Watchtower: Jesus is not "a god"!

[oldbadger]

Just wondering if Oeste ever answered this. I haven't read all the posts yet. Also your question about what language was Jesus speaking to the Jews in? And who translated that to Early English? (good questions...) To make it clear, though, I believe Jesus was given divine power, he was with God "in the beginning," and can rightfully be called a God, a very powerful one.

Hello.
We were all there in the beginning, well our materials were.
I acknowledge your belief about Jesus, but I think he was a man who, with the Baptist, demonstrated and campaigned against a greedy, hypocritical, treacherous and corrupt priesthood.

 

[rational experiences]

The theme, storytelling and male self says I was there at the beginning, stating science, and you are a human male, conscious as a human, in human form, bio and bio chemical, consciousness...as the form you own. The storyteller in human owned and applied information. As a human.

So if you claim that a male was first sacrificed as a God self, then you would have to ask, what changed God. Now if a male is known liar and coercer in science thesis, would he claim by his embarrassment that he was wrong, or would he make some claim that somehow some other reason was involved like sex?

Which would then make any human question why was sex, the choice wrong?

Real answer, sex always brings the scientist back into owning another evolved life, after science attacks/destroys life.......human reasoning.

Today after the ICE AGE and human DNA reincarnated/returned to life owning newly formed life with new animal spirits who came out of the eternal, seeing the story said that when you die and get life sacrificed you end up in the eternal. So seeing archaeology proved that once a long time ago, machine parts found inside of the Earth deep digs in fusion and human artefacts inside of coal....then obvious you were there then...and came back. We own a claim, hence we know we ended up in the eternal after life was sacrificed/removed from existing.

Archaeology does prove that we lived before, why we can tell the story.

Our own spiritual claim as humans.

How embarrassing it must have been to realise that human sex, newly born babies, growing back into adults as the atmospheric mass evolved, brought you back into scientific awareness. Knowing, and also owning self male confession, I did it, our brother was Satan/ist he says. Knowing, always did know. That human males in science destroyed our life.

So today in modern day life, after mutated Moses history brought all of our lives back together in one place, a generation that was lost in space with no time left to start again. It is real. For DNA today is evolved/returned and lost DNA from before.

And humans remember and say my Father was right. Claim it as a spiritual human argument. I know he was, for he was spiritual and not a scientist. Everyone owns the same memories of Father that I do.

As a female and a daughter I also did not believe in modern times about God holiness and holy Father for I heard the first daughter recorded life crying when he died, asking and begging his spirit not to leave us. So I had no reason to believe in him in my life.

But I learnt all about spirit and our Holy Father, when I was attacked. And heard him speak to me, he said my name, and I knew that he had not personally known me up until that moment. So I had it proven to me.

Yet I read daily quotes of humans quoting Holy Father. Yet do so from literature. If I asked a consensus of humans, do you really believe in our owned Holy Father, the types of comments would own a no...for various reasons. One the fact that you keep claiming he is God. When science described God from a holy spiritual male life conscious depiction, as how the spirit gases/sacrificed daily own circulation replacement, as the term G O D...just a circle O.

I know our Father is not just a circle.

Therefore if our brother the scientist who is also occult taught says and believes and uses memories like all of us do, claims that Jesus was with the first original males in science a long time ago....then why did he blame his Father sacrificing his life claiming he was saving our life the scientist history, after the ICE AGE...seeing it is the only place that life for modern human returned?

Why do some males thinking claim the human Jesus was with the God science self originally? Which would make you think about what they claim Jesus represents to them in their theorising. I learnt that they theorised pi O and also phi O, so would have quoted that 2 forms of male science thesis was inferred.

Therefore thesis claims O how the spirit of light gas sacrificed moved in the great deep of the spatial vacuum, burning/cooling circulating on the face of water was O G O D, then J E S U S in a circle also would own stated representation in symbolism.

And PHI would be aligned to why his life living on the ground was sacrificed by activating gas burning fall out, or the spirits that fell by a third of the mass.

The Copiale Cipher: An Early German Masonic Ritual Unveiled - Scottish Rite of Freemasonry, S.J., U.S.A.

And Jesus had no connection whatsoever to the historic past, for origin male was never really named. Change was named. J E S U S would have verified why life was sacrificed by using letter/to number quotes. About 1,987 years ago.

A theme, a story was named about the past, yet it was only written after verbal and thinking conditions in modern day life, to reinvent science.

The argument states a condition about Jesus having belonged to the holy land of the Hebrew people as DNA. Yet Moses discussed a mass emigration when the population was nuclear blasted and sacrificed in his times...and they left for Iced continents. Many of the immigrants came back to their own land much later.

