What is Contemplative Christianity?

[Yoshua]

Not interested. Not worth the effort. Again, one doesn't have to dissect a rusted out, dented pickup truck belching blue smoke, in order to know that it's a defective $hitbox.

Then, your statement that the article is biased and mistaken cannot be proved. It is just you don't like the message without particular reason.

Thanks

 

[Yoshua]

Whatever. Your phrase "I believe" negates any fact-finding. Belief isn't fact. It's belief. If we're ever going to get anywhere, you've simply got to stop treating your own beliefs as irrefutable fact.

I just differentiated the Lectio Divina, and the common practice that a Christian do his meditation with the Scriptures and praying.

Thanks

 

[sojourner]

Gen. 1:1-5
1. In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.
2. And the earth was formless and void, and darkness was over the surface of the deep; and the Spirit of God was moving over the surface of the waters.
3. Then God said, "Let there be light"; and there was light.
4. And God saw that the light was good; and God separated the light from the darkness.
5. And God called the light day, and the darkness He called night. And there was evening and there was morning, one day.

Gen. 1:14-19
14. Then God said, "Let there be lights in the expanse of the heavens to separate the day from the night, and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days and years;
15. and let them be for lights in the expanse of the heavens to give light on the earth"; and it was so.
16. And God made the two great lights, the greater light to govern the day, and the lesser light to govern the night; He made the stars also.
17. And God placed them in the expanse of the heavens to give light on the earth,
18. and to govern the day and the night, and to separate the light from the darkness; and God saw that it was good.
19. And there was evening and there was morning, a fourth day.

Ps. 8:3
3. When I consider Thy heavens, the work of Thy fingers, the moon and the stars, which Thou hast ordained;

Ps. 147:4
4. He counts the number of the stars; He gives names to all of them.

Rev. 4:11
11. "Worthy art Thou, our Lord and our God, to receive glory and honor and power; for Thou didst create all things, and because of Thy will they existed, and were created."

Thanks

This isn't fact. It's a theological position. But feel free to try again.

 

[sojourner]

I don't pushed that the opposite is dependent on the other. It is like good and evil, truth and lies, light and dark and others. Just to clear up with you that there is always the opposite side.

Thanks

Not always. There is no "opposite" to God.

 

[sojourner]

Then, your statement that the article is biased and mistaken cannot be proved. It is just you don't like the message without particular reason.

Thanks

Nope. It can be proved, but there's no need for me to do that, because it's self-evident.

 

[Windwalker]

Ok. I got your point, but we are discussing about God, and not about psychology and social structures.

We are talking about religion, and so psychology and social structures absolutely play into this. Unless you wish to claim you're not a human who's practicing a form of religion? You cannot evade a discussion about it claiming it's "God's religion". It's you who are practicing it, so all of this applies.

Now, let us do some test question: if there is one who does not submit to God’s authority, what do you think He is for God? Did you know someone who does not submit or rebel with God?

Yes, all those who are spiritually challenged and think that when they read the Bible their thoughts they have are the authority of God. They are not walking in the spirit and arrogantly assume they are God's judge on earth.

Come on. Is there a creativity of the “truth” that Jesus Christ claimed He is? Truth is truth. How could you twist the truth by re-imagining and re-interpreting the truth?

Truth is not truth in the way you want to believe it is. Truth is relative to the person reasoning it. Some people's reasoning is pretty limited or distorted. Other's are more insightful. But all ideas of truth are relative to the person reasoning it. None of them are absolute, except of course in the mind of the person who ignorantly believes their's is.

That is an obvious changing of the truth that Jesus Christ' claimed—He is the truth.

If Jesus meant propositional truth, then why would he say, "I am the truth"? You honestly have no idea what he means when he says that. You interpret it to mean all your beliefs about Jesus are the truth. You err.

What is programmed in paralleling the Scriptures, and understanding the passage in literal text (as plain reading to understand the text)?

Whatever this jumble is supposed to mean.

Let us face it. Windwalker. It is a matter of acceptance with the Scripture, to follow or not.

No it's not. It an acceptance of your ideas as the truth or not. I reject your ideas.

It is not going around putting errors in biblical interpretation. As I said before, we may get a Scripture here with you and Sojourner, take an example and we interpret it, share and discuss about it. With this, we can see if the biblical interpretation is not a valid way of interpreting Scriptures. I don’t agree with putting such comments like preaching death, killing God, misinterpretations etc.., those are some comments that everyone here in RF can be uttered, but proving and scrutinize it, going into detail with diligent study, I believe that will unfold what is really biblical interpretation.

