what is hinduisms highest priority

[zenzero]

Friend atanu,

Thank you for your response.
Agree that the coffin of death has to be nailed completely; IF there is anything as *DEATH*. MIND itself is Satan and transcending the MIND itself is overcoming death.
However have repeated the fact that when one is part of the *whole* one does take the route of worship as that is only there are two, the worshiper and the worshiped.

Rgds Sanatan Dharma personal understanding is that it is mainly travelling to the no-mind through the mind and Gautama understood and evolved dharma by going straight to no-mind.

Your last mail mentioned about Debating by followers of sanatan dharma but never hatred or violence BUT still Gautama path was neither understood or accepted by most followers and practitioners of the time. Non-acceptance too is a form of violence/hatred.

Just read the link to the *mara* story but personal understanding is that whatever the mind sees even *mara* is an imagination [a mental creation].
Personally observe death many many times every day but the understanding here is contemporary and no imagination.

It is the unconscious that comes back after the energy gets used up in consciousness or rather the leakage of energy still remains and slowly the leakages have to be plugged.
We generate energy while in meditation or in n0-mind and to do that remaining conscious plugs leakages but the unconscious which is with us since millions of years from the stage of rocks through the evolutionary journey that it [unconsciousness] remains strong and so one has to face IT by being conscious. The final duality that remains is that of consciousness and unconsciousness and when both are overcome one is back to the market place drinking wine.

Love & rgds

 

[atanu]

Friend atanu,
Rgds Sanatan Dharma personal understanding is that it is mainly travelling to the no-mind through the mind and Gautama understood and evolved dharma by going straight to no-mind.
Love & rgds

Bandhu ZenZero

I think the above is not 100 % true. The teaching of Buddha itself is in Mind. We do not consider the Mind as the culprit. We consider its opacity as the culprit. Without the sattwik-transparent mind, scriptures would be of no use.

Further, all branches of Hinduism consider 'pratyaksha' as a valid pramana of truth. 'pratayksha' is different for different entitities in time and space and not everyone is ready for monkhood. If a mosquito bite bothers me, it is futile to deny it. But it is also true that the highest teaching of Hinduism is not in conflict with any other teaching. The following teaching of the Buddha conforms to Vedanta.

“There is, O monks, an unborn, unoriginated, uncreated, unformed. Were there not, O monks, this unborn, unoriginated, uncreated, unformed, there would be no escape from the world of the born, originated, created, formed.” (Buddha, "Udana 8.1 -8.3").

Many Buddha followers tend to think that shunya is equivalent of material void. Whereas Buddha indeed teaches about an ultimate entity existing as the unborn.

But in existence, in the realm of birth, the understanding of the all pervading nature of an enlightened Guru, who is equated to God, and thus considered worshippable as one's true Self is, IMO, unique to Vedanta. No other religion, IMO, emphasises that the true Guru's teaching is one's heart. And thus, Hinduism emphasises that the worship of the manifest and the unmanifest nature together can only lead to removal of the opacity of the mind and knowledge of the immanent and the transcendental truth..

I personally think that being in the realm of thoughts, it is impractical to deny it. Being an ego, it is futile to deny that many things of the universe bother me. At the same time we may always remember the goal -- unborn, unoriginated, uncreated, unformed, which for us is attainable through 'Neti-Neti' or 'Who Am I?.

Note: I am not trying to find deficiencies in any teaching but trying to show that particular teachings are suited to different levels of aspirants.


Om

 

[zenzero]

Friend atanu,

Thank you for your response.
Though have no great background in the studies of scriptures of any religion but find that all reach the same state.

Buddha indeed teaches about an ultimate entity existing as the unborn.

Personal understanding is that there is nothing as birth and death yet existence keeps evolving itself without any beginning or end. In this process the stage of nirvana is only a stage whereon physical birth as a form may be wish dependent but a formless form continues.
It is like the ice turning to water then vapour and then falls as rain but some vapour may be so light that they may not be falling as rain but will remain somewhere in existence in some formless form.

We do not consider the Mind as the culprit.

Noone is considering it as satan got created by default as a duality that by creating *god*.
Sunyata got created which is a state of both the un manifested and the manifested both together and so label it as *WHOLE*.Rather the YING and YANG always go together. All dualities combined is ONE rather not two

But in existence, in the realm of birth, the understanding of the all pervading nature of an enlightened Guru, who is equated to God, and thus considered worshippable as one's true Self is, IMO, unique to Vedanta. No other religion, IMO, emphasises that the true Guru's teaching is one's heart. And thus, Hinduism emphasises that the worship of the manifest and the unmanifest nature together can only lead to removal of the opacity of the mind and knowledge of the immanent and the transcendental truth..

Guru is form and form is no-form in form. the gross is the body and the subtle is the spirit and so guru can be in form or no-form besides the guru is important till one is not a whole in ITSELF where the guru and disciple is ONE.

I personally think that being in the realm of thoughts, it is impractical to deny it

It is the barrier or satan that had spoken off. Not that it is bad but one that needs to be transcended and a state reached where one is neither the ying or the yang at the same time it is both or none as the perceiver chooses.

Love & rgds

 

[atanu]

Friend atanu,

It is the barrier or satan that had spoken off. Not that it is bad but one that needs to be transcended and a state reached where one is neither the ying or the yang at the same time it is both or none as the perceiver chooses.

Love & rgds

Yes and No. We differentiate between Sattwik Mind and Tamasic-Rajasic mind.

Om

 

[zenzero]

Friend Atanu,

We differentiate between Sattwik Mind and Tamasic-Rajasic mind.