The DNA of the victim was therefore not really known precisely. The Jewish history, to use science however said that the terms of G O D caused their lives to be the worst sacrificed historically for how their ground mass/plates had changed by landscape.

As we are the storyteller, we always need to impose self human explanation in the detailing of the subject by intent, it is a human discussing science cause and effect.

Now I would ask a scientist, what is the power of the Sun, if the spatial vacuum was not constantly cooling it, as an actual body of force? The real answer would be, no one would know. Yet that is the intention when you theme you know the Sun without the vacuum......for you never would know its power in reality. Being how dangerous theism is.

The ism says...Look up -ism in Wiktionary, the free dictionary. -ism is a suffix in many English words, originally derived from the Ancient Greek suffix -ισμός (-ismós), and reaching English through the Latin -ismus, and the French -isme.

As a human lives first to be a theist and owns DNA as part of their conscious awareness, then it is not unrealistic for a human to then claim, yes, it is why they designed fall out conditions PHI, as an opposition to our life owning a similar design within our cells. For every body has to exist first to claim that a pattern is present.

It would be our human owned evidence against our own self. The reasoning why life got sacrificed by gas spirit fall out, too much mass burning for the natural history, spatial vacuum to own cooling to keep natural light just held above our head as a holy body. Logic actually.

Humans know by study that science was reinvented, they know it was practiced in the Egyptian desert and surrounding lands historically, therefore it is why humanity can say that the people living in this land taught that science had sacrificed human life on Earth, as a knowledge.

 

[Oeste]

This seems disappointing; i thought Silence was Golden but instead Silence was time for you to regain your composure and double down on stubbornness. (partial "1 Samuel 15:23 reference")

This is simply another slur directed at me rather than my comments Lymus. It' juvenile and very tiring.

Perhaps Deductive Reasoning, Critical Thinking, and Analytical Skills too much????

No, the slurs are too much.

The jesus you speak of and satan mentioned in the bible both seem to be one in the same or one in agreement

The Jesus "you speak of"?

Are you trying to construct a strawman Jesus for me again? As I told you before Lymus, if you are going to construct a strawman Jesus for me, then I’m going to construct a strawman God for you. We can watch them both burn.

If you cannot engage in civil conversation I see no reason to continue our discussion further

They both try to get the children of men to go against Deu 6:4/ Mar 12:29 / Eph 4:6.

Therefore they both speak of doctrine that is their own, and on their own behalf Joh 7:16

Therefore they both speak of their own will Joh 7:17

Therefore unrighteousness seem to both be in them Joh 7:18

They both seemingly do their own works and say they should be believed Joh 10: 37.

The both seem to be angels or messengers of light 2Co 11:14.

Obviously this is your own personal opinion and not the opinion of any church. Of course you are welcome to your own opinion but I see no correlation to thread theme.

To Sum it up:
Taking what you and the english translation bible says as kosher; then both are liars, deceivers, unrighteous, etc

Well that's an interesting perspective but I think the onus to show Jesus Christ as an unrighteous liar would rest on you, and not the Christian church. There are over a billion that witness otherwise.

 

[Oeste]

The above part of the OP is a lie (five times repeated)!

In spite of Oeste's 'reasoning,' the WT has not declared that Jesus ever denied being "a god!"

Well let's take a good hard look then.



"Dilemma #3: Watchtower claims Jesus is “a god” (John 1:1) but not “a god” (John 10:33)"

Jesus never claimed to be God or 'a god.'

1. Can you clarify what you mean by this? Are you saying John doesn't speak for Jesus, are you saying Jesus doesn't speak "through" John, or are you saying that John only speaks for John at John 1:1 and John 10:33?

2. Can you support this with a Watchtower article?

John (about 60 years after Jesus' death) claimed that the Word was God (or more grammatically probalbe, "a god").

Again, John is an apostle 60 years later. An apostle is not one who sends himself with his own message, but the message of the one who sent him. Do you deny this?

If you do, are you able to offer support via a Watchtower article?

BTW, I noticed that the WT at times likes to speak in terms of "patterns".

When I asked a JW during a "bible study" if John (it may have been some other apostle) followed in the same "pattern" as Jesus Christ they readily stated he did. If John speaks for John then he is not following this "pattern". I was assured this "pattern" is no different from that followed by the prophets of old.

But Jesus never did, and the Watchtower never claimed that he did. Furthermore he never denied that he could be called "a god," as you say, and the Watchtower does not say that he did, as you say!

Full quote from 1962 WT:

66 Jesus told those who wanted to stone him that he had not claimed to be God or a god, even though Psalm 82:6 had called some men, some Israelite judges, “gods.”

