What do Baha'i believe about Jesus.

[Popeyesays]

Hi,Just going through this thread, what I understand is that Bahai religion believe little in christianity a bit in Islam (shiaism) If I am not wrong? I will be thankful if you answer one of my question, it is that does the Bahai's believe in the Quran (complete) to be divine?

We believe tht both Christ and Muhammad are Manifestations of God, just like Baha`u'llah.

The Qur'an is more "authentic" than the Bible, because its authorship is clear. The texts of Christianity, Buddhism, Islam, Zoroastrianism, Krsna, Moses are all from God, but the transmission through Muhammad is better established.

Regards,
Scott

 

[BruceDLimber]

The teachings that clearly distinguish Baha'is from Christians though are the ones that explain the relationship of Jesus to other manifestations of God. His mission was just as he said it was except from a Baha'i perspective it is only one part of a much broader project of which Muhammed, the Buddha, Baha'u'llah, and others play a part. Thus, Jesus is not privileged above the founders of other world religions.

Hi, Lloyd!

Also, the teachings about the Second Coming!

Best,

Bruce

 

[BruceDLimber]

I know what I believe, and not so much of what you believe as most of what I have heard goes against what I have learned from the scripture. But again, its all good, just trying to share a bit, sorry if you did not like it.

Greetings!

If you'd like to know what we believe, please simply ask us; we'll be more than happy to tell you1

And please note that IOV our teachings are completely in agreement with the Bible, which we, too, respect as God-given scripture!

Peace,

Bruce

 

[BruceDLimber]

Hi,Just going through this thread, what I understand is that Bahai religion believe little in christianity a bit in Islam (shiaism) If I am not wrong? I will be thankful if you answer one of my question, it is that does the Bahai's believe in the Quran (complete) to be divine?

Hi!

We Baha'is accept the Jewish, Christian, and Muslim scriptures as legitimate and God-sent, yes!

And in addition, we have roughly 200 volumes of our own, Baha'i scripture; it is this we endeavor to follow.

You can see the Baha'i scriptures at these sites (among others):

• www.bahai-library.org (click "Baha'i Writings" for our scriptures),
• www.reference.bahai.org (this site is multilingual), and
• www.bahaistudy.org (this site also has videos and talking books).

Good hunting!

Bruce

 

[mehrosh]

Thanks Bruce and Scott for answering my question...now you say that The Qur'an is more "authentic" than the Bible, but then what do you say about this verse of the Qur'an.....Muhammad is not the FATHER of any man among you, but he is the messenger of Allah and the Last of the Prophets; and Allah is Aware of all things. [33:40]

 

[Popeyesays]

I just lost my post where I analyzed this article. So I am going to simply quote the relevant portions of the article and we can analyze it as we go.

First there is the issue of "nabi" and "rasul":
1: 1. The chronological order in which `prophet' and `apostle' are used.

Muhammad is not referred to as a prophet in the Meccan period, whereas this title is applied to him approximately 30 times in Medina. As Bijlefeld elaborates, "When we, moreover, realize that in the Meccan period the rasúl (messenger) title is applied to Muhammad fourteen times, it becomes indeed very difficult to accept the view that the terms `prophet' and `apostle' are fully interchangeable" (Prophet 16).

The reasons for this shift in emphasis are unclear. Bijlefeld argues that in the pre-Hijira period, the intention was to stress the idea of an apostle sent by God to his own community with the very same message which other apostles and communities had received in the past. The use of the prophet title in the post-Hijira period, in contrast, coincided with the need to place a greater emphasis on the Arabs' descendance from Abraham (ibid, 23-24), and thus to position Muhammad in the Abrahamic (Semitic) tradition of prophethood.
2. The individuals who are called prophets and apostles.
Noah, Abraham, Ishmael, Jacob, Moses, Aaron, David, Solomon, Enoch, Ezra, Job, Jonah, Ezekiel, John the Baptist, Jesus and Muhammad are the persons to whom the Qur'án directly applies the title prophet. If we include indirect references as well, Elisha, Elijah, Lot, Joseph, and Zechariah can be added, because there is a verse which lists them with several of the aforementioned prophets and concludes: "Those are they to whom We gave Scripture, the Judgement and Prophethood [nubuwwat]" (6:83-89). . .
It is also clear that not all the prophets are called apostles, therefore strongly supporting the view that not every prophet is an apostle.
----------------------
3: 3. The qualities and functions of prophets and apostles in their Qur'ánic context.

