This battle actually occured in Medina, between the army of Muhammad (saw) and Amr Ibn Hisham, better known as Abu Jahl. Abu Jahl was a leader of Mecca, but he attacked the Muslim's in Medina. The muslim's were forced to protect themselves.
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Validity of Muhammad's message.
- Thread starter thedude
- Start date
This battle actually occured in Medina, between the army of Muhammad (saw) and Amr Ibn Hisham, better known as Abu Jahl. Abu Jahl was a leader of Mecca, but he attacked the Muslim's in Medina. The muslim's were forced to protect themselves.
Noone denies it. He was part of many wars, which resulted in the loss of life of many of his own followers and his opponents. But these wars were all wars of self defence, he never instigated a fight, and always showed mercy and compassion in every aspect of his life where it was right to do so.
~Amin~
God is the King
Because theres clear signs that this man, is speaking the WORDS of God
not his own.
Not if you know theses visions are from God.
Don Penguinoini
Modi.
hmm...Yeah.:sarcastic
fullyveiled muslimah
Evil incarnate!
Narrated Jabir bin 'Abdullah: We took part in the Ghazwa of Najd along with Allah's Apostle and when the time for the afternoon rest approached while he was in a valley with plenty of thorny trees, he dismounted under a tree and rested in its shade and hung his sword (on it). The people dispersed amongst the trees in order to have shade. While we were in this state, Allah's Apostle called us and we came and found a bedouin sitting in front of him. The Prophet said, "This (Bedouin) came to me while I was asleep, and he took my sword stealthily. I woke up while he was standing by my head, holding my sword without its sheath. He said, 'Who will save you from me?' I replied, 'Allah.' So he sheathed it (i.e. the sword) and sat down, and here he is." But Allah's Apostle did not punish him.
Okay so if you're a psychopathic-killer-prophet-guy, do you promptly behead this chump, or do you sit him down and talk to him?
I'm interested to know if people know WHY those wars even started? Do you all honestly believe that all the non-muslims of the time were quietly eating their dinner at home, when all of a sudden BAM, all the muslim started a slaughter-fest? Get real. Unless we are to assume that the violence vivited upon the muslims at the time was justified, and should have been met with a peace march.
Okay so if you're a psychopathic-killer-prophet-guy, do you promptly behead this chump, or do you sit him down and talk to him?
I'm interested to know if people know WHY those wars even started? Do you all honestly believe that all the non-muslims of the time were quietly eating their dinner at home, when all of a sudden BAM, all the muslim started a slaughter-fest? Get real. Unless we are to assume that the violence vivited upon the muslims at the time was justified, and should have been met with a peace march.
Thedude,
Your view that, 'so many people putting so much faith in the opinion of one man' were not converted by the power of faith but by the power of the scimitar. Muhammad started his religion as a preacher but nobody believe him even the Jews of his days. What he did was he used terror to convert people. If Muhammad did not use religious conquest islam will be just an insignificant religion in Saudi Arabia. Because of terror it reached Spain, Eastern Europe and conquered the Byzantine empire.
Spin.
No spin zone here! That Byzantine emperor Alexei I quoted by Pope Benidict; He said that; "There is nothing Muhammad brought to the world but trouble."
You don't think the Byzantine Emperor was putting his own spin on things? When was the last time an emperor or a politician didn't spin something?
YmirGF
Bodhisattva in Recovery
And that is why I take the middle road with Muhammed [pbuh]. It is absolutely unreasonable to believe the Muslim accounts are perfectly genuine. They are obviously spun to put an unseemly fellow in the very best light. Likewise the detractors of Islam paint him to be Evil Incarnate... hardly. The answer can only lay somewhere between the two. It's not like these folks kept brilliant records at the time now, is it?
neves
Active Member
Islam was the dominant religion by far in Indonesia, with the greatest number of religious adherents: around 143 million people or 86.9 percent of the population in 1985, which when adjusted for 1992 estimates represents between 160 million and 170 million adherents. This high percentage of Muslims made Indonesia the largest Islamic country in the world in the early 1990s. Within the nation, most provinces and islands had majority populations of Islamic adherents (ranging from just above 50 percent in Kalimantan Barat and Maluku provinces to as much as 97.8 percent in the Special Region of Aceh).
Indonesia - Islam
Okay so which super barbaric Muslim army went and held a sword under these Indonesians necks and converted all these people to Islam ?
Okay there was no barbaric army who converted Indonesia therefore sombody was preaching the words of Muhammad in Indonesia. How did they do it if muslims don't have the ability of convincing people by religious persuasion. Do you know who he is? But still the point is Muhammad started islam by forcing people to believe. By the power of the sword and not words.
In your opinion. And honestly, the whole 'spread by the sword' ordeal is REALLY tired. Christianity and many other religions share that same tag.
According to my 50 years old hindu teacher, Hinduism is not a religion, and the world should feel ashamed for calling it so. It's merely a collection of philisophical thoughts.
Everyone is invited to read the thread in the link below:
http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/religious-debates/39491-muhammads-sword.html
The story about "spreading the faith by the sword" is an evil legend, one of the myths that grew up in Europe during the great wars against the Muslims - the reconquista of Spain by the Christians, the Crusades and the repulsion of the Turks, who almost conquered Vienna.
Interesting that at first Muhammad didn't even know that his "visions" were from God.
t seems that the belief in Islam takes a blind leap of faith. Meaning, so much weight is given to the question of whether God truly spoke to Muhammad. A man who wasn't sure he heard from God after supposedly hearing from an angel, had suicidal thoughts, built a following partly based on military conquest, married/had sex with a nine year old, and advocated the murder of his enemies.
In case you are interested, these things can be found in Revered Muslim writings such as "Sirat Rasul Allah", the Hadith collections of Bukhari, Muslim, and Abu Dawud, and "The history of al-Tabari" among others.
Mujahid Mohammed
Well-Known Member
It was 314 and it was not in Mecca but at Badr. Hence the name the Battle of Badr. Are you sure it was Amir ibn Hisham who was the leader of the polytheist army? Where did you get this information?
Mujahid Mohammed
Well-Known Member
Who exactly? You have a statistical number for me. And also was there some reason for Muhammed fighting with these people. Why was he fighting with the meccans to begin with. why did he and his followers leave their home, wealth and family? Answer those questions for me since you seem to be an expert on what Muhammed did?
Mujahid Mohammed
Well-Known Member
Really? please enlighten me with details of these wars, murders and crimes?
since you seem to know so much about Islam maybe you could tell me what the reason was for the war in the first place. why were they fighting these people? Was something being done to them?