(for the full quote, please refer to Tigger's post above)​

Note the Watchtower article states Jesus told those who wanted to stone him that he had NOT claimed to be God or a god. This is not an affirmation Tigger, it's a denial. According to the Watchtower Jesus told the crowd that he had:

1. not claimed to be God and
2. not claimed to be a god.

Did Jesus actually say this? Of course not! When we look to scripture we see no such conversation going on between Jesus and the crowd. Jesus never says "I never claimed to be God" and he never said "I never claimed to be a god" or anything remotely like it. Instead he goes on to tell us how God condemned the corrupt judges of Israel for making themselves "gods" instead of keeping their role as judges.

So who is actually saying it?

It's the Watchtower. The Watchtower places a narrative into the mouth of Jesus that was simply never there.

Show me exactly where the WT has claimed that Jesus denied being "a god."

See above.It's the WT, not the scriptures, and not Jesus that says:

"66 Jesus told those who wanted to stone him that he had not claimed to be God or a god..."
[/quote]

 

[TiggerII]

When you finally understand the difference between had not CLAIMED TO BE ... and DENIED BEING, let me know.

 

[Oeste]

Gonna be hard pressed to find a cohesive answer to that one.

Not really.

"In the beginning the Word was..." is a lot different from saying "The Word was in the beginning..."

But all that's off thread theme.

 

[YoursTrue]

Not really.

"In the beginning the Word was..." is a lot different from saying "The Word was in the beginning..."

But all that's off thread theme.

No, it isn't off thread theme. Because if Jesus was the Word, and the Word was "in the beginning," it doesn't say the Word always -- was -- or is without a beginning.

 

[Oeste]

When you finally understand the difference between had not CLAIMED TO BE ... and DENIED BEING, let me know.

To claim is to assert Tigger. The crowd claimed Jesus had blasphemed for making (claiming) to be "a god" or "God" (depending on your translation).

If I tell you I do not claim to be God or a god, which is what the WT tells us was the conversation Jesus had with the crowd (a conversation not in the scriptures) then I have denied being God and I have denied being a god. In fact, I have specifically disclaimed (denied) both.

If you find a difference between not claim and disclaim, please let me know.

 

[Oeste]

No, it isn't off thread theme. Because if Jesus was the Word, and the Word was "in the beginning," it doesn't say the Word always -- was -- or is without a beginning.

It doesn't say "...and the Word was 'in the beginning'". It says "In the beginning the Word was...".

In other words, "In the beginning..." the Word was already there. The Word would have to be, otherwise the beginning was before the Word which means "Time" existed before Jesus, which means Jesus did not create "all things". (Col 1:16)

But I am not seeing the correlation between this, the crowds claim of blasphemy, the Jews stoning Jesus for being "a god", the Watchtower's claims at John 10:33, or why the NWT would refer readers to Leviticus 24:16 if the crowd is only accusing Jesus of making himself "a god".

 

[rational experiences]

His story. Males as a brotherhood. Group of whatever male x population existed. Same DNA body, same thinker, but owned mass male lives. Scientist agreement by mass male population natural history.

The recorded history, over consciousness to every one single self today. Theist, science, human. Male. Male who changed the heavenly mass above his own head, to witness it burning for 7 days.

Logic says in science....did and could a planet and a heavenly body be formed spatially in 7 days. Utter nonsense in reality....human male story telling.

However a male with a machine who designs a reaction INSTANT said the atmospheric causes lasted for 7 days. As a preaching teaching to his egotistical destroyer science self that he does not own natural cosmological laws, a huge spatial vacuum, by immense thought, oblivion. Oblivion in its natural form, empty space sucking on hot dense state owns why any form mass owns presence.

No machine copies or emulates that information as laws. A machine owns no cosmological natural laws, is supported by it, but never OWNED it. The same as science does not own Earth's natural ICE and cannot infer it in a machine formula.

Yet their mental assessment claims as our life is supported by its presence, the machine reaction should not change natural history. And lie when they make that claim in their thoughts. Why ICE melted and why Stephen Hawking said.......
history on Earth, heavens
Mass owns the presence gases burning as the over body first, a huge greater mass owns the light gases burning
O circulation theme G O D O in the heavens, cooling, upon space and water mass....G O D upon the face of the spatial vacuum and upon the face of water.

Cooled natural mass gas light owns small circulating mass. Original mass he says is just a mass of hot burning gases.

Theme to correlate data by a mass formula extraction. So science first of all lies about infinity for it is a non stop number that goes on forever, for you cannot factor space. They apply a numerical abstraction as a beginning and end formula....so infinite was never involved.

O God the Earth stone mass is involved first. Where machine mass is abstracted from, the gases that they use in the machine out of the stone body. Then science said it would de materialize the Earth x mass, which in real life means to form sink holes as based on Bible book thesis reasoning Jesus. Jesus owned science causing new sink holes. New SIN in other words.

