War, the final battle.

[TransmutingSoul]

His only mission was to proclaim himself as the latest messenger from Allah. All the rest was immaterial.

There is a war happening Aupmanyav

It is a war of Love against all that is not Love. It is raging around the world;

"O ye beloved of the Lord! This day is the day of union, the day of the ingathering of all mankind. 'Verily God loveth those who, as though they were a solid wall, do battle for His Cause in serried lines!' Note that He saith 'in serried lines' -- meaning crowded and pressed together, one locked to the next, each supporting his fellows. To do battle, as stated in the sacred verse, doth not, in this greatest of all dispensations, mean to go forth with sword and spear, with lance and piercing arrow -- but rather weaponed with pure intent, with righteous motives, with counsels helpful and effective, with godly attributes, with deeds pleasing to the Almighty, with the qualities of heaven. It signifieth education for all mankind, guidance for all men, the spreading far and wide of the sweet savours of the spirit, the promulgation of God's proofs, the setting forth of arguments conclusive and divine, the doing of charitable deeds."

‘Abdu’l-Bahá, Selections from the Writings of ‘Abdu’l-Bahá

Welcome to the War, the final battle against our own perception of life.

At least with this war we can do it over coffee and cake.

Regards Tony

 

[TransmutingSoul]

Where is his letter of appointment?

This link would be the Authority given over all things.

Spoiler: SUPREME RULER OVER ALL

The Kitáb-i-Aqdas | Bahá’í Reference Library

Regards Tony

 

[loverofhumanity]

So the Baha'is believe that God has sent several messengers. But, people still mess things up. Now God has sent a new messenger that has told us how to clean up the mess. But it sounds like it requires people to accept God's new messenger and put God's plan into action?

God let's bad stuff happen to teach us a lesson... that we better listen to him?

So the tragedies happened because didn't listen to God's new messenger?

So bad things will continue until people listen to God's new messenger? Then, there will be no more bad things happen?

So bad things like this would be stopped in a Baha'i world, because all the "good" leaders of all the "good" nations would send their "good", "righteous" military people over there to destroy the "evil" leaders and their "evil" military forces?

Yes, Baha'u'llah offered the leaders of the world to accept him and establish peace, but they ignored him. So, God went with plan B... let wars, famine, pestilence and natural disasters maim and kill people? But then, once we do accept God's plan, God will no longer need to maim and kill people to get them to listen?

Yes, God, apparently, allows us to make our own choices. Knowing that most all of us will make lots of wrong choices... especially when it comes to believing that Baha'u'llah is God's prophet for today. So because people have, by their own free will choice, chosen to reject him, then God punishes all the people of the world? What a great thread. I'm learning so much.

No punishment whatsoever CG. Every action or inaction has a consequence. We make a decision and the result of that action manifests itself in the world. God has nothing whatsoever to do with our free choices. He only offers advice.

So say for instance, God advises to settle our conflicts through consultation but we choose brawls and street fights and people die and are hospitalised. That suffering is as a result of our making a conscious choice to settle our dispute through the use of violence. God does not punish us, our own choices determine the consequences.

Had we used the process of consultation the result may have been a friendly agreement without anyone being hurt or injured. The choice is ours. Our fate is in our own hands. God only sends His Counsellors and Advisors in the form of Prophets to ‘offer’ us a better method of doing things but we are completely free to use or not use their counsel and advice.

So we had two world wars because it was our decision to do so. It was always our decision to allow dangerous dictators to flourish and we established the veto at the UN meaning that any one veto by one country on the security council could protect and harbour war criminals. We set that system up. It doesn’t work. Look at the Burmese war criminals killing their own people while China and Russia vetoes any action. God’s advice was for the world to unite and use every means at its disposal to crush and destroy those war criminals. But we have chosen the system of vetoes so our hands are tied while they continue to massacre men, women and children with impunity knowing China has their back. Who set up this unjust system? We did. It was our choice. So the consequences of the veto system is it protects war criminals instead of the innocent.

