We, verily, believe in Him Who, in the person of the Báb, hath been sent down by the Will of the one true God, the King of Kings, the All-Praised. (Baha’u’llah)
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Yes you are right. Every time God sends His Messenger, it has been shown that the world does not on a broad scale change for them. Each time they have brought a New Heaven and a new earth, despite that neglect of humanity, they have changed the world.
It is a vast difference.
Regards Tony
Tony isn’t this encouraging - so you’re an ant?
‘Should a tiny ant’, the Báb, wishing to stress the limitless potentialities latent in His Dispensation, characteristically affirms, ‘desire in this day to be possessed of such power as to be able to unravel the abstrusest and most bewildering passages of the Qur’án, its wish will no doubt be fulfilled, inasmuch as the mystery of eternal might vibrates within the innermost being of all created things.’ ‘If so helpless a creature,’ is ‘Abdu’l-Bahá’s comment on so startling an affirmation, ‘can be endowed with so subtle a capacity, how much more efficacious must be the power released through the liberal effusions of the grace of Bahá’u’lláh!’
I understand Bahaullah's God, the maiden and Bahaullah himself very well. Such crude stories will not have any effect on a hardened atheist.Thank you for quoting this very beautiful passage. By you quoting this passage you’ve already ensured that the Maiden has made this announcement to you and already added rightfully ‘could ye but understand’ which you appear not to thus far but I was the same at first.
We have had two recent examples of that. One in New Zealand and the other in Sri Lanka. Like all other so called prophets/sons/messengers/manifestations/mahdis in history, your God's attempt and that of his manifestation is abortive.All sciences and all movements are headed towards unity and world cooperation which was the Message of Baha’u’llah so I believe subconsciously all humanity have sensed a new spirit stirring in this age that separates it from the ages of slaves and apartheid etc.
If Islam is defined as Muhammadanism, then Baha'u'llah left it when He became a follower of the Bab, however if Islam is defined as belief in and submission to God, it is clear that Baha'u'llah never left this belief His whole life. In any case whilst the Bab was praying the Salat prescribed by Muhammad Baha'u'llah was also praying the Salat prescribed by Muhammad, Baha'u'llah did not announce that God was changing these till much later, even after the Iqan period according to my knowledge.Bab did not renounce Islam, there a is friend in the Forum who is a Babi, but he is a strong Muslim. I understand Bab used to pray/formal-Salat as other Shia-Muslim use to do, Bab did not renounce Islam, believed both parts of the Kalima (1.Oneness of God and 2.prophet-hood of Muhammad ).
It means that Bahaullah remained a no-religion man between the period , he left religion-Islam in the pre-Iqan period and the Iqan-period. Till his followers announced Bahaullah to be follower of Bahaism in the post-Iqan period, please.
Regards
We have had two recent examples of that. One in New Zealand and the other in Sri Lanka. Like all other so called prophets/sons/messengers/manifestations/mahdis in history, your God's attempt and that of his manifestation is abortive.
"The Bāb was a Twelver Shī'ah through and through, and he and his followers did not see themselves as in opposition to Islam; they saw themselves as the true Muslims." UnquoteIf you study the Bāb's writings, he never refers to his religion as the "Babi Faith" or anything along those lines but rather articulates all of his claims within an Islamic framework. He is in no way non-Islamic per se, but rather post-Islamic, Islamic in the same sense that post-Keynesian economics is Keynesian, if you would. The term the Bāb adopts is bayān, which, if you study the more esoteric traditions of the Shī'ah Imāms, this is nothing but a higher expression of the eternal essence of Islam. The Bāb was a Twelver Shī'ah through and through, and he and his followers did not see themselves as in opposition to Islam; they saw themselves as the true Muslims.
If Islam is defined as Muhammadanism, then Baha'u'llah left it when He became a follower of the Bab, however if Islam is defined as belief in and submission to God, it is clear that Baha'u'llah never left this belief His whole life. In any case whilst the Bab was praying the Salat prescribed by Muhammad Baha'u'llah was also praying the Salat prescribed by Muhammad, Baha'u'llah did not announce that God was changing these till much later, even after the Iqan period according to my knowledge.
It is important to know. When one joins Islam one openly with his words recites Kalima (1. Acknowledges Oneness of God and 2.prophet-hood of Muhammad) and starts offering prayers etc and doing the religious actions like Salat as told in Quran and done by Muhammad.
In other words when did Bab and or Bahuallah cease to pray Salat like they used to do as Shia-Twelver-Muslims do or the Sunni-Muslims do.
It is the same question in other words, please.
Regards
"till much later, even after the Iqan period according"Unquote
When did it happen exactly. Please let us know. Right, please?
We Muslims rarely attribute ourselves as "Muhammadanism", and why should we do it when we were named as "Muslim" and our religion as "Islam" by G-d himself?:
AYAH al-Imran 3:19
Arabicإِنَّ الدِّينَ عِندَ اللَّهِ الْإِسْلَامُ وَمَا اخْتَلَفَ الَّذِينَ أُوتُوا الْكِتَابَ إِلَّا مِن بَعْدِ مَا جَاءَهُمُ الْعِلْمُ بَغْيًا بَيْنَهُمْ وَمَن يَكْفُرْ بِآيَاتِ اللَّهِ فَإِنَّ اللَّهَ سَرِيعُ الْحِسَابِ
TransliterationInna alddeena AAinda Allahi al-islamu wama ikhtalafa allatheena ootoo alkitaba illa min baAAdi ma jaahumu alAAilmu baghyan baynahum waman yakfur bi-ayati Allahi fa-inna Allaha sareeAAu alhisabi
Literal
(Word by Word) Indeed, the religion near Allah (is) submission/Islam. And not differed those who were given the Book except from after [what] came to them [the] knowledge out of envy among them. And whoever disbelieves in (the) Verses (of) Allah, then indeed, Allah (is) swift (in taking) account.