OLD SIN...once O the planet was hot alight burning gas mass. Science thinking about a non relative Earth body. History and strings.

Set alight the God stone mass to abstract it as based on pre existing SCIENCE human thought strings. To set alight the God one stone mass to enact ORIGINAL SIN as a scientist and formed NEW SIN....sink holes.

Removal of SIN introduced a new sin, for human life to live sacrificed, as caused by science involving MASS by a formula that natural bio life does not exist with....abstraction of all forms cold in spatial history.

What science did as an occultist, lied and tried to ANTI life.

So today they tried to infer that ANTI was part of the science theme...so if they found ANTI then they would own machine reaction of ancient science. Ancient science did not begin with ANTI...it caused ANTI....it ended with ANTI.

Why it says AIN and T as a symbolism + of the cross, half lost.

Today we live in an atmosphere that owns microbes in the water mass/oxygen and natural cold light that we all live inside of. Microbes do today the activity that microbes did in the past.

However science in the past said in the times of the dinosaur gas atmosphere NOT 4 SEA of SON......the gases I want relate to giant life he says, in the heavenly body, converting gases in science.

Relativity teaching Bible....4 sea of the son never existed in the converting burning atmospheric gas mass with the giants.

I know says the preacher of it......it was a story against occultist science machine practices...why I taught its relativity.

4 and 2 were therefore holy inferred numbers. As a teaching.

4 seasons.
2 natural and different same human lives.

Not one at all. One only relates to a science formula about abstraction of....so science owns MINUS one - which is not even any cross +.

- minus is the symbol on Earth as the equator, the hottest, just as symbolic relativity teaching. Straight away a human psyche is warned, evil science.


Day 8: Extraembryonic Mesoderm

By day 8, the hypoblast generates another layer of migratory cells - the extra(outside)embryonic mesoderm. The extraembryonic mesoderm (meso = middle) lines the newly formed cavities (coelum) on the outside of the embryo. It will function as a spongy corridor through which the developing uteroplacental circulation system will grow.Stage 5.

All humans today are from sperm and an ovary, the act of human sex.

The theme Bible owns a statement of a review after cause and effect.

What science lied about today, looking back to review causation.

So minus one, attack on self, personal first for any scientist to then have to look back on the attacked sacrificed life, having been sacrificed to ask self what did you do wrong to attack life in a 7 day cycle that changes human being baby life by day 8.

Science, always looks back after the attack, cannot probability term reference what an attack on life by UFO held mass constant would cause, until it was caused to do an appraisal.

Bible states relativity categorically, was written after all facts as a DATA complied documentation of referencing causes to change/sacrificed human life Genetics.

Reasoning for why life changed actually.

Pre lying occult thought....in mass is the origin of light burning as mass. O circulating owned cooling of burning natural light mass and I named that status G O D O....yet only the heavenly mass above my head produced that effect.

What I always lied about as a scientist living on Planet Earth as 2 forms of GOD O inferences...the first body natural mass in a spatial vacuum owning holding, the STONE MASS O first God....then the mass of naturally cooled gas spirit alight above my own head.

Never change GOD he said, never give GOD a name in science, so science today is a proven liar against life continuance on Planet Earth. Always was against our survival by implementing a fake artificial machine invention and then theories, will give natural bio life support to interact with an evil occult radiation machine theory that kills of bio life.

For I destroy natural energy, microbial forms in the water that supports natural food for the human cellular bio and Nature bio life form to continue to exist...it is cellular food.

When I removed half of the ground water mass a long time ago....the water mass supply microbes barely kept the human cellular life body alive in natural cold alight microbial support. So when the microbes goes missing out of the water mass.....life begins to die for not owning the food/energy of the microbial population that supports cellular sustainability.

I always knew this information was fact for I taught that the natural heavenly body was very important as a bio system of my own existence and life continuance. Yet science irradiates water and heats water to do nuclear reactions, which then holds the radiation mass longer in the Earth atmosphere unnaturally...so our gas mass burning increases x mass.

Then it falls out as the natural law in spatial vacuum cannot keep cooled the amount of gases x mass burning as scientific causes.

Science studied the UFO constant body manifestation and detailed/data based it....yet it was already owned and being caused to be held unnaturally too long in our atmosphere, for historically it was disappearing and being held out in space by the gas mass asteroid saviour release and the spatial vacuum.

I caused it to come back into the atmosphere and be held said science with machine manipulation control techniques...radiation/radio wave theories and machines designed to hold that constant radiation x mass. Life then began to die unnaturally again, for the UFO is meant to be leaving our heavenly attack.

Why science is a liar, always was a liar, is only taught and owned by living human being males who lie and coerce all information about control, only by and via and because of design, a machine built by them, owned and controlled by them, with their claim I am a Creator. When in fact their teaching said they are life Destroyer.

