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Was Hitler Christian?

Thesavorofpan

Is not going to save you.
I don't think he was a christian because I have heard that he went into the churches and replaced the bible with the book he wrote, so maybe he wanted to use the church as another means to control his people. Though there are rumors that after Hitler wiped out the jews he would turned his attention on christianity, but it could just be a rumor.
 

TheKnight

Guardian of Life
I don't understand... do you implement Christ's teachings always?
No. I am not a Christian. I find Pauline Christianity to be an abhorrent thing. I believe in Judaism. Jesus and his teachings are quite irrelevant to me.

What if I implement Christ's teachings, but don't believe him to be a savior?


That would make you not a Christian.

Says who? By your standards, wouldn't most people claiming to be Christians not actually be Christians?

Any person that's ever read the Christian Bible and looked at Jesus teachings can clearly see that most people claiming to be Christians are not actually Christians. They claim it because they were born into it, or they go to church on Easter and Christmas. Etc.

I'm not a Christian. I don't want to be. I used to be though. I believed that Jesus was God's son, who died for our sins, and I honestly tried to implement his teachings in my life.

It was in that process that I realized it cannot be done because Christianity is irreconcilably internally inconsistent.

All of the evidence shows that.

Perhaps you should go read the Old Testament. Paul contradicts what it teaches quite often.
 

dust1n

Zindīq
That would make you not a Christian.

Ok, so if I perfectly emulate Christ's teachings but don't believe him to be the savior, I'm not Christian.

So does the necessity to believe Christ is the savior and to implements his teachings the necessity of being Christian.
 

fallingblood

Agnostic Theist
All of the evidence points to the fact that Christianity began as a Jewish movement. And study on the founding of Christianity shows that Jesus was a Jew, and that his message was under the umbrella of Judaism until decades after his death. Now, even some of the things Jesus said went against the Old Testament, but that doesn't mean anything.

The reason is because the Old Testament did not exist during the time of Jesus. The books existed, but it had not been put together. Meaning, Paul did not have to be agree with everything in the Old Testament as that is not exactly what Judaism taught during the 1st century.
 
Yes. Hitler repeatedly said that he was doing the "work of G-d" by killing the Jews.

And he was baptised Catholic when he was a kid, and as far as I know, once you get baptised you are a Catholic for life.
 

blackout

Violet.
Yes. Hitler repeatedly said that he was doing the "work of G-d" by killing the Jews.

And he was baptised Catholic when he was a kid, and as far as I know, once you get baptised you are a Catholic for life.


That is TOTAL BULL-**IT.

I was baptised a Catholic
and I am NOOOOoooooo Catholic. :no:

Normally I just mind my business
and let people be whoever/whatever they want,
but if anyone tries to tell me I'm still Catholic
as if they are some authority on the matter...
I will spit on their shoes.

(not that this post was directed at you ShaunGoldstein)

Catholic doctrine no longer applies to me AS I REJECT IT.
It has nothing at all to do with me, or my life.
period.
 

Jayhawker Soule

-- untitled --
Premium Member
Yes. Hitler repeatedly said that he was doing the "work of G-d" by killing the Jews.
Wonderful ...
Q: Was Hitler Christian?
A: Yes. Hitler repeatedly said that he was doing the "work of G-d" by killing the Jews.​
... that was really, really dumb. But, going back to the question, would someone please tell me why it's anything other than a worthless preamble to a disgusting and irresponsible argument?
 

TheKnight

Guardian of Life
Ok, so if I perfectly emulate Christ's teachings but don't believe him to be the savior, I'm not Christian.

So does the necessity to believe Christ is the savior and to implements his teachings the necessity of being Christian.

You are correct. According to the New Testament one must implement Jesus' teachings as well as believe that he died for their sins and rose again.

All of the evidence points to the fact that Christianity began as a Jewish movement. And study on the founding of Christianity shows that Jesus was a Jew, and that his message was under the umbrella of Judaism until decades after his death. Now, even some of the things Jesus said went against the Old Testament, but that doesn't mean anything.

The reason is because the Old Testament did not exist during the time of Jesus. The books existed, but it had not been put together. Meaning, Paul did not have to be agree with everything in the Old Testament as that is not exactly what Judaism taught during the 1st century.

If you are convinced then you are convinced. Believe as you wish.

Yes. Hitler repeatedly said that he was doing the "work of G-d" by killing the Jews.

Just because you say you're doing the work of God doesn't make you a Christian.
 

Storm

ThrUU the Looking Glass
Setting aside my personal beliefs on Hitler....

He was a ******* LUNATIC. What's more, he was a ******* lunatic with a track record of mutilating multiple religions. The swastika was a beautiful Hindu symbol before he got hold of it. Asatru was likewise put to twisted use. Why is Christianity any different?