I disagree you have any idea of what either of us are talking about.

BTW, I believe there are forum rules about just quoting entire articles page, after page, after page which you did! I am not going to read any of it, because for one thing you are supposed to simply post a link and at best just quote one of two things from it and use your own words to describe your thoughts about it. Moreover, this is again from someone who really doesn't know what they are talking about. The cursory glance I gave it is just the same junk you parrot in your posts, which I have shown the flaw in over and over again. Posting 8 posts merely quoting this junk does not an argument make. It just shows a stubbornness to let go of bad ideas.

 

[Yoshua]

This isn't fact. It's a theological position. But feel free to try again.

Hi Sojourner,

Yes, I know that it is not a fact. The best thing that I can produce is theological, because there is an absolute truth in it—as simply what the Scripture had stated, and what we see today.

Thanks

 

[Yoshua]

Not always. There is no "opposite" to God.

God is the Creator. Just only for God, no man can become a God like Him.

Thanks

 

[Yoshua]

We are talking about religion, and so psychology and social structures absolutely play into this. Unless you wish to claim you're not a human who's practicing a form of religion? You cannot evade a discussion about it claiming it's "God's religion". It's you who are practicing it, so all of this applies.

Hi Windwalker,

Why insert things that is not the nearest about religion? You said it is religion, and what is religion based on your definition? Is it a psychology?

If we are based on religion, then we should look at the Scriptures not on psychology books and theory. I know that psychology has a big part on your beliefs, I believed this makes the difference when psychology mixed up with theology.

Yes, all those who are spiritually challenged and think that when they read the Bible their thoughts they have are the authority of God. They are not walking in the spirit and arrogantly assume they are God's judge on earth.

That authority you are mentioned isn’t the authority by himself. The authority came from God. If we quoted the words of Jesus, they tend to think that we are the authority but it is not. It is how we acknowledged and followed His words. If God is love, that love came from God--from His teachings to love other people. All things that a follower of Christ did is came from God, and not our own self for we don’t boast ourselves to be like God/god.

Truth is not truth in the way you want to believe it is. Truth is relative to the person reasoning it. Some people's reasoning is pretty limited or distorted. Other's are more insightful. But all ideas of truth are relative to the person reasoning it. None of them are absolute, except of course in the mind of the person who ignorantly believes their's is.

There is no truth with man, but there is truth with God. Jesus is the truth, not man.

f Jesus meant propositional truth, then why would he say, "I am the truth"? You honestly have no idea what he means when he says that. You interpret it to mean all your beliefs about Jesus are the truth. You err.

John 14:7-15
6. Jesus said to him, "I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father, but through Me.

It is not my own beliefs. Jesus said, He is the truth, that means all of Him are truths, there is no lies. What the Father had done by sending His Son Jesus Christ is true; giving us hope of eternal salvation. It is He (Jesus), the only access to the truth. The Holy Spirit that He gave is the Spirit of truth, He will only speak the truth(John 16:13). The truth that will set us free (John 8:32). Nobody can claim that He is the truth other than Jesus Christ.

John 5:20
20. And we know that the Son of God has come, and has given us understanding, in order that we might know Him who is true, and we are in Him who is true, in His Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God and eternal life.

Thanks

 

[Windwalker]

Why insert things that is not the nearest about religion? You said it is religion, and what is religion based on your definition? Is it a psychology?

Of course religion isn't psychology. However, psychology is a part of everything you and I do as we live our lives, and it most certainly is a part of religious beliefs and practices. Do you not know or understand what religion is? Seriously? You need me to explain what religion is?

If we are based on religion, then we should look at the Scriptures not on psychology books and theory.

Religion is what people do with beliefs. Beliefs are part of one's psychological makeup. You connect the dots here.

I know that psychology has a big part on your beliefs, I believed this makes the difference when psychology mixed up with theology.

If you ignore psychology, then you are remain self-unaware. You already are using the mind in mixing it up with your theology. I do not mix psychology and theology. I simply understand that how I view theology is determined in no small measure by my psychological make up. It is for you too, but you just deny it is there, unaware of your own mind. You are self-unaware. And that's the whole point. That's the difference between us. Self-awareness.

 

[sojourner]

Hi Sojourner,

Yes, I know that it is not a fact. The best thing that I can produce is theological, because there is an absolute truth in it—as simply what the Scripture had stated, and what we see today.

Thanks

theology doesn't exist to contain or produce "absolute truth." Theology is a vehicle to describe God. The theological claims you're making may represent your truth, but they don't represent facts, or even everyone's truth.