 

[rational experiences]

Theme teaching by biological healer science status says, the teaching Christ Revelations....is not Jesus revelations is it?

Said factually, awareness of probable causes would be identified as real for science on Earth in the cross + of the 4 seasons. When Summer changes into autumn a loss in bio Nature and Winter balanced with Summer changes into Spring.

Probability of life sacrifice/attacked was prophesised in the sciences against the Temple pyramid causes in that seasonal change. How it was pre identified to be prophesised caused occur due to science owning the causes of bio life and Nature attack/sacrifice.

Why it was predicted before it was caused, the attack on life and its witnessed attack and life sacrificed in that moment.

The historic greedy elite human claim, I own and control the use and trade of technology, refused both as a petitioned Hebrew group/Roman Temple use by the Christ Revelations, to stop using the Temple sciences. Life was very badly attacked/sacrificed so Rome agreed that science/Satanism/occultism was evil and wrong.

When the agreement by causes was witnessed and lived as a human experience, the very reason why Rome then agreed that the Christ Revelations were real.

Pontius Pilate - Wikipedia Pilate controlled the science Temple continuance

After This, Pilate Going into the Temple of the Jews...

The petition was proven to be served by the teachings of Christ to the hierarchy, who proves that did not listen to the science advice and continued with the technology...so it states that Pilate chose to continue using the Temple in a dangerous cyclic Earth period and life was attacked due to that choice.

Even after pre historic data of life attacked was known, identified and reasoned with the elite. Why the Revelations are a 2 book historic review of life attacked on Earth in science/occult conditions.

Mount Gerizim is one of the two mountains in the immediate vicinity of the key West Bank city of Nablus, and forms the southern side of the valley in which Nablus is situated, the northern side being formed by Mount Ebal. The mountain is one of the highest peaks in the West Bank and rises to 881 m (2,890 ft) above sea level, 70 m (230 ft) lower than Mount Ebal. In Samaritan tradition, Mount Gerizim is held to be the highest, oldest and most central mountain in the world. The mountain is particularly steep on the northern side, is sparsely covered at the top with shrubbery, and lower down there is a spring with a high yield of fresh water.

33 Bible verses about West.

Dendera Temple the Home of Many Ancient Mysteries

 

[YoursTrue]

It doesn't say "...and the Word was 'in the beginning'". It says "In the beginning the Word was...".

In other words, "In the beginning..." the Word was already there. The Word would have to be, otherwise the beginning was before the Word which means "Time" existed before Jesus, which means Jesus did not create "all things". (Col 1:16)

But I am not seeing the correlation between this, the crowds claim of blasphemy, the Jews stoning Jesus for being "a god", the Watchtower's claims at John 10:33, or why the NWT would refer readers to Leviticus 24:16 if the crowd is only accusing Jesus of making himself "a god".

Jesus, the Word, was there "in the beginning." Again, doesn't mean he was without beginning. But what beginning do you think is being referred to at John 1:1?

 

[YoursTrue]

It doesn't say "...and the Word was 'in the beginning'". It says "In the beginning the Word was...".

In other words, "In the beginning..." the Word was already there. The Word would have to be, otherwise the beginning was before the Word which means "Time" existed before Jesus, which means Jesus did not create "all things". (Col 1:16)

But I am not seeing the correlation between this, the crowds claim of blasphemy, the Jews stoning Jesus for being "a god", the Watchtower's claims at John 10:33, or why the NWT would refer readers to Leviticus 24:16 if the crowd is only accusing Jesus of making himself "a god".

That he said he was alive before Abraham made the crowd think he thought he was divine, from heaven in a very special way.

 

[YoursTrue]

To claim is to assert Tigger. The crowd claimed Jesus had blasphemed for making (claiming) to be "a god" or "God" (depending on your translation).

If I tell you I do not claim to be God or a god, which is what the WT tells us was the conversation Jesus had with the crowd (a conversation not in the scriptures) then I have denied being God and I have denied being a god. In fact, I have specifically disclaimed (denied) both.

View attachment 42238​

If you find a difference between not claim and disclaim, please let me know.

From what I see in the Bible, Jesus never claimed to be God. He never claimed to be "a God." Some took it that way, however. And he countered rightly, saying they, too, were considered gods (each one "a" God) by God.

 

[rational experiences]

Males thesis science as THE SIS.....relative historically to messages engraved in stone as false idols....such as Moses owning a large snake striking, versus Egyptian Priest scientists. Who won, Moses did. So you look at the graven images, God the stone mass is entombed spirits, the grave and say Moses was involved a huge atmospheric strike blast.