Those are states of the mind depending on the level of awareness/consciousness.
BUT still the MIND that THINKS is not transcended.

Love & rgds

 

[atanu]

Friend Atanu,
Those are states of the mind depending on the level of awareness/consciousness.
BUT still the MIND that THINKS is not transcended.

Love & rgds

Bandhu ZenZero

I agree. Yet.

It is the barrier or satan that had spoken off.

Believing strongly that everything is in Mind, yet you perceived Satan. In whose mind this Satan appeared?

In deep sleep alone all differences based on name and forms are obliterated. And beyond deep sleep is the unborn uncreated, which is the goal. As long as the goal is not attained, all are aspirants and not enlightened.

Om Namah Shivaya

 

[zenzero]

Friend atanu,

Sorry if you read the posts you will understand have only compared satan with the mind state which had been further qualified to the state of unconsciousness.
The ying and the yang.
If one perceives any god have mentioned that satan gets created by default.
Since perceive no god; satan too is not perceived.
As soon as consciousness comes in mind [unconsciousness recedes] like the darkness is dispelled where Light approaches.

Love & rgds

 

[atanu]

Friend atanu,
Sorry if you read the posts you will understand have only compared satan with the mind state which had been further qualified to the state of unconsciousness.
The ying and the yang.
If one perceives any god have mentioned that satan gets created by default.

Bandhu

Nothing to feel sorry about. I fully understand (from the beginning) what you convey.

Satan is not created by a sattwik mind -- no. Sattwik mind is that which has experienced reality of 'no mind' yet gives expression naturally to existence. It is all pervading and without taint. But it is true that for the non-enlightened, even a sattwik mind is a barrier. That is why Shr Krishna details how a sattwik mind binds one to happiness and exhorts us to transcend gunas altogether. My point has been that we know that gunas of the mind need transcending. But we also realise the taratmya between sattwik, rajasic and tamasic minds.

I asked when you perceive satan (barrier) in my thought, is your mind not perceiving it?

As soon as consciousness comes in mind [unconsciousness recedes] like the darkness is dispelled where Light approaches.

We again differentiate between pragnya ghana (awareness unparted by any thought and thus boundaryless and normally unperceivable to senses) and awareness as perceived by mind, due to emergence of thoughts. We believe that the thoughts are everchanging but the ground of those thoughts -- the Pragnya Ghana (unparted awareness to which everyone goes in deep sleep) is imperishable.

There is unborn Self, called Turya, which is beyond the states of deep sleep, dream and waking. This Self is the revealer of the revealed Pragnya Ghana -- also called Sarvesvara, Lord of All.

Pragnya Ghana- the ground of unparted consciousness- is the revealed state of the unborn Self. And Pragnya Ghana is imperishable, because it is the expression of Truth. I believe, that if one understands Pragnya Ghana sarvesvara -- Lord of All, no Satan is created.

Although one exists, no one knows anything in deep sleep because of non existence of any duality whatsover. But no one can do without it and all know that deep sleep is bliss. It is the ground wherein all seeds of manifestation are in unmanifest state. Thus it is the Lord of All.

We must remember that this is a thread on Goal of Hinduism and request patient reading. We must know that the consciousness spoken by Buddhists and Hindus may mean different things.

Regards

Om Namah Shivaya

 

[zenzero]

Friend atanu,

Thank you once again.
As have mentioned before am not very familiar with scriptural languages nor have much grasp of sanskrit.
However do understand most of what is conveyed.

The deep sleep you speak off is the state where the individual consciousness and the universal consciousness merges and so is bliss. Yes since one is unconscious of the state at that moment [in sleep] one has no knowledge of it. It is the same state when consciously done is meditation. Only by reaching this merging point consciously does transcendence occur.
The state where it is not TWO.
The state that all paths/religions point towards in different languages/ways/methods all that needs is to understand it.


Love & rgds

 

[atanu]

Friend atanu,

Thank you once again.

The deep sleep you speak off is the state where the individual consciousness and the universal consciousness merges and so is bliss. Yes since one is unconscious of the state at that moment [in sleep] one has no knowledge of it. It is the same state when consciously done is meditation. Only by reaching this merging point consciously does transcendence occur.
The state where it is not TWO.
The state that all paths/religions point towards in different languages/ways/methods all that needs is to understand it.

Love & rgds

:yes: As per me. Mandukya Upanishad gives us a goal that the transcendental Turya, beyond the unconscious deep sleep state, must be known consciously. This I consider as the ultimate goal as taught in Vedanta.

Thanks and Regards

 

[zenzero]

Friend atanu,

As per me. Mandukya Upanishad gives us a goal that the transcendental Turya, beyond the unconscious deep sleep state, must be known consciously. This I consider as the ultimate goal as taught in Vedanta.

As mentioned though have no proper studies of scriptures but through own understanding and practice travel the same path as the vedas or gautama or jesus and others but the way followed is No-WAY.
Further it is an understanding that All religions points to the same state.
It must be our effort to understand them at find similarities instead of differenciating between this scripture and that; as only by being one as humans and as beings the evolution takes a step ahead in its eternity.

Love & rgds

 

[iamfact]

I think I heard the highest priority in hinduism is pleasure do you think i am correct.

The priorities, the lower in the list, the better:
4. Kama - Pleasure
3. Artha - Money
2. Dharma - Duty, Righteousness
1. Moksha - Enlightenment / Liberation

According to some sages are four ways of achieving Moksha:
4. Bhakti - Love / Devotion
3. Karma - Service to humanity, and living beings.
2. Raja - Meditation, Yoga, Self-Control
1. Jnana - Knowledge

 

[Gaura Priya]

Still had a laugh from this thread...