As previously mentioned, prophethood is within the heritage of Abraham and his descendants, and also seems to be closely associated with the Scripture brought by them:[17]
We appointed the Prophecy [nubuwwah] and the Book to be among his seed [dhurriyyah]. (29:27, emphasis added)
We gave the children of Israel the Book, the Judgement and the Prophethood. (45:16, emphasis added)
Moreover the Qur'án states that several prophets are linked with specific sacred texts: Abraham with the suhuf (scrolls), Moses with the Torah, David with the Psalms, Jesus with the Gospels, and Muhammad with the Qur'án itself. In addition, a common feature of the prophets is that they are part of God's Covenant:
Remember we took from the prophets [nabiyyín] their Covenant [mítháq]. (33:7)[18]
When God entered into covenant [mítháq] with the prophets [nabiyyín], he said, "This is the Book and the Wisdom which I give you. Hereafter shall a prophet [rasúl] come unto you to confirm the Scriptures already with you. Ye shall surely believe on him, and ye shall surely aid him". (3:75)[19]
The term apostle also has specific associations. First there is the Qur'ánic assertion that "every community [umma] has its (own) messenger [rasúl]" (10:47, 16:38, 17:15, 23:44, 30:47).
Future Messengers
Finally a significant difference that has been identified by Bahá'í writers between prophets and apostles is the reference of Qur'án 7:34. This verse appears to promise the coming of apostles in the future:
O Children of Adam! there shall come to you Apostles from among yourselves, rehearsing my signs to you.[21]
However Muslim commentators and most later Western translators have rendered the verb in this verse, `there shall come to you,' as part of a conditional clause, arguing that "the use of the energetic ya'tiyannakum serves the purpose of strengthening the conditional meaning" (Moayyad, Historical 79). Thus, Yusuf `Alí has translated the phrase as, "Whenever there come to you Apostles" (349), and Arberry's version is, "If there should come to you Messengers ..." (146). There are two prima facie objections to a conditional meaning. The first is based on the Arabic of the verb `shall come to you' in Qur'án 7:34 which transliterates as "Immá ya'tíyyannakum". This form of the triliteral root A.T.Y. is the imperfect active form (mudári'), indicating action in the future (Kassis, Concordance xxviii), suffixed by yanna which puts the verb in an energetic mode. This form of the verb also occurs in Qur'án 2:38 which more accurately is rendered, "yet there shall come to you guidance from Me". . .
Other objections to the conditional meaning of this verse rest on the understanding a number of indications given in the Qur'án which suggest that the Islamic Dispensation has a finite time:
To every nation [ajal] a term; when their term comes they shall not put it back by a single hour nor put it forward. (7:33)
To each age [ajal] its Book. (13:38)[23]
Neither too soon, nor too late, shall a people reach its appointed time. (23:43)[24]

The Founder of Islam as Khátam

As indicated earlier, many traditions exist which take the phrase khátam al-nabiyyín (seal of the prophets) to mean "the last prophet." However, the completion of some activity is only one meaning of "seal". The historical use of this word provides other interpretations as follows.

Sealing may also be a guarantee of authenticity, or a device designed to prevent the unauthorised opening of a receptacle without knowledge of the owner. In pre-Muslim Arabia, seals were used in place of a signature, giving validity to a document. They were also utilised as a guarantee that property was kept intact and thus took the place of locks and keys. The possession of another person's seal was evidence that the latter had delegated his authority. Pharaoh, for example, gave Joseph his signet as a sign of authority (Gen 41:42). Jezebel forged a letter in Ahab's name and sealed it with Ahab's seal to give it validity (1 Kings 21:8). Tradition has a certain amount to say about Muhammad's khátam (seal). For instance, Al-Bukhari recounts that the Prophet wished to write to the Byzantines, and was told that it would not be read unless it had a seal on it. He therefore adopted a silver seal with the inscription `Muhammad rasúl Alláh' at the year 7 A.H. (Allan, Khátam 1103).