Sher AliSurely the true religion with ALLAH is Islam. And those who were given the Book did not disagree but, after knowledge had come to them, out of mutual envy. And whoso denies the Signs of ALLAH, then surely ALLAH is quick at reckoning.
al-Imran 3:19
AYAH al-Hajj 22:78
Arabicوَجَاهِدُوا فِي اللَّهِ حَقَّ جِهَادِهِ هُوَ اجْتَبَاكُمْ وَمَا جَعَلَ عَلَيْكُمْ فِي الدِّينِ مِنْ حَرَجٍ مِّلَّةَ أَبِيكُمْ إِبْرَاهِيمَ هُوَ سَمَّاكُمُ الْمُسْلِمِينَ مِن قَبْلُ وَفِي هَٰذَا لِيَكُونَ الرَّسُولُ شَهِيدًا عَلَيْكُمْ وَتَكُونُوا شُهَدَاءَ عَلَى النَّاسِ فَأَقِيمُوا الصَّلَاةَ وَآتُوا الزَّكَاةَ وَاعْتَصِمُوا بِاللَّهِ هُوَ مَوْلَاكُمْ فَنِعْمَ الْمَوْلَىٰ وَنِعْمَ النَّصِيرُ
TransliterationWajahidoo fee Allahi haqqa jihadihi huwa ijtabakum wama jaAAala AAalaykum fee alddeeni min harajin millata abeekum ibraheema huwa sammakumu almuslimeena min qablu wafee hathaliyakoona alrrasoolu shaheedan AAalaykum watakoonoo shuhadaa AAala alnnasi faaqeemoo alssalata waatoo alzzakata waiAAtasimoo biAllahi huwa mawlakum faniAAma almawla waniAAma alnnaseeru
Literal
(Word by Word) And strive for Allah (with the) striving due (to) H He (has) chosen you and not placed upon you in the religion any difficulty. (The) religion (of) your father Ibrahim. He named you those-who-submit/Muslims before and in this, that may be the Messenger a witness over you and you may be witnesses on the mankind. So establish the prayer and give zakah and hold fast to Allah. He (is) your Protector - so an Excellent [the] Protector and an Excellent [the] Helper.
Sher AliAnd strive in the cause of ALLAH as it behoves you to strive for it. HE has chosen you and has laid no hardship upon you in the matter of religion; so follow the faith of your father Abraham; HE has named you Muslims both before and in this Book, so that the Messenger may be a witness over you, and you may be witnesses over mankind. Therefore observe Prayer and pay the Zakaat, and hold fast to ALLAH. HE is your Protector and an Excellent Protector and an Excellent Helper !
al-Hajj 22:78
Right, please?
Bahaullah was unfortunate to leave Quran/Islam/Muhammad if he left Islam even after the end of his Post-Iqan period. It is height of fallibility on the part of Bahaullah, greatest of his mistakes, rather sinful. After-all he was a human being, I understand, and to err is human. Human being are to be loved and not hated, of course.
Regards
Thanks for rating my post as"The Bāb was a Twelver Shī'ah through and through, and he and his followers did not see themselves as in opposition to Islam; they saw themselves as the true Muslims." Unquote
Yes, I agree with one here, please.
Regards
Question: Muhammad did not practice nor instruct his followers to observe the Salat, Obligatory prayers of the Jewish faith. Does that negate Muhammad's revelation, because Muhammad did not follow the Obligatory prayers of the Jews.
Friend @shunyadragon ! It is amply answered in my post #72 . If it is not clear to one, please, feel free for another answer from me. Right, please?Did Muhammad leave Judaism? Since he changed the obligatory prayers (Salat)?
You have not responded to my explanation concerning names and titles of Jesus Muhammad, Bab and Baha'u'llah.
Friend @shunyadragon ! It is amply answered in my post #72 . If it is not clear to one, please, feel free for another answer from me. Right, please?Question: Muhammad did not practice nor instruct his followers to observe the Salat, Obligatory prayers of the Jewish faith. Does that negate Muhammad's revelation, because Muhammad did not follow the Obligatory prayers of the Jews.
Do you deny that Muhammad used to pray with the Jews facing Jerusalem before the changing of the Quiblah?First of all Bahaullah should stand on its own, he claimed to be Sun, he should not try to stand on the shoulders of Judaism. Right, please?
Secondly Muhammad never was a Jew . If yes, please quote his claim from Quran in this connection. Right, please?
Thirdly it is off-topic, please. Right, please?,but never-mind, we are in a friendly mode.
Regards
First of all Bahaullah should stand on its own, he claimed to be Sun, he should not try to stand on the shoulders of Judaism. Right, please?
Secondly Muhammad never was a Jew . If yes, please quote his claim from Quran in this connection. Right, please?
Thirdly it is off-topic, please. Right, please?,but never-mind, we are in a friendly mode.
Bab was a Twelver Shia-Muslim all through his life as I understand from our friend @Komori in post #52 above , and Bab might have made some mistakes in understanding Islam, but that is just another topic. After-all he was just a human being and fallible. But don't overburden Bab with the errors, mistakes. blunders andWhy would the Bab renounce Islam as He claimed to be the Promised One of Islam. Baha’u’llah became a follower of the Bab and always had a religion.
Do you deny that Muhammad used to pray with the Jews facing Jerusalem before the changing of the Quiblah?
He did not renounce Islam just as Christ and Muhammad did not renounce did not renounce Judaism.
142. The fools among the people will say: "What hath turned them from the Qiblah to which they were used?" Say: to Allah belong both East and West; He guideth whom He will to a Way that is straight.Kindly quote from Quran, please. One is surely mistaken.
Regards