 

[sojourner]

God is the Creator. Just only for God, no man can become a God like Him.

Thanks

that doesn't address the arguement. You said that everything had an opposite. I claimed that not everything has an opposite. God doesn't have an opposite. And you give me the above post in reply? God is "Creator." Show me the "uncreator" and you might have an argument.

 

[InChrist]

"There is a God. You are not He.

by Matt Slick

One of the best things I learned in Seminary was when a professor wrote on the board, "There is a God. You are not Him [sic]." Boy, has that proven true! Over the years, I've discovered how unwise, inexperienced, and ignorant I really am. Also, I've noticed that God doesn't consult me with making decisions about running the universe. And, if that isn't humiliating enough, He doesn't take any of my suggestions about how things ought to be in my own life. I don't understand why God doesn't take my suggestions. But, it comes down to one thing: There is a God. I am not He!

The Mormons teach you can become gods. The New Agers teach that you are, basically, already god(s) in nature. Certain heretical "Christian" teachers on TV say that we are little gods. And, some religions teach that when you die you join with the god-consciousness so you can "realize your full potential in oneness with the divine essence" . . . or whatever that means. They surely have high opinions of themselves."
https://carm.org/christianity/devotions/there-god-you-are-not-him

Now it is those who engage in mind altering contemplative mysticism and emergent conversation who are trying to pass off the same old (foolish) lie. There is nothing new under the sun.

 

[sojourner]

"There is a God. You are not He.

by Matt Slick

One of the best things I learned in Seminary was when a professor wrote on the board, "There is a God. You are not Him [sic]." Boy, has that proven true! Over the years, I've discovered how unwise, inexperienced, and ignorant I really am. Also, I've noticed that God doesn't consult me with making decisions about running the universe. And, if that isn't humiliating enough, He doesn't take any of my suggestions about how things ought to be in my own life. I don't understand why God doesn't take my suggestions. But, it comes down to one thing: There is a God. I am not He!

The Mormons teach you can become gods. The New Agers teach that you are, basically, already god(s) in nature. Certain heretical "Christian" teachers on TV say that we are little gods. And, some religions teach that when you die you join with the god-consciousness so you can "realize your full potential in oneness with the divine essence" . . . or whatever that means. They surely have high opinions of themselves."
https://carm.org/christianity/devotions/there-god-you-are-not-him

Now it is those who engage in mind altering contemplative mysticism and emergent conversation who are trying to pass off the same old (foolish) lie. There is nothing new under the sun.

Wait a minute! No one's suggesting that we are God. But that's far different than saying that we are all one in God or that we can be in union with God.

 

[InChrist]

Wait a minute! No one's suggesting that we are God. But that's far different than saying that we are all one in God or that we can be in union with God.

From some of the things you and Windwalker have posted it sounds like you are saying or suggesting that "you are God" or that you see no difference between Creator and created.

 

[Yoshua]

Of course religion isn't psychology. However, psychology is a part of everything you and I do as we live our lives, and it most certainly is a part of religious beliefs and practices. Do you not know or understand what religion is? Seriously? You need me to explain what religion is?

Psychology is the scientific study of the human mind and its functions, especially those affecting behavior in a given context; the mental characteristics or attitude of a person or group; the mental and emotional factors governing a situation or activity.

As you have said, Religion is not psychology. That is clear that psychology should not become a doctrine of Christ’s teaching. This is just my concern yet psychology can contribute in some aspect. Religion is a set of beliefs.

How then psychology has to do with the life and works of Jesus Christ in your perspective?

Thanks

 

[Yoshua]

theology doesn't exist to contain or produce "absolute truth." Theology is a vehicle to describe God. The theological claims you're making may represent your truth, but they don't represent facts, or even everyone's truth.

Hi Sojourner,

As simply as God who made the stars, we look up the sky and see stars with our own eyes. Then, there is a truth because what we see is what is said in the Bible.

Thanks

 

[Yoshua]

that doesn't address the arguement. You said that everything had an opposite. I claimed that not everything has an opposite. God doesn't have an opposite. And you give me the above post in reply? God is "Creator." Show me the "uncreator" and you might have an argument.

God is an exception to others.

Thanks

 

[sojourner]

From some of the things you and Windwalker have posted it sounds like you are saying or suggesting that "you are God" or that you see no difference between Creator and created.

You need to come to a better understanding of what we're saying then.

 

[sojourner]

Hi Sojourner,

As simply as God who made the stars, we look up the sky and see stars with our own eyes. Then, there is a truth because what we see is what is said in the Bible.

Thanks

That's a belief, not a fact.