The expression khátam al-nabiyyín (seal of the prophets) is found in several places in classical Arabic poetry. . . A verse in the Díwán of Umayya b. Abí al-Salt speaks of the Prophet as the one "by means of whom God sealed [khatama] the prophets [nabiyyín] before him and after him" (Prophecy 57). This verse implies the appearance of prophets after Muhammad, so that the verb khatama here cannot be understood to mean the termination of something. Friedmann suggests the possibility that it means "he stamped upon them his seal [of approval]" (ibid). This idea that the Prophet came to confirm the former prophets is supported by Qur'án 37:37: "he cometh with truth and confirmeth the Sent Ones [mursalin] of old."[30]

There are other indications that the belief in the finality of Muhammad's prophethood was not generally accepted in the early days of Islam. . . .

You can see the article in its entirety at: http://www.bahai-studies.ca/archives/jbs/jbs.5-3.fazel.html

Regards,
Scott

​

 

[Popeyesays]

I have rather brutally cut that article to fit the space requirement, it really needs to be read to see what the positions are.

We've discussed "Khataam al-Nabayyin" here several times, most lengthily with "The Truth".

Regards,
Scott

 

[mehrosh]

The expression khátam al-nabiyyín (seal of the prophets) is found in several places in classical Arabic poetry. . . A verse in the Díwán of Umayya b. Abí al-Salt speaks of the Prophet as the one "by means of whom God sealed [khatama] the prophets [nabiyyín] before him and after him" (Prophecy 57). This verse implies the appearance of prophets after Muhammad, so that the verb khatama here cannot be understood to mean the termination of something. Friedmann suggests the possibility that it means "he stamped upon them his seal [of approval]" (ibid). This idea that the Prophet came to confirm the former prophets is supported by Qur'án 37:37: "he cometh with truth and confirmeth the Sent Ones [mursalin] of old."[30]

There are other indications that the belief in the finality of Muhammad's prophethood was not generally accepted in the early days of Islam. . . .

You can see the article in its entirety at: http://www.bahai-studies.ca/archives/jbs/jbs.5-3.fazel.html

Regards,
Scott

​

</blockquote>

Thanks once again for the article...I see that we have moved on to a "whether or not Muhammed was the last Prophet?" And I agree that Khatam means seal or signature...Because that is the Last thing done to a document....Started from Adam and sealed at Muhammed.....we don't change a sealed document....Now you say that the finality of Muhammad's prophethood was not generally accepted in the early days of Islam....I will add...."by the pagans of Makkah"...The message of Muhammed was Allah is One and I am his last messenger...he also confirmed the messengers before him......I don't know whether or not you believe in the sayings of Muhammed "ahadiths" because there are numerous hadiths in which he clarified this point.....He didn't predict the coming of any other Prophet or messenger after him...accept the second coming of Jesus (not as a Prophet but a member of Muhammed's Ummah, who will govern his people by the laws of the Quran) .......we can discuss...if you allow....Thanks and regards

 

[Ori]

Couldn't Muhammed also be considered as the seal of prophets to Arabia?

By the way, this thread has been very interesting and informative, keep up the good work.

 

[Peace]

Couldn't Muhammed also be considered as the seal of prophets to Arabia?

No Ori, because Muhammad peace be upon him is sent by God to all humanity and not only to certain group of people. He is the seal of all Prophets peace be upon them all.

Peace

 

[Peace]

Couldn't Muhammed also be considered as the seal of prophets to Arabia?

There are many verses in the Quran who show that Prophet Muhammad pbuh is the seal of prohets, I will state only two or three.