What has God got to do with it? We make the decisions here not God. We make our bed so we have to sleep in it. We punish ourselves. The veto protects USA and China from being sanctioned but it also protects war criminals from being sanctioned too, so murder and massacre continue because the system we set up does not have provisions to protect the innocent from genocide. It only has provisions to protect generals and presidents from being brought to account. Countries set the system up for self interests not for justice or to protect the weak and innocent from genocide and war crimes so these horrendous slaughters continue while justice remains choked by the veto option we set up.

God has nothing to do with it and to try and pass it onto God is to try and escape our moral and humane responsibility to protect our fellow human beings in the world. It is reprehensible we allow genocide to occur and it is our duty to intervene.

 

[rational experiences]

Life placement by human sex no argument.

Equal humans.

Imbalanced thinking group science origins occult mentality to own powers to control. God energy powers.

Motivated human thesis. Design. Reactions. God O earth attacking life.

Earths natural form can destroy life even without science changing its body.

Human realisation don't change God.

Basic spiritual advice without lots of coercing.

To believe in self spirituality is to honour the presence of power but not change it.

Our behaviours about self superiority changed by science conditions.

It is a human fact.

So when you are irradiated and changes to gas spirits occur. Feelings emotional thoughts hearing of phenomena occurs. A human fact.

I lived those events and know it does not make me special. It caused my realisation of information.

Spiritual advice changed every single day by feedback heard advice. I already learnt it did. So I said proven I am learning only.

Learning.

Our world communal problem inequality introduced to natural human family and extended family.

Human advice.

Language our barrier. Separated DNA nation genetics another barrier.

Yet DNA medical science states once our human parentage all the same life family. Just human.

Radiation UFO sciences fallout temple pyramid changed our nature. Changed our genetics.

We are all equal. Not special. Sharing memories and human advice to correlate a self story that demonstrates how sacrifice of life removed our human family unity.

Basic real advice. Common human ancestry.

Is superiority going to allow us to regain what the human family lost?

 

[Aupmanyav]

No matter because Baha'u'llah was authorized by God to begin work.

Where is the proof?

 

[Aupmanyav]

Makes my head hurt.

But my rambling is nonsense w/o a sense of where you are. What is your belief system --and please don't waste our time w/ a list of all the things you don't believe, I'm asking what u do believe. Are you a Humanist? Do you care about 'meaning'? Do u see an objective good/bad and right/wrong?

Important side note: It is not my intent to 'convert' you, to make you say you were wrong and now you believe like nobody's business. That's BS. My intent is for us to share our models of how we see things & swap ideas. No right & wrong answers here.

Don't make that an excuse.

I believe in non-duality (Advaita Hinduism). Which means you and me are the same (constituted by the same material - namely atoms and energy). So, if you are hurt, I am also hurt. All good or bad, right or wrong is contextual. There is no objective morality. In a war soldiers kill, is it good or bad?

I resonate with what Pete offered as also to me they can not be seperated. As without God, there is no conciousness, no reality.

But neither you nor anyone else has provided any proof of existence of God / Allah.

Welcome to the War, the final battle against our own perception of life.
At least with this war we can do it over coffee and cake.

This is no war of love. This is a war of domination. You slight all other religions of the world in your futile quest for numbers. Unfortunately, yours is the smallest denomination in all Abrahamic religions, even less than that of Ahmadiyyas, the latest missive from Allah brought by Mirza Ghulam Ahmad of India. Do you mean to say that my conception of life is wrong and only what you propose is correct? Coffee and cake will not help because your own intention is not pure.

 

[Aupmanyav]

This link would be the Authority given over all things.

The first line itself is unacceptable. Sure, it is understandable that Abdul Baha will say things like that because Bahaollah was his father and the source of his prosperity and power. Bahai religion was his family enterprise.

"In the name of Him Who is the Supreme Ruler over all that hath been and all that is to be."

That is known as appropriation. Why should Bahaollah and any of his descendants be speaking on behalf of God or Allah without providing any proof?

