Wealth acquisition and distribution?

[Revoltingest]

Enlighten me. Tell me.

I won't derail the thread.
But I'll list one....
Preventing monopolies.

 

[Estro Felino]

And yet there's your hero Putin in Russia, waging war with the world for the sake of his ego, and here is the criminal thief and rapist Donald Trump in the US intent on destroying the US government to create a dictatorship. And each of them with millions of loyal supporters.

I don't support either of them.
My hero is Robert Kennedy Jr.
That said, in Russia there is socialism. And it's a very softened version of Bolshevism.
But they have same problems as in the US: oligarchs.

 

[Audie]

It was a reaction to the word "envy".
Stop using "envy" and I'll stop using "greed".

What, you recognize its inappropriate but degrade your
post for such pettiness that only you knew about. Droll.

 

[Estro Felino]

I won't derail the thread.
But I'll list one....
Preventing monopolies.

Have you ever heard of something called natural monopolies?

 

[Audie]

What is the State?
What is the State (or as you Americans call it, the Government) for?

I give you an example. I and my neighbor manage a feline colony. These cats are sterilized thanks to the vets we know, friends of ours. We feed them, we keep them in a safe space.
So they cannot mate and become too many: the fewer, the better, so we can take care of the existing ones, as much as we can.

We are the Government for those cats.
Without us, they would be lost. Prey of dogs, or worse, run over by a fast-driving car.

Do you affirm that the Government is useless? (I see that signature of yours, Bonjour finesse )

Visit Taipei sometime. Its overrun
with cats. They dont have any "colony managers",
(That term cracks me up) coz they are sturdy Chinese cats.

Not degenerated weak sexless socialist eurocats that need government welfare.
Showing that government is far worse than passively
useless.

 

[Koldo]

Unless the person want's power, all of the wealth in the world ain't gonna give it to him.

How so? I keep asking you to explain yourself but you never do. Why do you keep saying wealth doesn't equal power?

Are you willing to admit there are plenty of other ways one can attain power? Like social media?

"Plenty" is an exaggeration, but yes, I have already said there are other ways to attain power a long time ago.

 

[Audie]

How so? I keep asking you to explain yourself but you never do. Why do you keep saying wealth doesn't equal power?



"Plenty" is an exaggeration, but yes, I have already said there are other ways to attain power a long time ago.

Wealth is power whether consciously / purposefully used. or not.

 

[Audie]

Does the one being called greedy necessarily see themselves as such? Some may, perhaps. I personally find the word highly subjective, kind of silly, and not very useful.



I must admit, I am struggling somewhat in trying to imagine an economic system that is based on "wellbeing" or "happiness" instead of income. If we go for the overhaul, what would that look like, exactly?



Indeed.

See themselves?

I doubt any narcissist ever does.
Its your fault that youd accuse them so.

 

[Koldo]

In today's economy, how does a person get rich off of his neighbors poverty? Can you give any examples of this happening?

Easy peasy. In a country with low minimum wages and significant unemployment rates, a rich person can create a business and pay only the minimum wages even though they could afford higher wages (which makes the business even more profitable).

Another example is that sellers/service providers generally want to maximize their profit, no matter how much of an impact this will have on someone else's livelihood (thus leading people to a poorer economical situation). This is more of a problem when there isn't much competition though, since high competition tends to lower prices and reduces profit.

 

[Kenny]

Excessive wealth disparity is harmful to the wellbeing of populations in general, and constitutes a significant threat to social cohesion. There have been plenty of studies on this, you can easily research it.

I’ve never understood this.

Issues that come to mind are:

1) Who determines what “excessive wealth” is?
2) How did they get the wealth as compared to those who didn’t? (Generally speaking)
3) What does the person who wants more get to have what someone else has?
4) If a millionaire gives 20% to help those in need, is it wrong that he has the capacity to do it?


Obviously there are negatives for those who have money, but I have found that the negatives are also found in those who don’t have that much. It is just more obvious for those who have much.

Example: A person is in need… a $60,000/year has the capacity to help and doesn’t. Is that any different than the one who has a billion or is it just more obvious?

 

[Koldo]

How on earth can you put limits on greed?

Not on greed per se, but on what it can achieve, to render it purposeless past a certain point.

 

[Audie]

Easy peasy. In a country with low minimum wages and significant unemployment rates, a rich person can create a business and pay only the minimum wages even though they could afford higher wages (which makes the business even more profitable).

Another example is that sellers/service providers generally want to maximize their profit, no matter how much of an impact this will have on someone else's livelihood (thus leading people to a poorer economical situation). This is more of a problem when there isn't much competition though, since high competition tends to lower prices and reduces profit.

If its so easy, why aint you rich

 

[RestlessSoul]

I’ve never understood this.

Issues that come to mind are:

1) Who determines what “excessive wealth” is?
2) How did they get the wealth as compared to those who didn’t? (Generally speaking)
3) What does the person who wants more get to have what someone else has?
4) If a millionaire gives 20% to help those in need, is it wrong that he has the capacity to do it?


Obviously there are negatives for those who have money, but I have found that the negatives are also found in those who don’t have that much. It is just more obvious for those who have much.