God and Moses theme, as a spiritual review, not a nice scenario...Egyptian life, destroyed beneath the flood. Sphinx owned striations etched into stone mass by radiation blasting. SINK HOLES the reversed/shifted mountain mass theme...flood filled up the holes and only the flooded ground with pyramid mountain peak remained above water line.

Most of life on Earth eradicated as said. Moses life as the witness event stated only a small human and animal population existed afterwards as survivors, mutated life.

Study of bones of that 13,000 year ago event, when ICE melted then also real.

So males as the scientist, human designer theist in person says I own a code against my own natural self survival and called it ANTI...and said I ANTI Christ.

Why Jesus owned a modern day life sacrificed theme, that said I was a survivor of original science DNA attack, now I am totally eradicated theme. I lived before Abraham did as DNA in the past, as a Christ to Jesus DNA exodus/gone forever.

So males as science said I own a scientific male encoded life sacrifice and own bible statements about when I next try to destroy all life on Earth.

And here the theme is...TRUMP. America science scene of the original crime, linked to the Roman I did not listen self science history. Arguing against who owns life destruction. Both of you do as Abominators of spatial cold by heated radiation.
What Does the Bible Say About Donald Trump?

52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

If you cannot corrupt the dead, it is because they are already dead...own historically a gas mass before stone that was burning first. So therefore the gases can only go back as far as a burning gas.

Yet we live on a cold mass fused stone, not a gas/spirit body...the term what we walk on, or walk upon.

Trump plus ET. Planet Earth is male stated and named by them historically to be plan and ET.

The God first origin and ONE body is stone, so if you were going to blast the stone body of one, it said Trump will be in life when it gets blasted. What the male warning ownership both human, self, male in groups, elite, greedy and controlling.

A self male human prophecy to be made aware to self of self science intention. By namesake presence. For no man is GOD, hence Trump personally does not own a biblical power/energy or spirit status. He is after all just a male/man.

So if you left self, male occult science human self warnings, then the name Trump owns a warning about probability in maths and science. As a future told theme about relative scientific deceits.

About space, holy space being cold and that all form owns presence only due to cold space. So you would not be a supporter of the abomination of the Mother or heated space scientific formulas/machines or theories.

64 Bible verses about Trumpet

Said 2 Trumpets, the first blasting of Earth when the collider was activated, real.

Strong's Hebrew: 2051. וְדָן (Vedan) -- a place of unknown location

Blasting/shut down event collider 2011, 9 years ago. 40 the breaking of law verdict 2051....says unknown. For it never was known.

Trump would not be present in first trump et blast.

Present
Pres I dent....present means it was pre sent already.
Pres ID ent. ENT in spirit theme was a walking tree, that could walk above the ground. So if you wanted to release a trapped bio life, would you not also have wanted to release the roots/ground of the Nature Garden held in the mass of the ground/dirt? The real answer would be yes, it would be theoried.

Trump in power when you get the dents.

White house lawn got a sink hole when Trump was in office.

'The Devil Is Coming!!!': Twitter Freaks Out Over Sinkhole Near White House

History of males as living humans in science. Did sink holes pre exist on Planet Earth from previous sun attack? The answer is yes, it was already pre sent.

Occultism, an ignorant and lying male human condition. To lie about science being safe when the infinite vacuum owned the cooling of the hot dense state.

Machines do not own the sun and nor does it own the spatial vacuum effect. To Learn about power without the vacuum dealing with hot dense state is when science realized it was wrong about what a Sun is, as a power body, for the spatial vacuum kept it cooled. Hence claiming you know is just an egotistical human lying state in science.

 

[rational experiences]

From what I see in the Bible, Jesus never claimed to be God. He never claimed to be "a God." Some took it that way, however. And he countered rightly, saying they, too, were considered gods (each one "a" God) by God.

One O a circle.....light by quote circle 12 hours of a circulating light cooling condition, natural.

Explained and expressed in science by symbolism, O G the spiral re forming to O. O can split in heating into a D shape as D/D...and then cooled back to O O. How it was explained to be holy and relative to natural gas/spirit and existing conditions.

No man is God, and no man owned God. The atmospheric mass did. God hence was spirit body mass owner the heavens. As taught and explained.

Relativity, quotes, male and self and science. Theme mountain tip removal from mass of mountain, beneath water....relativity advice.

UFO removal of the mass.

Theory if a mountain tip can be removed then so could a pyramid. I saw a vision of the High Priest science brother coercing our family to stand inside of the pyramid, a grey flaking body floated burnt off the walls. They combusted.

Self combustion in scientific heavenly gas mass relevant, with little surrounding damage.

Science advice, bio conscious flesh owner....included animals and self. Not Garden Nature in theory.