"The first duty prescribed by God for His servants is the recognition of Him Who is the Dayspring of His Revelation and the Fountain of His laws, Who representeth the Godhead in both the Kingdom of His Cause and the world of creation."

I am nobody's servant, and the existence of God has never been proved before me. If I do not accept the existence of God, why would I care for any one who claims without any proof to be a prophet / son / messenger / manifestation / mahdi of this supposed God or Allah.

 

[CG Didymus]

I resonate with what Pete offerd as also to me they can not be seperated. As without God, there is no conciousness, no reality.

Regards Tony

As if we all agree on what is "reality". And I know people don't agree on who God is or if there even is a God.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

As if we all agree on what is "reality". And I know people don't agree on who God is or if there even is a God.

All people can choose their path.

Regards Tony

 

[TransmutingSoul]

The first line itself is unacceptable. Sure, it is understandable that Abdul Baha will say things like that because Bahaollah was his father and the source of his prosperity and power. Bahai religion was his family enterprise.

"In the name of Him Who is the Supreme Ruler over all that hath been and all that is to be."

That is known as appropriation. Why should Bahaollah and any of his descendants be speaking on behalf of God or Allah without providing any proof?

"The first duty prescribed by God for His servants is the recognition of Him Who is the Dayspring of His Revelation and the Fountain of His laws, Who representeth the Godhead in both the Kingdom of His Cause and the world of creation."

I am nobody's servant, and the existence of God has never been proved before me. If I do not accept the existence of God, why would I care for any one who claims without any proof to be a prophet / son / messenger / manifestation / mahdi of this supposed God or Allah.

Sure you can see it that way, as it is you that chooses your own path. I am not here to change it.

Regards Tony

 

[Pete in Panama]

There is no objective morality. In a war soldiers kill, is it good or bad?

You and I are going to die whether we want to or not. That's a given. We may not like it at the time but over all it's a good thing.

At the same time murder and stealing are bad while honoring parents is good. Yeah, anyone can play around w/ exceptions ad nauseum but the principle remains and these concepts of good and bad are found throughout the entire human race. To me if that's not 'objective' then it'll do until real objective comes along.

 

[Aupmanyav]

I accept death as a fact of life and do not believe in life after death.
Stealing is bad but loot was not always wrong, and many a times murder and rape were just 'collateral damage'.
World history is full of such incidents.

 

[Pete in Panama]

I accept death as a fact of life and do not believe in life after death.
Stealing is bad but loot was not always wrong, and many a times murder and rape were just 'collateral damage'.
World history is full of such incidents.

So you agree w/ the same sense of right & wrong that virtually everyone else does, yet at the same time you assert that there is no 'objective' moral code. To me that's like saying the objective existence of light, the stars, the world around us --that it's all subjective & if someone wants to say for example "we all live on a gigantic pile of drifting whipped cream" then his assertion is eqally valid.

Somehow how objective right/wrong should be as obvious to all as is objective sun & moon.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

I accept death as a fact of life and do not believe in life after death.
Stealing is bad but loot was not always wrong, and many a times murder and rape were just 'collateral damage'.
World history is full of such incidents.

I see we can teach our children that war, looting and rape are wrong, we can teach them that the goal in life it not self based, but to help as many others in life that they can, to face life in the Spirit of service.

That's the world I see evolving from this war, the final battle against our selves, which will produce a race of men, who are happy and joyfull to serve each other as world citizens.

Regards Tony

 

[TransmutingSoul]

As if we all agree on what is "reality". And I know people don't agree on who God is or if there even is a God.

I see it is possible that this quote below was applicable to your comment CG.

This passage is taken from a prayer that can be said during the Baha'i Fast, which this year is 1st March to 19th March.

