Secret Chief
Very strong language
I am amazed that people find it so hard a concept to accept that disingenuous misrepresentation and misappropriation are unwelcome actions.
-
Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.
Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:- Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
- Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
- Access to private conversations with other members.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!
What if we accepted each others Religion?
- Thread starter loverofhumanity
- Start date
Secret Chief
Very strong language
Simon looks a grumpy angel.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
Believers of all the older religions believe that their religion will be renewed when the Promised One, Messiah, or whatever they call him returns.
They all believe they are right and the other believers are wrong, but of course those believers cannot all be right, can they?
The difference between the Baha'i Faith and all those older religions is that we believe that the Promised One renewed all the religions.
The other difference between the Baha'i Faith and all those older religions is that we are not waiting for anything.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
He is a sweetheart but he can be grumpy, especially when I try to comb him.Simon looks a grumpy angel.
Right now he needs a groomer badly because I cannot groom him by myself.
Not all old religions believe in a returning prophet.
Speaking for Hinduism, some Vaishnavas believe in a return of an avatar named Kalki, but this isn't a dominant belief. Some Hindus do not worship Vishnu(the deity Kalki is an avatar of) at all.
The difference between older religions is noted. It brings nothing to the truth value of older or newer. There is bunch of new faiths asserting the Mahdi has come. You aren't the only ones.
Heck there is right now people claiming to the the Mahdi, sometimes, even these Mahdis, show up in a gathering and claim to be the 12th Imam (as in the actually son of Hassan Al-Askari (a)). There are cults that shut down the light and then open, and then this Mahdi appears, who is supposed to be the 12th Imam. They claim this how the Mahdi will work in secret.
All sorts of beliefs about the Mahdi (a) out there. Some more of the Sunni nature, some more of the Shiite nature, some a mix.
The amount of new religions are many, and there is a leader who asserts he is the current successor to Baha'allah and that the house thing is not supposed to be a thing.
There are also newer Prophets that acknowledge Baha'allah.
Hindus don't even believe in evil. Please stop putting your Abrahamic/Baha'i (Bible quotes? Really?) world view into a paradigm where it makes no sense. There is absolute casteism throughout Abrahamic mindset, although there are only 2 castes. Upper class/caste = us, and lower class/caste = them. In your case, the Baha'i is the upper caste/class, and all those previous religions that are now out of date make up the lower caste/class.
Your accusations are faced by all followers of a New Faith given by Allah. It is just a repeat of the negation of Muhammad, the negation of Jesus, the negation of all the Messengers.
Honesty is the foundation of virtues given by Baha'u'llah, Truthfulness and Trustworthiness are the pillars that sustain all virtues.
The entire Message of Baha’u’llah is founded on Truthfulness.
Regards Tony
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
Why are we dishonest, just because we disagree with your interpretation?
That doesn't work because we 'could' say the same thing about you.
I will not call anyone dishonest because everyone 'honestly believes' that their interpretation is correct, so we are being honest about our interpretation of the Qur'an, what we think it means.
It is only the ego that insists that 'they know' the correct interpretation and everyone else is wrong.
Just the same concept clothed in a different frame of reference. Cause and effect, Karma.
Regards Tony
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
Yep. As usual, Abdu'l-Baha was spot on.
“From the beginning of the world until the present time each ‘Manifestation’ 1 sent from God has been opposed by an embodiment of the ‘Powers of Darkness’.
This dark power has always endeavoured to extinguish the light. Tyranny has ever sought to overcome justice. Ignorance has persistently tried to trample knowledge underfoot. This has, from the earliest ages, been the method of the material world.
In the time of Moses, Pharaoh set himself to prevent the Mosaic Light being spread abroad.
In the day of Christ, Annas and Caiaphas inflamed the Jewish people against Him and the learned doctors of Israel joined together to resist His Power. All sorts of calumnies were circulated against Him. The Scribes and Pharisees conspired to make the people believe Him to be a liar, an apostate, and a blasphemer. They spread these slanders throughout the whole Eastern world against Christ, and caused Him to be condemned to a shameful death!
In the case of Muhammad also, the learned doctors of His day determined to extinguish the light of His influence. They tried by the power of the sword to prevent the spread of His teaching.
In spite of all their efforts the Sun of Truth shone forth from the horizon. In every case the army of light vanquished the powers of darkness on the battlefield of the world, and the radiance of the Divine Teaching illumined the earth. Those who accepted the Teaching and worked for the Cause of God became luminous stars in the sky of humanity.
Now, in our own day, history repeats itself.
Those who would have men believe that religion is their own private property once more bring their efforts to bear against the Sun of Truth: they resist the Command of God; they invent calumnies, not having arguments against it, neither proofs. They attack with masked faces, not daring to come forth into the light of day.” Abdu'l-Baha, Paris Talks
I think there are levels of self-deception and lying to oneself. I believe it is taken to a new level with Bahai interpretation of the Quran. That takes a level of cognitive dissonance I thought was not even possible for humans.
I've shown my reasons - and they are many. You can summarize it as "disagreeing with my interpretation", but I believe I've shown day of the judgment is not what Bahais claim in a clear manner. People then reword the phrases into slightly different sentences that change the original meaning, and think it somehow is an interpretation.
The Quran for example in more then one place says no one will deny the day of judgment when it happens, those words are explicit in Surah Waqiah but paraphrasing that is found everywhere.
Also, it's clear in the Quran before the day of judgment, all cities will face a trial, if they reject the universal Messenger, the cities that do will be destroyed. Now, Bahai excuses that this means spiritual destructions makes no sense given the context within the Surah about it being physical and through out the repeated warnings about cities in the past destroyed give it the proper context. The amount of repetition also gives that verse the proper context.
But Bahais are not interested in context. They will move verses way out of their place.
Glad you agree with me, I didn't expect that. Caste/class is everywhere, including the 2 class system of yours. The same concept (class/caste) clothed in different references.
Luckily there is no intent of disingenuous misrepresentation and misappropriation.
That is your interpretation of the conversations.
Regards Tony
Sure, if you can trick yourself about that. Whatever helps you sleep dude.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
There is no trick. That is what the Baha'i Faith teaches. It is all in the Baha'i Writings.
Everyone is responsible for their own belief.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
I agree and that is exactly what Baha'u'llah wrote:
“It follows, therefore, that every man hath been, and will continue to be, able of himself to appreciate the Beauty of God, the Glorified. Had he not been endowed with such a capacity, how could he be called to account for his failure? If, in the Day when all the peoples of the earth will be gathered together, any man should, whilst standing in the presence of God, be asked: “Wherefore hast thou disbelieved in My Beauty and turned away from My Self,” and if such a man should reply and say: “Inasmuch as all men have erred, and none hath been found willing to turn his face to the Truth, I, too, following their example, have grievously failed to recognize the Beauty of the Eternal,” such a plea will, assuredly, be rejected. For the faith of no man can be conditioned by any one except himself.”
Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 143
Secret Chief
Very strong language
Unluckily your interpretation is at odds with mine.
I asked what is your take on Nagarjuna. Do you have one?
Secret Chief
Very strong language
Well at least this tack is consistent. Did you know that the Buddha was a Messenger of your God? It was news to me anyway...