I'm sick and tired of people trying to foist Hitler on religions for ax-grinding. Atheists call him Christian. Christians say he was atheist, or pagan.

Who cares? Every faith (and lack thereof) has its share of madmen.
 

tumbleweed41

Resident Liberal Hippie
Setting aside my personal beliefs on Hitler....

He was a ******* LUNATIC. What's more, he was a ******* lunatic with a track record of mutilating multiple religions. The swastika was a beautiful Hindu symbol before he got hold of it. Asatru was likewise put to twisted use. Why is Christianity any different?

I'm sick and tired of people trying to foist Hitler on religions for ax-grinding. Atheists call him Christian. Christians say he was atheist, or pagan.

Who cares? Every faith (and lack thereof) has its share of madmen.

Amen sister!
 

AxisMundi

E Pluribus Unum!!!
Biblically speaking he was not a Christian. I admit (I lost a debate on this once where the opponent presented mounds of evidence that he professed Christian ideas) that he probably believed in some form of Christianity and called himself a Christian.

But it doesn't mean he was one. I would posit that many Christians think they are Christians but Biblically speaking are not. It makes me wonder how exactly such people should be labelled.

Hitler met the only crieria neccessary, or even possible.

A belief in and an active worship of Jesus Christ.

There is no such thing as a "true Christian".
 

Duck

Well-Known Member
Was Hitler a Christian? Was Hitler Christian?

Does it really matter?

Was the man A christian? By his own words, yes. Was he an exemplary christian, probably not. Should people hold the fact that he was a christian against all christians? No, even I, with as many hangups as I have with christianity in general, cannot stoop that low, it is too intellectually dishonest.

I do have to ask why you started this thread? It kind of smacks of being biased.
 

Oberon

Well-Known Member
For a variety of resons National Socialism was bound to take an anti-Christian attitude. Not only did it reject the Jewish background of Christianity and of the Old Testament, but Christian ethics - compassion, charity, mercy- milllitated against the Nazi creed no less than against Marxism. " The author goes on to describe extensively Nazi descrimination against churches and christianity. This excerpt is from the book "Leftism" by Professor Erik von Kuehnelt-Leddihn.

Again- "The party member was expected as a matter of course to lead an exemplary family life, to send his children to the Hitler Youth, to sever active connections with the Church and to bring his family to the various national socialist ceremonies aimed, among others, at undermining religious allegiance by replacing its ritual" from "The Totalitarian Party: Party and People in Nazi Germany and Soviet Russia" by Aryeh L. Unger, Senior Lecturer in Political Science at the Hebrew University, Jerusalem.

For information on Hitler's personal hatred against Christianity check out the two volume biography by John Toland titled "Adolf Hitler"

Some Hitler quotes you can check out online:

"