".... Open Thou, O my Lord, mine eyes and the eyes of all them that have sought Thee, that we may recognize Thee with Thine own eyes. This is Thy bidding given us in the Book sent down by Thee unto Him Whom Thou hast chosen by Thy behest, Whom Thou hast singled out for Thy favor above all Thy creatures, Whom Thou hast been pleased to invest with Thy sovereignty, and Whom Thou hast specially favored and entrusted with Thy Message unto Thy people. Praised be Thou, therefore, O my God, inasmuch as Thou hast graciously enabled us to recognize Him and to acknowledge whatsoever hath been sent down unto Him, and conferred upon us the honor of attaining the presence of the One Whom Thou didst promise in Thy Book and in Thy Tablets... "

I see It is naught but a gift CG. It is God that chooses the Messengers and how they appear to us. The gift is to see God through God's own eyes. To me that is saying the Revelation of God's chosen Messenger is the Eyes that we can see God through, the Messenger and the Word are God's own eyes.

That is why it requires independent investigation and immersion in the Word given by God.

If we can not consider the Messenger, we can not begin to look at God through God's own eyes. As such, if we want to look at Christ, what we have now to do that, is the Bible, the Word left by Christ. The material word needed to tell of the spiritual reality of who Jesus was.

We are not now looking for God, the Son, we now need to see God the Father, I see we need to look through what the Father Baha'u'llah offered. All others have the same choice.

Regards Tony

 

[Pete in Panama]

As if we all agree on what is "reality"...

Virtually all the sane connecting humans share a common reality. Exceptions include those in mental institutions, small babies, the incapacitated and comatose, and wise-acres that 'say' they don't believe in a shared reality but turn right around and work with it.

 

[Aupmanyav]

I see we can teach our children that war, looting and rape are wrong, we can teach them that the goal in life it not self based, but to help as many others in life that they can, to face life in the Spirit of service.

Yeah, we can and we should; rather than poisoning their mind with fake stories about God / Allah and the various prophets / sons / messengers / manifestations / mahdis sent by him.

 

[Aupmanyav]

As such, if we want to look at Christ, what we have now to do that, is the Bible, the Word left by Christ. The material word needed to tell of the spiritual reality of who Jesus was.

I do not think Bahais consider Bible to be the word of Jesus. They tend to say that the word has been corrupted. As for Quran, they say the word is true but the meaning is different.

 

[rational experiences]

We are all just humans first. Basic advice.

I look at you. You look at me and say human first. Then you say different human second.

Human science observation see and seen says a human life body thinking higher than a beast animal ape.

Human stated. No argument.

Statements humans have many no argument topics.

Hence taught as a human truth owning no argument.

Acceptance. What not to argue about.

Science said our human created entity O earth. A mass. Stone. A planet. As we stand upon that planet

No argument. Just words.

Said I will say mass is one no argument. Thinking of its separation destroyed attacked sacrificed life.

No argument was seen.

O planet. Entity one and only.

Created its own gas heavens.

No argument

Science said first human parents everyone's parents. No argument.

Reason seen DNA evaluation stating origin human parent DNA was the same life body.

No argument.

Status what was seen.

Life sacrificed. Mutated DNA. Diversity introduced into human family life.

Science evidence of one life human X two parents human the same.

Hence no human can be special

They believe the insight information idea of messages as important. Not the human self family member.

We were all warned about self idolisation as being a problem caused to family human life.

 

[We Never Know]

A great battle is unfolding.

Religious orthodoxy has failed. The rule of Nations has failed. Our material civilization has failed.

The war between what is good and what is not good is approaching a final battle.

It brings verse 30 of the Quran to light

"Remember how the Unbelievers plotted against thee, to keep thee in bonds, or slay thee, or get thee out (of thy home). They plot and plan, and Allah too plans; but the best of planners is Allah."

What is your vision of the future of this world?

Regards Tony

There will never be a final battle among humans long as groups of human live. There will always be a battle because they will disagree and sooner or later a battle/war will break out. Its human nature and one reason the neanderthals went extinct.
What one sees as good another may/or will see as bad, then comes disagreement, then comes battle. Its been happening since homo sapiens have been evolving,, probably before.