Example: A person is in need… a $60,000/year has the capacity to help and doesn’t. Is that any different than the one who has a billion or is it just more obvious?

People can be rich and generous or poor and mean, sure, but how do you reconcile the accumulation of wealth with;

Matthew 6:19

Matthew 19:24 ?

 

[PureX]

I don't support either of them.
My hero is Robert Kennedy Jr.
That said, in Russia there is socialism. And it's a very softened version of Bolshevism.
But they have same problems as in the US: oligarchs.

There is no such thing as a "socialist dictatorship". Whatever Russia is, it is NOT socialism. Most Russians call it a democratic monarchy and they are being generous, as they all know their elections are a sham.

 

[Audie]

Not on greed per se, but on what it can achieve, to render it purposeless past a certain point.

How would you go about determining
whether I am greedy, and how much to
take away to affect my cure? Is there cheaper
psychotherapy? Is that a concern of govt or
anyone else?

But never mind. The definitions and percents would be
arbitrary. The motives behind it would have zero to do
with the motives of financially successful people.

Looks to me that the reason to make it
all abpout " greed" is to justify theft of property is
exactly as it was in China when it was the
greedy landlords who were vilified by Maos group,
and the farmers were promised great
prosperity when they stole everything
from those vampires.

What they got was chaos, murder, and starvation.

Thats your plan put into effect in the real world.

 

[Koldo]

If its so easy, why aint you rich

You mean why I don't do the thing I don't support? Because... well... I don't support it.

But I didn't mean that it was easy to do it though. I meant it was easy to find an example of someone getting rich(er) due to the neighbor's poverty. Finding an opportunity to make significant profit and making it happen, even if it depends on paying crappy wages, is not a trivial task, as you are well aware.

 

[Audie]

People can be rich and generous or poor and mean, sure, but how do you reconcile the accumulation of wealth with;

Matthew 6:19

Matthew 19:24 ?

How do you seriously think its
going to end up, if you set out to
reconcile much of anything
with the bible?

 

[RestlessSoul]

How do you seriously think its
going to end up, if you set out to
reconcile much of anything
with the bible?

I think if the people of those nations which are nominally Christian, were to live according to Christian principles of love and service, the world would end up a much better place. But I accept that is probably not going to happen. This, it seems, is Caesars world: Hence Jesus told Pilate his kingdom was not of this world

 

[Audie]

You mean why I don't do the thing I don't support? Because... well... I don't support it.

But I didn't mean that it was easy to do it though. I meant it was easy to find an example of someone getting rich(er) due to the neighbor's poverty. Finding an opportunity to make significant profit and making it happen, even if it depends on paying crappy wages, is not a trivial task, as you are well aware.

Just yankin' your chain.

I have money becauee i inherited it.
Even peezier than your formula!

Said formula being quite doable, in such
as England in Dickens' time but not so
much now.
Its a dark ideological stereotype that has
little connection to the doing of business and
building wealth in todays world.

And ignores as if it does not exist the enormous
benefits that go to those who work for successful
capitalist enterprises.

 

[Kenny]

People can be rich and generous or poor and mean, sure, but how do you reconcile the accumulation of wealth with;

Matthew 6:19

Matthew 19:24 ?

​

Matt 6:19 “Do not store up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moth and rust destroy, and where thieves break in and steal.

Matt 19:23 And Jesus said to His disciples, “Truly I say to you, )it will be hard for a rich person to enter the kingdom of heaven. 24 And again I say to you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich person to enter the kingdom of God

Good questions… As I understand it, the problem is that we pick some scriptures at the expense of other scriptures and make a position with half of the information.

For an example: Mark 10:24 And the disciples were astonished at his words. But Jesus answereth again, and saith unto them, Children, how hard is it for them that trust in riches to enter into the kingdom of God!

If we apply Mark with Matthew we get a deeper understanding that he was referencing “trust” in riches to enter. How much you have doesn’t help. What someone does with a little is exactly the same as one who does with much. If you are faithful in the little, you are placed over much (words of Jesus).

To “store up” has the connotation of “get all you can and can all you get”. Jesus addressed that in Luke 12:21 So is he that layeth up treasure for himself, and is not rich toward God. Here is a rich man who had a bumper crop of a harvest. Rather than being rich towards God, he wanted to continue storing up for himself. (The heart issue). God didn’t have a problem with blessing the man, He had a problem with what he did with the increase… nothing, store it up for himself, covetousness, uncaring and unloving.

Who can help the poor more, a poor man or a rich man. So if you are given much, then much is required.

With Zacchaeus, Jesus had no problem with his riches because he decided to help the poor and paid back with interest those who abused with finances.

If riches was a problem rather than the heart, then the blessing of Matt 19:24 would be God making things worse as he said 29 And every one that hath forsaken houses, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my name's sake, shall receive an hundredfold,

So imagine, first he said “how hard it is” and turns around and gives them 100 fold? To make it harder? Or, is the principle that if you trust God and use your capacity to help people as you make more (your heart is right) then He is happy to increase your capacity so as to help more people!

There is enough scripture to support my position to bring harmony with the full scope found in scripture.