Garden Nature therefore survived self combustion history, large giant dinosaurs the evil Satanic fallout gas burning therefore owned God and the beast history, the giants. As caused by angelic God fall out, spirit gases x mass that fell.

Real story.

Theist I proposed that theme, occult converting for a holy belief. To remove physical self so self could go back to just living in spirit as an eternal spirit. From where they were removed. WAS NOT, any holy saving theme. But that history and thesis is why saving from SIN was taught life to be sacrificed a Holy act of saving you.

Argument in science, only after the fact, first science quotes about natural were about natural in natural presence. 2nd Act, removal of life, not holy, not saving human life. Was human life removal by sacrifice and taught relative to being a Holy cause, being want of it removal.

Argument about never having actually been saved, we were living naturally and healthier first, survived only. The Jesus teachings said we survived being life sacrificed but live with the sacrifice so live with Jesus everyday being life sacrificed.

Theory of relativity spatial womb vacuum by Year 2012 would with Saviour wandering star gas release remove the UFO occult attack. Life would then return to owning a higher water mass and oxygenation/microbial energy...for a healthier and spiritual life.

Science never allowed us to achieve our healing/return.

Prophecy proof, the sacrifice would return to life in the future again and again as proof that humans and science/occult caused it. Origin of light and saving, belonged to cold spatial womb/vacuum and water. Removed by increasing in a Satanic Luciferian theme....to mass increase the spirit burning to allow for radiation fall out to ground remove by Satanic gas alight spirit beings the equals to each human into which the Satanic fallen angel body entered.

History, preached by the Priest science memory....I sent you all to Hell by God thesis...as the male occult science historical evidence against self.

Reality, to believe in life sacrificed to save you was always an incorrect teaching, why I never believed it was Holy. Reality what you see is what you see....so do not ignore what you see first.

 

[Iymus]

I believe this is because the WT recognizes the dilemma of proclaiming Jesus “a god” at John 10:33 even if many Witnesses do not.

This is a lie.

According to the NWT, the blasphemy was for abusing Jehovah’s name, not some “gods’” name:

This would not be incorrect based off how the jews he spoke to misinterpreted his words

In effect, both JW.ORG and the NWT are giving backhand support for the Trinitarian translation that the crowd was about to stone Jesus for calling himself Jehovah, and not for simply referring to himself as “a god”.

This is a lie.

Dilemma #2: Biblical/Historical record

Jehovah Witnesses and other Arians are quick to tell us that judges, magistrates, and other powerful people were routinely considered or called “gods”. The problem here is that the NWT tells us the Jews were about to stone Jesus for calling himself “a god”.

Valid point but at the same time It doesn't matter if translated as "God or "a god" once have the context from the surrounding verses.

Christ is not the God "Possessor of Heaven and Earth". God of Heaven and Earth is the Heavenly Father alone.

In fact, the WT claims that at John 10:33, Jesus specifically denies he’s “a god” at all!

Christ denies the interpretation of the Jews, put's his own words into context, says he is God's Son "Son of God", and says if his works not of his God who sent him then believe him not.

The last thing you want to do with a stone wielding crowd is compare yourself to Israel’s judges of old. Why? Because the judges of old were condemned by Jehovah God! In other words, Jesus is saying “The judges of old were “sons of God”, I am the son of God, the judges of old were “gods” and I just told you I was “a god”, the judges of old were condemned by God…so what on earth is taking you so long to condemn me?”

If that doesn’t get a rock hurtling by your ear, I don’t know what would, and therein lays the Watchtower’s dilemma. They simply can’t have Jesus comparing himself to the corrupt judges of Israel by declaring he’s “a god” at John 10:33, and they certainly can’t have the crowd thinking that Jesus had just declared himself “God”.

babbling

· 66 Jesus told those who wanted to stone him that he had not claimed to be God or a god, even though Psalm 82:6 had called some men, some Israelite judges, “gods.”

True.

How the WT got Jesus to deny being God and/or “a god” at John 10:33 is baffling, but I suppose if you’re a Jehovah Witness it’s all there right there, embedded somewhere in the text.

Because it was not his words, but interpretation of his words by those who had no understanding of them.

Let’s not forget that Jehovah Witnesses tell us Jesus is “a god” at John 1:1 so it’s really disconcerting to see them claiming Jesus denies ever being “a god” by the time John 10:33 rolls around. But as the quote and link above shows, this is “current truth” even to this day.

This would be incorrect. Neither does the bible you read says "The Word is God" or "The Word has been God".

Difference Between Has Been and Was | Difference Between

so it’s really disconcerting to see them claiming Jesus denies ever being “a god” by the time John 10:33 rolls around. But as the quote and link above shows, this is “current truth” even to this day.