Allah says: "Muhammad is not the father of any of your men, but (he is) the Messenger of Allah, and the Seal of the Prophets: and Allah has full knowledge of all things." (The Holy Quran, Al-Ahzab 33:40)

Say: "O men! I am sent unto you all, as the Messenger of Allah, to Whom belongeth the dominion of the heavens and the earth: there is no god but He: it is He That giveth both life and death. So believe in Allah and His Messenger, the Unlettered Prophet, who believeth in Allah and His words: follow him that (so) ye may be guided." (The Holy Quran, Al-Araf 7:158)

And We have not sent you (O Muhammad) save as a bringer of good tidings and a warner unto all mankind; but most of mankind do not know. (The Holy Quran, Saba 34:28) ​

There are also so many ahadith that confirms that, but I will state only two:

Prophet Muhammad peace be upon him said: "My position in relation to the prophets who came before me can be explained by the following example: A man erected a building and adorned this edifice with great beauty, but he left an empty niche, in the corner where just one brick was missing. People looked around the building and marveled at its beauty, but wondered why a brick was missing from that niche? I am like unto that one missing brick and I am the last in the line of the Prophets."
(Bukhari, Muslim,Tirmidhi, Musnad Ahmad, Tirmizi, Babu Khatimin-Nabiyyin, Musnad Abu Dawud Tayalisi) ​

He peace be upon him also said:

God has bestowed upon me six favors which the former Prophets did not enjoy:

• I have been endowed with the gift of pithy and perfect speech. ​
• I was granted victory owing to my awe. ​
• The spoils of war were made lawful unto me. ​
• The whole earth has been made the place of worship for me and it has become the means of purification for me also. In other words, in my religion, offering of prayers is not confined to certain specified places of worship. Prayers can be offered at any place over the earth. And in case water is not available, it is lawful for my people to perform ablutions with earth (Tayammum) and to cleanse themselves with the soil, if water for bathing is scarce. ​
• I have been sent by Allah to carry His Divine message to the whole world. ​
• And the line of prophets has come to its final end in me.
  
  (Muslim, Tirmidhi, Ibn Majah) ​
  
  

Peace
​

 

[BruceDLimber]

Hi!

[W]hat do you say about this verse of the Qur'an.....Muhammad is not the FATHER of any man among you, but he is the messenger of Allah and the Last of the Prophets; and Allah is Aware of all things. [33:40]

This is no problem.

Often, this is translated as "Seal of the Prophets," as you may know.

But the key is that there are two different words in Arabic translated into English as "seal":

• One is "nabi," which refers to a lesser prophet such as Jeremiah or Micah.
• And the other is "Ras'ul," which means a major Divine Messenger such as Moses, Jesus, or Muhammad.

And the word used in the Qur'an is "nabi": thus, it says that Muhammad is the Seal of the minor prophets, not the major messengers!

There are also two other things to note here:

One is that the Baha'i scriptures affirm that in fact, every Divine Messenger is both the First and the Last, the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End, and the Seal!

Also, there is a sense in which the word commonly translated as "seal" simply means "ornament," so that this verse can be taken as saying that Muhammad is the Ornament of the prophets.

All the best, and we look forward to more questions!

Bruce

 

[Light]

Couldn't Muhammed also be considered as the seal of prophets to Arabia?

By the way, this thread has been very interesting and informative, keep up the good work.

[SIZE=-1]Muhammad is not the father of any male among you, but he is the messenger of God and the seal of the prophets; and God is aware of all things (33:40).[/SIZE]​

[SIZE=-1]The Arabic word for seal is khatam which by a change of vowel can also be read as khatim, meaning "that which puts the seal". Both words are derivatives of khatama, which means both to end or conclude something or to put a seal in order to indicate such an end or conclusion (see, e.g., Lisan al-'Arab, Qamus, Aqrab al-Muwarid).[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]No matter how the word is supplied with vowels, which were omitted in the original Arabic script, the most reasonable way, if not the only way, to understand the verse is that Muhammad completed and closed the prophethood as a seal marks the completion and closure of a document, that is, he was the last prophet. [/SIZE]

There is no reference to what will be sent down after the Prophet. Nowhere else the Qur'an refers to a future prophet or revelation. The significance of this observation can be seen more clearly by a comparison with the Old and the New Testaments, where there are frequent references to future revelations. Thus in the Old Testament we find this promise of a future prophet or a series of prophets:

[SIZE=-1]The Lord your God will raise up for you a prophet like me [like Moses] from your own people; you shall heed such a prophet (Deut 18:15; see also 18:18).[/SIZE]​

[SIZE=-1]Indeed, a great deal of the Old Testament is a prophecy of future revelation of one kind or another. Likewise, the New Testament also looks forward to future revelation:[/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1]And I [Jesus], will ask the Father and he will send you another Paraclete to be with you forever (John 14:16). I still have many things to say to you, but you cannot bear them now. When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth; for he will not speak on his own, but will speak whatever he hears, and he will declare to you the things that are to come (John 16:12-13).[/SIZE]​

[SIZE=-1]Here it is besides the point whether the Paraclete is the Holy Spirit or the Prophet Muhammad, a question I have discussed in detail in Islam and Its Prophet. The significant point here is that Jesus looks forward to a future revelation.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1]In contrast to both the Old and New Testaments, the chronologically last verse of the Qur'an declares:[/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1]Today I have completed my religion for you and perfected my favor on you and chosen al-islam as your religion (part of 5:3).[/SIZE]​

[SIZE=-1]The Qur'an regards itself as coming in fulfillment of earlier prophecy:[/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1]Say, whether or not you believe in it, the fact is that those who possessed knowledge before it fall on their faces in humble prostration when it is recited to them. And they say, Glory to our Lord and Sustainer: Surely the promise of Our Lord and Sustainer was to be fulfilled! (17:107-108; see also, 7:157, 61:6).[/SIZE]​

[SIZE=-1]But it does not prophesy for the coming after it of another revelation. Its prophecy is only of its own inevitable final victory:[/SIZE]

[SIZE=-1]He it is who has sent his messenger with the guidance and the religion of truth that he may make it prevail over all religion, however much those who practice shirk may be averse (61:9).[/SIZE]​

[SIZE=-1]This prevailing of Islam is not understood to be through any human force, but simply the result of the inevitable victory of a truer expression of the same religion over other expressions. Notice that the Qur'an does not say "prevail over all religions" but over all religion (in the singular). Every religion is really trying to express the same truth. Islam is the clearest and most effective expression of that truth and therefore is destined to replace all other expressions. It is like when a better and more economical model of a product such as the computer or the car comes on the market it necessarily replaces after due time the older less efficient and more expensive model.[/SIZE]

 

[Peace]

Hi!



This is no problem.

Often, this is translated as "Seal of the Prophets," as you may know.

But the key is that there are two different words in Arabic translated into English as "seal":

• One is "nabi," which refers to a lesser prophet such as Jeremiah or Micah.
• And the other is "Ras'ul," which means a major Divine Messenger such as Moses, Jesus, or Muhammad.

And the word used in the Qur'an is "nabi": thus, it says that Muhammad is the Seal of the minor prophets, not the major messengers!

The Qur'anic verse under consideration says that Muhammad was a messenger and the seal of the prophets. That there is a difference between a prophet and a messenger is clear from this verse as well as others (e.g. 22:52). But what is the difference?
The Qur'an assumes that the meaning of a prophet is well understood by its hearers. He is a figure who is inspired by God for some form of guidance for a people. He may not necessarily bring a new law or establish a new religious community, for in 4:44 a reference is made to the Israelite prophets who judged by the Torah rather than by a new law brought by them. The messenger means one who is sent by God with a message. He also receives divine inspiration, for otherwise he cannot be "sent" by God. Hence every messenger is a prophet. All nations have received messengers, for the Qur'an says: "And for every nation there is a messenger" (10:47). Moreover, the messenger is meant to be obeyed: "We sent no messenger save that he should be obeyed by God's leave" (4:64). Nations that rejected the messengers sent to them were destroyed or punished (26: 105-191). Similar statements are not made about prophets. It thus appears that God acts through a messenger more decisively than through a mere prophet.

 

[Popeyesays]

No Ori, because Muhammad peace be upon him is sent by God to all humanity and not only to certain group of people. He is the seal of all Prophets peace be upon them all.