[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]Night of 11th-12th July, 1941[/FONT]
  • [FONT=Arial,Helvetica]"National Socialism and religion cannot exist together....[/FONT]
    [FONT=Arial,Helvetica]"The heaviest blow that ever struck humanity was the coming of Christianity. Bolshevism is Christianity's illegitimate child. Both are inventions of the Jew. The deliberate lie in the matter of religion was introduced into the world by Christianity....[/FONT]
    [FONT=Arial,Helvetica]"Let it not be said that Christianity brought man the life of the soul, for that evolution was in the natural order of things." (p 6 & 7)[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]10th October, 1941, midday[/FONT]
  • [FONT=Arial,Helvetica]"Christianity is a rebellion against natural law, a protest against nature. Taken to its logical extreme, Christianity would mean the systematic cultivation of the human failure." (p 43)[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]14th October, 1941, midday[/FONT]
  • [FONT=Arial,Helvetica]"The best thing is to let Christianity die a natural death.... When understanding of the universe has become widespread... Christian doctrine will be convicted of absurdity....[/FONT]
    [FONT=Arial,Helvetica]"Christianity has reached the peak of absurdity.... And that's why someday its structure will collapse....[/FONT]
    [FONT=Arial,Helvetica]"...the only way to get rid of Christianity is to allow it to die little by little....[/FONT]
    [FONT=Arial,Helvetica]"Christianity <is> the liar....[/FONT]
    [FONT=Arial,Helvetica]"We'll see to it that the Churches cannot spread abroad teachings in conflict with the interests of the State." (p 49-52)[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]19th October, 1941, night[/FONT]
  • [FONT=Arial,Helvetica]"The reason why the ancient world was so pure, light and serene was that it knew nothing of the two great scourges: the pox and Christianity."[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]21st October, 1941, midday[/FONT]
  • [FONT=Arial,Helvetica]"Originally, Christianity was merely an incarnation of Bolshevism, the destroyer....[/FONT]
    [FONT=Arial,Helvetica]"The decisive falsification of Jesus' <who he asserts many times was never a Jew> doctrine was the work of St.Paul. He gave himself to this work... for the purposes of personal exploitation....[/FONT]
    [FONT=Arial,Helvetica]"Didn't the world see, carried on right into the Middle Ages, the same old system of martyrs, tortures, *******? Of old, it was in the name of Christianity. Today, it's in the name of Bolshevism. Yesterday the instigator was Saul: the instigator today, Mardochai. Saul was changed into St.Paul, and Mardochai into Karl Marx. By exterminating this pest, we shall do humanity a service of which our soldiers can have no idea." (p 63-65)[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]13th December, 1941, midnight[/FONT]
  • [FONT=Arial,Helvetica]"Christianity is an invention of sick brains: one could imagine nothing more senseless, nor any more indecent way of turning the idea of the Godhead into a mockery.... <here insults people who believe transubstantiation>....[/FONT]
    [FONT=Arial,Helvetica]"When all is said, we have no reason to wish that the Italians and Spaniards should free themselves from the drug of Christianity. Let's be the only people who are immunised against the disease." (p 118-119)[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]14th December, 1941, midday[/FONT]
  • [FONT=Arial,Helvetica]"Kerrl, with noblest of intentions, wanted to attempt a synthesis between National Socialism and Christianity. I don't believe the thing's possible, and I see the obstacle in Christianity itself....[/FONT]
    [FONT=Arial,Helvetica]"Pure Christianity-- the Christianity of the catacombs-- is concerned with translating Christian doctrine into facts. It leads quite simply to the annihilation of mankind. It is merely whole-hearted Bolshevism, under a tinsel of metaphysics." (p 119 & 120)[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]9th April, 1942, dinner[/FONT]
  • [FONT=Arial,Helvetica]"There is something very unhealthy about Christianity." (p 339)[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica]27th February, 1942, midday[/FONT]
  • [FONT=Arial,Helvetica]"It would always be disagreeable for me to go down to posterity as a man who made concessions in this field. I realize that man, in his imperfection, can commit innumerable errors-- but to devote myself deliberately to errors, that is something I cannot do. I shall never come personally to terms with the Christian lie."[/FONT]
    [FONT=Arial,Helvetica]"Our epoch in the next 200 years will certainly see the end of the disease of Christianity.... My regret will have been that I couldn't... behold <its demise>." (p 278)"[/FONT]
from Adolf Hitler, Christian, Atheist, or Neither

When it comes to understanding the beliefs of a man who used propaganda to achieve his ends, actions speak louder than words. The Nazi party discouraged church activity, and actively attempted to stamp out christianity from Germany.
 

Oberon

Well-Known Member
From a similar conversation:

I only cite websites because you do. My real citations come from scholarships, not wikipedia. The above blather is simply indicative of your inability to deal with the evidence, which plainly shows the following:

1. The Nazis oppressed the clergy
2. The persecuted the churches
3. They replaced all religious churches with political ones (replacing Christ with Hitler, the bible with Mein Kamp, religious iconography with political iconography
4. The top leadership positions of the Nazi party were all atheists
5. Mao and Stalin, whose massacres and atrocities exceeded even those commited by the Nazis, were even more expressly atheistic and anti-religious, not even engaging in the pro-christian propaganda of hitler
6. You base all of you information on whatever websites you find (i.e. wikipedia), and they don't even agree with your views.

The Nazi ideology was clearly not christian, their policies and actions were clearly anti-christian, and none of your evidence has shown anything to the contrary (in fact, wikipedea, your primary source for seemingly all your information on any given topic contradicts your view).

You simply don't know what you are talking about.
 

dust1n

Zindīq
You are correct. According to the New Testament one must implement Jesus' teachings as well as believe that he died for their sins and rose again.

Okay, I guess I should have made it clear this was the question I was really interested in. No emulates Christ's teachings at all times. So then where do I draw the line? How many deeds have to be done to accompany the belief? How much sin makes someone no longer Christian?
 

dust1n

Zindīq
1) We don't know.

2) It doesn't matter.

Fair enough, but then I wonder why you commented, seeing 75% of the topics in the religious debate section also applies.


why do you ask?

Really, I wanted to get to the question that about the 'Scotsman predicament', but to be honest I didn't know anything about Hitler's stance, as I've heard both repeatedly, and I thought I could kill two birds with one stone.

Does it really matter?

Again no, nothing matters without context. This question.. this thread.. this website.. my computer.. myself.. my home.. my state.. my universe.. none of it really matters. Now that that it is out of the way...

I do have to ask why you started this thread? It kind of smacks of being biased.
Would you have preferred if I asked 'Was Hitler Atheist'?
 
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