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Understanding Atheism

Cephus

Relentlessly Rational
I agree, but I wonder how many really manage to do it?

A lot don't. I find it amazing how many people think that because most people refuse to do it, that it's an unreasonable expectation that people should do it. It is an ideal. Rational people try to approach that ideal. Irrational people pretend that the ideal doesn't exist.
 

Laika

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
Interesting viewpoint. I can see that.

Part of me things that the entire world is my family but we just don't know or see it yet. That one day we will all celebrate together. "God" will bring the drinks and the food! Maybe I am a dreamer...

It's a good dream. I have a tendency towards thinking of humanity as a substitute for god in so far as what I do for humanity gives me some immortality by the permanence of my consequences. I will die, but the consequences of my actions live on. So feeling that the entire world is my family, but we haven't just figured it out yet- makes perfect sense. :)
 

Sha'irullah

رسول الآلهة
That is a good point.

What if an atheist could invent his or her own God outside of all religions?

What would they be like?

An atheist holds no belief in any god. It has nothing to do with religion in particular just gods. If you invent your own god outside of religion are not an atheist.

Atheist = A Theos = No God.
 

Jumi

Well-Known Member
So, do some "atheists" believe "God" exists but simply ignore him/her/it? I am really trying to figure out what an "atheist" is I guess...and then decide if there really is such a thing (as taught and attacked by the Christian religion)
I don't think there are atheists who believe in a god. An atheist most simply is someone who simply doesn't think there is a god.
 

Laika

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
That is a good point.

What if an atheist could invent his or her own God outside of all religions?

What would they be like?

God was be a projection of the atheist's self-concept. At a guess (with my own bias in mind), the creator would be a scientist creating a universe in a petri dish, with a wild eyed fascination and curiosity for the world and love of existence. questioning everything and looking up at the stars wondering, "where did I come from and where am I going?"

He'd probably be an atheist... but then you're into the infinite regression of creates the creator.
 

Drolefille

PolyPanGeekGirl
That is fair. I am not focusing on a "Christian" God, but really any God. It/he/she can be whatever you want him/her/it to be. How would you define "evidence"?
It seemed relevant to your OP.

Anything that convinces me personally, it can be a personal experience, one I can even acknowledge is not something that would convince anyone else. I, personally, want to be convinced.
 

we-live-now

Active Member
I don't think there are atheists who believe in a god. An atheist most simply is someone who simply doesn't think there is a god.

Ok, I see what you are saying. I am not saying this is right or wrong just trying to understand. The thought comes to my mind that if there is no god at all that this is like trying to convince ourselves and others that nothing doesn't exist. Not sure if that makes sense or not. Kind of like a double-negative. Sorry, can't grasp the idea fully right now.
 

we-live-now

Active Member
It's a good dream. I have a tendency towards thinking of humanity as a substitute for god in so far as what I do for humanity gives me some immortality by the permanence of my consequences. I will die, but the consequences of my actions live on. So feeling that the entire world is my family, but we haven't just figured it out yet- makes perfect sense. :)

I think you are really onto something there. I think if we can think of our true being as others and help and serve them, we may be understanding God (if there is one) better than any "religious" people.
 

we-live-now

Active Member
God was be a projection of the atheist's self-concept. At a guess (with my own bias in mind), the creator would be a scientist creating a universe in a petri dish, with a wild eyed fascination and curiosity for the world and love of existence. questioning everything and looking up at the stars wondering, "where did I come from and where am I going?"

He'd probably be an atheist... but then you're into the infinite regression of creates the creator.

The thought of "God being an atheist is very funny" and actually could be true IMHO. He simply wouldn't believe in all the false gods we humans invent in our own individual "religion". He would truly "know" himself if you will. Great thoughts.
 

Jumi

Well-Known Member
The thought comes to my mind that if there is no god at all that this is like trying to convince ourselves and others that nothing doesn't exist. Not sure if that makes sense or not. Kind of like a double-negative. Sorry, can't grasp the idea fully right now.
Are you say that god is same as nothing or am I getting this wrong?
 

we-live-now

Active Member
It seemed relevant to your OP.

Anything that convinces me personally, it can be a personal experience, one I can even acknowledge is not something that would convince anyone else. I, personally, want to be convinced.

I hear you and believe I understand. We all need to be convinced personally don't we? Isn't the opposite called "religion" where we are told to follow blindly and simply accept what we are told w/o questioning it or being "convinced" ourselves?

I honestly believe there are more people outside of "religion" who know "God" (if there is one) better than those inside religion. They don't have to admit it at all (to create their OWN following) because their actions of love towards others simply reveals it.

Personally, I am convinced all religion is simply man trying to please an angry God that he or another man made up in his own mind in order to create a following or control the masses out of fear.
 