Peace

Nabi, yes. Rasul, no. Muhammad speaks in that whole surah based upon the marriage of Himself to the ex-wife of His adopted son. To take the Surah out of context causes problems.

Muhammad was the Khataami-nabiyyin in many senses. He "Guaranteed" the authenticity of the prophets and Messengers before Him.

He also says that Apostles will come in the future, quite clearly in the 7th Surah:
"Say: Truly my Lord hath forbidden filthy actions whether open or
secret, and iniquity, and unjust violence, and to associate with God that for
which He hath sent down no warranty, and to speak of God that ye know not.
Every nation hath its set time. And when their time is come, they shall
not retard it an hour; and they shall not advance it.
O children of Adam! there shall come to Apostles from among yourselves,
rehearsing my signs to you; and whoso shall fear God and do good works, no fear
shall be upon them, neither shall they be put to grief." Al-Araf, Rodwell 31-33

Regards,
Scott

 

[mehrosh]

Couldn't Muhammed also be considered as the seal of prophets to Arabia?

By the way, this thread has been very interesting and informative, keep up the good work.

Muhammed was not send as a Prophet to Arabia....the Quran says "we have not send you but as a Mercy for mankind" Let me consider the fact that only 18% of the muslims are Arabs....

 

[mehrosh]

Hi!



This is no problem.

Often, this is translated as &quot;Seal of the Prophets,&quot; as you may know.

But the key is that there are two different words in Arabic translated into English as &quot;seal&quot;:

• One is &quot;nabi,&quot; which refers to a lesser prophet such as Jeremiah or Micah.
• And the other is &quot;Ras'ul,&quot; which means a major Divine Messenger such as Moses, Jesus, or Muhammad.

And the word used in the Qur'an is &quot;nabi&quot;: thus, it says that Muhammad is the Seal of the minor prophets, not the major messengers!

There are also two other things to note here:

One is that the Baha'i scriptures affirm that in fact, every Divine Messenger is both the First and the Last, the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End, and the Seal!

Also, there is a sense in which the word commonly translated as &quot;seal&quot; simply means &quot;ornament,&quot; so that this verse can be taken as saying that Muhammad is the Ornament of the prophets.

All the best, and we look forward to more questions!

Bruce

Thankyou for your kind answer......you have breaken up the two words....but I agree with you....“The words nabi and rasul are figurative and metaphorical. Risalat in the Arabic language is applied to ‘being sent’, and nubuwwat is to expound hidden truths and matters upon receiving knowledge from God.”“If you are familiar with Hebrew or Arabic you will know that the word nabi is derived from naba’a, and that is applied to giving news. And one who gives news is called nabi.” Thus Muhammed is Khataman Nabiyein...that is Seal of the News givers from whom else..from God.......There will be no other news coming to mankind from God except as Muhammed said "Nabuwwat ended on me except the Good dreams" dreams which come from Allah and are proven true....are a part of the Nabuwwat and are shown by Allah to his slaves...sometimes even people who don't believe in Allah see such dreams...Muhammed further said..."AFTER ME HOLD FAST TO THE TWO THINGS AND YOU WILL BE RIGHTLY GUIDED...THE QURAN AND MY SUNNAH"....there will be nothing more till the day of Jugdment apart from the Quran and the sunnah which takes its way to mankind...as Allah and His prophet has promised.....(I have quoted the ahadiths without reference..If in anyway you require the references i will quote them too inshallah...infact the hadiths are graded as "SAHIH")

 

[mehrosh]

Nabi, yes. Rasul, no. Muhammad speaks in that whole surah based upon the marriage of Himself to the ex-wife of His adopted son. To take the Surah out of context causes problems.

Muhammad was the Khataami-nabiyyin in many senses. He &quot;Guaranteed&quot; the authenticity of the prophets and Messengers before Him.