It’s a confusing, contradictory Christology.

because you lack understanding.

also

www.religiousforums.com/threads/watchtower-jesus-is-not-a-god.235497/page-19#post-6786345

 

[Brian2]

Jesus, the Word, was there "in the beginning." Again, doesn't mean he was without beginning. But what beginning do you think is being referred to at John 1:1?

The beginning before anything was created. We know the Word was not created (John 1:3) so why do you want to say that the Word had a beginning?
"Beginning" at Gen 1:1 means before anything was created also. The heavens where the angels live was not created then. (In the beginning God created the heavens..........) so the angels were not created then.
The idea that the angels were created before this is an invention and is not in the Bible.

 

[Brian2]

following may or may not be a contradiction to each other

The Word was not created because the Word created all things, but Jesus the man is part of creation because He stepped into the creation (at least partially) when He became a man,,,,,,,,,,,,,.

until the end Luk 1:32 , 1Co 15:24-28.

Luke 1:32The Lord God will give him the throne of his father David, 33 and he will reign over Jacob’s descendants forever; his kingdom will never end.”
Are you trying to say that the Bible is contradicting itself?

most importantly Col 1:19 & Jas 1:17

You will have to do more than point to scriptures which I agree with, unless you are agreeing with me.

perhaps Son of God by nature and declared Most High thru the prophets in the OT and by himself and followers in NT.

Besides possibly the Son giving his name to Jacob; I do not know his new name to my knowledge. Perhaps the Father's name he came in, but not his new name.

Heb 1:4 So he became as much superior to the angels as the name he has inherited is superior to theirs.
Phil 2:9 Therefore God exalted him to the highest place
and gave him the name that is above every name,

Sounds like Yahweh to me. But there are many other places where Jesus is called Yahweh by implication.

Isaiah 43:10 & Eph 4:6 & John 7:17

Isa 43:10 “You are my witnesses,” declares the Lord,
“and my servant whom I have chosen,
so that you may know and believe me
and understand that I am he.
Before me no god was formed,
nor will there be one after me.

So if Jesus is an uncreated god then He is Yahweh, one with His Father.

Eph 4:6 one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all.

Jesus is over all and through all and in all and Jesus is in the Father. The Father is the one God and in Him is the Son and the Holy Spirit. The Son, even though equal to the Father, submits to the will of His Father. The Holy Spirit is in God and is everywhere as the body of God, yet the Spirit is shown in the scriptures to be alive and to have the qualities of a living person.

John 7:17 Anyone who chooses to do the will of God will find out whether my teaching comes from God or whether I speak on my own.

The Son was sent as a human, a servant, to do the will of His Father.

In Deuteronomy 6 verse 2 I see "his" and not "their"

HIS (determiner, pronoun) definition and synonyms | Macmillan Dictionary
His is the possessive form of he,

In Deuteronmy 6 verse 4 I see "is" and not "are"

Is vs. Are.

When deciding whether to use is or are, look at whether the noun is plural or singular. If the noun is singular, use is. If it is plural or there is more than one noun, use are. The cat is eating all of his food.

The rope, our rope is one. Composite one, the rope is made of more than one thread.
We are talking of one God so the sentence shows all things as singular, but that does not mean that "One" is not a composite one.
IOWs Yahweh is a composite One, there is one God only. That is what monotheism is all about, even if in that one God is His Son and Spirit.
Let us make man in our image and likeness, so God made man in His image and likeness. One God more than one (for want of a better word) persons, consciousness.

 

[Iymus]

The Word was not created because the Word created all things

at a specific point in the beginning he created all things. However he is a creation or beginning of creation himself.

Luke 1:32The Lord God will give him the throne of his father David, 33 and he will reign over Jacob’s descendants forever; his kingdom will never end.”
Are you trying to say that the Bible is contradicting itself?

During the time of his rulership his kingdom will never end and be forever.

During the time of Solomon's rulership his kingdom was forever.

So if Jesus is an uncreated god then He is Yahweh, one with His Father.

Unbiblical assertion.

God does not change, neither does he give what he owns and is over to himself.

Joh 5:26

Perhaps you are one of those that believe the word was not the the Son of God until he was made flesh. If so that assertion is incorrect based of the current translations, consistency, and conventional wisdom.

Joh 1:18

Joh 1:34

The rope, our rope is one. Composite one, the rope is made of more than one thread.

How many nouns or existences make up that one rope?
You are using a rope to define the Divinity or Godhead which is of the Father?

Act 17:29

Rom 1:20

Let us make man in our image and likeness, so God made man in His image and likeness. One God more than one (for want of a better word) persons, consciousness.

If going to play the pronoun game; And why did in Gen 1:29 he said "I" while in verse 26 he said "Us"?

Food for thought.

One God more than one (for want of a better word) persons, consciousness.

More than one will and authority?