a lie. It's probably misleading given she knew how it would be taken by her audience, but every word is factually true.

 

[Apex]

It seems to me that they were careful not to explicitly lie. They said that their policy for the show is when directly challenged, they would answer honestly.

Here's a bit from Carrie's talk after her baptism:



Strictly speaking, none of this was a lie. It's probably misleading given she knew how it would be taken by her audience, but every word is factually true.

Lie or not, it was definitely deception. And they did flat out lie during the baptism interview.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Lie or not, it was definitely deception. And they did flat out lie during the baptism interview.

Did they?

They discuss the baptism interview in the podcast (near the beginning of part 2). Exactly where did they lie?

 

[Katzpur]

How about LDS.org?

“God Himself was once as we are now, and is an exalted man, and sits enthroned in yonder heavens!”
Source: LDS.org - Melchizedek Priesthood Chapter Detail - God the Eternal Father

“Then shall they be gods, because they have no end; therefore shall they be from everlasting to everlasting, because they continue; then shall they be above all, because all things are subject unto them. Then shall they be gods, because they have all power, and the angels are subject unto them.”
Source: Doctrine and Covenants 132:20*

You're the one who hasn't done their homework.

Oh, I see. Now you're going to post what it actually says instead of your own pathetic attempt at paraphrasing it. Why didn't you just do that in the first place? Apparently the actual quotes didn't quite convey the "creepiness factor" you were after.

 

[Katzpur]

your religion had its chance to show some light on these poor atheist and convert them.

in the absense of any light, evidence or proof of anything, you could not convert them.


IfI look at this as you blew your shot to convert them. You had nothing better to offer them, that would take them away from there default position of no theism.


maybe your chance was small as they were not really intrested in joining, but you had a chance and failed.

Maybe a god sent them your way for a reason

No one with a closed mind is likely to convert to anything.

 

[Katzpur]

the mere fact that you have to be secretive in order to gain access to inside information means the entire program is secretive, and one wonders why that is the case for a religious institution.

What kind of "inside information" were they prohibited from gaining access to that you believe the Church had an obligation to give them?

 

[Storm]

the mere fact that you have to be secretive in order to gain access to inside information means the entire program is secretive, and one wonders why that is the case for a religious institution...the vatican is suspect as well.

There is a significant difference between secretive and private.