He also says that Apostles will come in the future, quite clearly in the 7th Surah:
&quot;Say: Truly my Lord hath forbidden filthy actions whether open or
secret, and iniquity, and unjust violence, and to associate with God that for
which He hath sent down no warranty, and to speak of God that ye know not.
Every nation hath its set time. And when their time is come, they shall
not retard it an hour; and they shall not advance it.
O children of Adam! there shall come to Apostles from among yourselves,
rehearsing my signs to you; and whoso shall fear God and do good works, no fear
shall be upon them, neither shall they be put to grief.&quot; Al-Araf, Rodwell 31-33

Regards,
Scott

Dear Scott..I see your vast knowledge on many topics...well you hadle the christian part well too...but i will rather say you are not doing justice to Islam...you are saying Nabi yes...Rasool No....Ok....let me agree with you for the time being...just assume for a moment that Muhammed was the Last Nabi...fine..??? Ok...now lets see this word Nabi...if you have good knowledge of Arabic or Hebrew...you will certainly agree with me that the word &quot;Nabi&quot; comes from the word &quot;Naba'a&quot; and that is applied to giving news. And one who gives news is called nabi. So Muhammed is the Last Nabi....This is what you agree with....Thus Muhammed is the Last news giver.....from whom? from God...right? whoelse.....So the conclusion is Muhammed is the Last news giver from God.....NABI..YES...Coming to the second part...first of all I would like to inform you that the verses you quoted are not coming from Muhammed but from God &quot;He speaks nothing but what is revealed to him&quot; as you said in your post

He also says that Apostles will come in the future, quite clearly in the 7th Surah

Before getting deep into the verse let me make it clear that Muhammed said &quot;Nabuwwat (or news giving from God) ended on me&quot; i.e there will be no other news coming from God till the Day of Judgment....now getting to the verse...I think this is the part on the basis of which you claim that God (not Muhammed) said that Apostles will come in the future.....O children of Adam! there shall come to Apostles from among yourselves,rehearsing my signs to you; and whoso shall fear God and do good works, no fear,shall be upon them, neither shall they be put to grief...there are many such verses in the Quran...that Allah warns the Children of Adam...note the Children of Adam....not the Ummah of Muhammed...Children of Adam applies to the first born of Adam to the Last born...and if one keeps in mind that these are the words of God...he will find it easy to understand the verse....a similar verse is in Surah Baqarah..Then Adam received from his Lord words (of revelation), and He relented toward him. Lo! He is the Relenting the Merciful.We said: Go down, all of you, from hence; but verily there cometh unto you from Me a guidance; and whoso followeth My guidance, there shall no fear come upon them neither shall they grieve....and in many other place...I hope you got it now....Thanks for reading and regards..

 

[Popeyesays]

Dear Merhosh,

I am aware that most Muslims will say a rasul cannot be rasul without also being Nabi first. And I also agree, which is why I do not think that Khataam means "the End" in this instance. One also has to explain this verse:
"Say: Truly my Lord hath forbidden filthy actions whether open or
secret, and iniquity, and unjust violence, and to associate with God that for
which He hath sent down no warranty, and to speak of God that ye know not.
Every nation hath its set time. And when their time is come, they shall
not retard it an hour; and they shall not advance it.
O children of Adam! there shall come to Apostles from among yourselves,
rehearsing my signs to you; and whoso shall fear God and do good works, no fear
shall be upon them"Say: Truly my Lord hath forbidden filthy actions whether open or
secret, and iniquity, and unjust violence, and to associate with God that for
which He hath sent down no warranty, and to speak of God that ye know not.
Every nation hath its set time. And when their time is come, they shall
not retard it an hour; and they shall not advance it.
O children of Adam! there shall come to Apostles from among yourselves,
rehearsing my signs to you; and whoso shall fear God and do good works, no fear
shall be upon them, neither shall they be put to grief." Al-Araf, Rodwell 31-33, neither shall they be put to grief." Al-Araf, Rodwell 31-33

And, frankly I do not see how to put the meaning of "the End of Revelation" to one verse in the QWur'an when this particular verse says there will other Apostles.

Can you justify the two verses?

Regards,
Scott

 

[Judgement Day]

The Holy Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) said: "Allah will send no Apostle after me, but only Mubashshirat. It was said: what is meant by al-Mubashshirat. He said : Good vision or pious vision". (Musnad Ahmad, Marwiyat Abu Tufail, Nasa'i, Abu Dawud) (In other words there is no possibility of Divine revelation in future. At the most if some one receives an inspiration from Allah he will receive it in the form of "pious dream."