Laika

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
I think you are really onto something there. I think if we can think of our true being as others and help and serve them, we may be understanding God (if there is one) better than any "religious" people.

I hope so. I tend to view the true meaning of religion as love, so it's not exclusive to religion but is fully compatible with a healthy atheism or humanism. I'm not sure I can ever prove it is a true path or state of being, but so far it is a deeply fulfilling one. I hope the same for you.

The thought of "God being an atheist is very funny" and actually could be true IMHO. He simply wouldn't believe in all the false gods we humans invent in our own individual "religion". He would truly "know" himself if you will. Great thoughts.

Thanks. :)
 

NulliuSINverba

Active Member
I apologize if this is the wrong spot to post this. I am curious.

I am trying to understand Atheism better.

If you believe that a god exists, you're a theist. If you don't believe that a god exists, you're an atheist.

(Just so you understand my viewpoint, I am a person who believes the Bible is God's word and literally true, but we simply can't see this hidden "true reality" yet.

So the mustard seed is literally the smallest of all seeds on earth, correct? For the Bible to be literally true, it'd have to be the smallest seed on earth, right?

So, my question is this.

Do most atheists reject "God" because of the way he is portrayed by the broken and blind people called "Christians" who follow him/her? Or is it something else?

It's because the theists cannot present anything approaching a convincing case for the existence of their "God." End of story.

Let's say we could invent our own God who:

1) Is like the most loving father, brother, mother, best friend that most of us never had that we just wanted to be with all the time.
2) Is all powerful and all knowing and all sovereign with no "buts" ( and not "double-speak" like the Christians teach)
3) Loves us all truly unconditionally exactly as we are and simply wants to spend every moment loving us
4) Requires nothing of us in return (and if he did, he would give it to us)
5) Assures us that "all will see me and be with me one day" and no person will be left out regardless of their religion or beliefs.
6) Overlooks all your wrongs and mistakes but lovingly tries to help you with them.
7) Wants to give us all things and help him rule and reign

If there was such a God as this, would atheists want to be around him/her/it? Why or why not?

It's an invented God, right? Why would anyone believe in an invented God?
 

leibowde84

Veteran Member
I apologize if this is the wrong spot to post this. I am curious.

I am trying to understand Atheism better. I believe most atheists are some of the most intelligent and sharpest people around.

(Just so you understand my viewpoint, I am a person who believes the Bible is God's word and literally true, but we simply can't see this hidden "true reality" yet. However, I don't like to call myself a "Christian" because they have so much religious garbage that man mixed in and has to "do".)

So, my question is this.

Do most atheists reject "God" because of the way he is portrayed by the broken and blind people called "Christians" who follow him/her? Or is it something else?

Let's say we could invent our own God who:

1) Is like the most loving father, brother, mother, best friend that most of us never had that we just wanted to be with all the time.
2) Is all powerful and all knowing and all sovereign with no "buts" ( and not "double-speak" like the Christians teach)
3) Loves us all truly unconditionally exactly as we are and simply wants to spend every moment loving us
4) Requires nothing of us in return (and if he did, he would give it to us)
5) Assures us that "all will see me and be with me one day" and no person will be left out regardless of their religion or beliefs.
6) Overlooks all your wrongs and mistakes but lovingly tries to help you with them.
7) Wants to give us all things and help him rule and reign

If there was such a God as this, would atheists want to be around him/her/it? Why or why not?
I appreciate your inquisitive nature tremendously. Thanks for providing your input.

I think you are confusing the question a bit, though. Obviously, all atheists are different, and it is never a good idea (as you say yourself) to classify people as believing the same thing if they identify themselves as without belief in God.

You have to understand that there is not any necessary lack of want. In other words, many atheists say repeatedly that they would love to have the comfort and mental ease that comes with the belief in a deity. The issue is that they do not have the ability or want to believe in something unless they have a good reason to do so. And, when that belief requires the supernatural, the burden of proof is almost too high to surpass. Not to say in any way that they are stubborn, but they are only interested in truth that can be shown in this reality.

There are a great deal of problems with the Bible, so, first, you must understand that belief that the Bible is the word of God (without human manipulation/mistake) is to ignore what we know about those who actually put pen to paper. No one is perfect, and when a story is passed down through years of oral-telling, it inevitable becomes muddled. Here are some issues:
1) The writers of the Gospels were not those they were named for, nor did any of them have any 1st hand knowledge of Jesus.
2) Contradictions abound to the objective reader.
3) Reliance on circular logic/reasoning in order to provide justification for passages in the Bible (using one passage to prove another assumes that the first is accurate).

All in all, Atheists have not been given adequate proof to believe that a God exists that is deserving of worship or acknowledgment.
 
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