The Holy Prophet (PBUH) observed: "I am Muhammad, I am Ahmad, I am the effacer and infidelity shall be erased through me; I am the assembler. People shall be assembled on Doomsday after my time. (In other words Doom is my only successor.) And I am the last in the sense that no prophet shall succeed me." (Bukhari and Muslim, Kitab-ul-Fada'il, Bab: Asmaun-Nabi; Tirmidhi, Kitab-ul- Adab, Bab: Asma-un-Nabi; Muatta', Kitab-u-Asma in-Nabi, Al- Mustadrak Hakim, Kitab-ut-Tarikh, Bab: Asma-un-Nabi.)

The Prophet of Allah (PBUH) affirmed: "The chain of Messengers and Prophets has come to an end. There shall be no Messenger nor Prophet after me." (Tirmidhi, Kitab-ur-Rouya Babu Zahab-un- Nubuwwa, Musnad Ahmad, Marwiyat-Anas bin Malik)

Thauban reports: "The Holy Prophet (PBUH) observed: And there will arise Thirty imposters in my Ummah and each one of them will pronounce to the world that he is a prophet, but I am the last in the line of the Prophets of God and no Apostle will come after me." (Abu Dawud, Kitab-ul-Fitan)
Abu Dawud in 'Kitab-ul-Malahim' has recorded another tradition reported by Abu Huraira in the same subject. Tirmidhi has also recorded these two traditions as reported by Hadrat Thauban and Hadrat Abu Huraira. The text of the second tradition runs thus: "It will come to this that thirty imposters will arise and each one of them will put forth his claim to be the Apostle of God."

The Holy Prophet (PBUH) observed: "Among the tribe of Israel who went before you there indeed were such people who held communion with God, even though they were not his Prophets. If ever there arose a person from among my people who would hold communion with God, it would be none else but 'Umar (May Allah be pleased with him)." (Bukhari, Kitab-ul-Manaqib)
A version of this same tradition in `Muslim' contains Muhaddithuna instead of Yukallimuna. But then Mukalima and Muhaddith bear identical meaning i.e., a man enjoys the privilege of holding direct communion with God or a person who is addressed by the Almighty from the unseen. Thus we conclude that if there had been any person among the followers of Muhammad who could hold communion with God without being raised to the dignity of prophethood, it would have been `Umar.

The Holy Prophet (PBUH) said: "If an Apostle were to succeed me, it would have been 'Umar bin Khattab." (Tirmidhi,Kitab-ul- Manaqib)

Allama Alusi (died 1270 A.H.) in his commentary, Ruh-ul-Ma'ani, writes: "The word 'Prophet' is common, but the word 'Messenger' has a particular significance. Hence when the Holy Prophet (PBUH) is called the 'Seal of Prophets,' it necessarily follows that he is also the 'Seal of Messengers.' The implication of the Holy Prophet's position as 'the Last of all Prophets and Messengers of God' is that by his(PBUH) elevation to the dignity of Prophethood in this world, the same dignity has henceforth been abolished and no man can attain that dignity now." (Vol. 22, p. 32)

All these concludes that Muhammad pbuh is the last Prophet, Messenger, and Apostle of God. In the first place, Prophethood is a delicate matter. According to the Holy Qur'an the idea of Prophethood is such a fundamental article of faith that one who believes in this idea is a believer and he who disbelieves is an infidel. If a man does not put his faith in a prophet, he is an apostate; similarly if he believes in the claim of an imposter to be a prophet, he becomes an infidel. In such a delicate and important matter Omniscient God certainly cannot be expected to have made a slip. If there were to be a Prophet/Messenger after the time of Muhammad (PBUH), God would have made this possibility clear in the Holy Qur'an or He would have commanded His Apostle Muhammad to make a clear declaration of it. The Apostle of God would never have passed away without having forewarned his people that other Apostles would succeed him and that his followers must put their faith in the succeeding Prophet or Messenger.