What is the biggest scam in world history?

[Jose Fly]

Your post seems to be an attack on a Christian position but you linc is a matter of governence. I fail to see a correlation.

That sad account is a direct result of Prop 8 in CA, which passed largely due to campaigns from Christian groups.

If Christians really "loved the sinner" and simply "hated the sin", they wouldn't expend such enormous resources to deny gays their basic civil rights. There's absolutely no "love" in any of those actions.

 

[sandy whitelinger]

That sad account is a direct result of Prop 8 in CA, which passed largely due to campaigns from Christian groups.

If Christians really "loved the sinner" and simply "hated the sin", they wouldn't expend such enormous resources to deny gays their basic civil rights. There's absolutely no "love" in any of those actions.

Maybe I misunderstood your linc, but when did giving the person one lives with access to your health care become a civil right?

Edit: I went back and read it again, I had misremembered what it was about. Still all this looks like is a misuse of power. The proper legal procedures were ignored. Are you blaming Christians for the specific mistakes that were made?

 

[Gunfingers]

Maybe I misunderstood your linc, but when did giving the person one lives with access to your health care become a civil right?

It's not the specific privileges granted, it's Equal Protection Under the Law that is the civil right in question. People are guaranteed equal protection by the 14th amendment, but homosexuals are being consistently denied it.

 

[sandy whitelinger]

It's not the specific privileges granted, it's Equal Protection Under the Law that is the civil right in question. People are guaranteed equal protection by the 14th amendment, but homosexuals are being consistently denied it.

I think you are bunny trailing into a whole different area.

 

[Revoltingest]

The extended warranty.

 

[angellous_evangellous]

Ronald Reagan

 

[JustWondering2]

one of Ronald famous quote "Well......"

 

[Jose Fly]

Maybe I misunderstood your linc, but when did giving the person one lives with access to your health care become a civil right?

Edit: I went back and read it again, I had misremembered what it was about. Still all this looks like is a misuse of power. The proper legal procedures were ignored. Are you blaming Christians for the specific mistakes that were made?

Had Prop 8 not passed, these men could have married and none of the terrible actions would have occurred. Christian groups were directly behind Prop 8.

And this is merely 1 example of countless others where Christians actively work to deny gays the most fundamental of civil rights. In no way can that be considered "love".

 

[sandy whitelinger]

Had Prop 8 not passed, these men could have married and none of the terrible actions would have occurred. Christian groups were directly behind Prop 8.

And this is merely 1 example of countless others where Christians actively work to deny gays the most fundamental of civil rights. In no way can that be considered "love".

Some people at a hospital screwed up. That seems to be what your linc was about. Are you calling them Christian gay-haters?

Otherwise you're reaching to denigrate a Christian principle. At last look (I try not to look too closely these days) this is still a republic where we are free to vote for what anyone feels is right. If, supposedly, the Christian majority in California voted to not allow what they deem to be a sin not be allowed to be practiced, I fail to see how this lives up to being a violation of hate the sin but love the sinner. Legislating someone to allow something that one feels to wrong is not loving.

 

[Jose Fly]

Some people at a hospital screwed up. That seems to be what your linc was about. Are you calling them Christian gay-haters?

I'm saying the situation would have been extremely unlikely had Prop 8 not passed and the two men been legally married.

Otherwise you're reaching to denigrate a Christian principle. At last look (I try not to look too closely these days) this is still a republic where we are free to vote for what anyone feels is right.

Even civil rights? Should we have put the issue of desegregation up for a vote in the southern states in the 1960's?

If, supposedly, the Christian majority in California voted to not allow what they deem to be a sin not be allowed to be practiced, I fail to see how this lives up to being a violation of hate the sin but love the sinner. Legislating someone to allow something that one feels to wrong is not loving.

So merely being a homosexual is a sin? And allowing things like discrimination in housing, employment, and civil rights based on nothing more than sexual orientation is an example of "loving" someone? Those are all things Christian groups spend a lot of effort on.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I will admit, it is possible the earth is young, and everything, including the fossil record was created as is, but it's about a .00000 a million more 0's 0000001% chance of being real. Evolution is based on pure observation, so even if the Earth is young, that means God made it so his own creation would lead us to observe evolution as having had happened.Which means that logically the Earth is very old, or god is intentionally giving us bad evidence to deliberately mislead us away from him.

 

[fantome profane]

this is still a republic where we are free to vote for what anyone feels is right. If, supposedly, the Christian majority in California voted to not allow what they deem to be a sin not be allowed to be practiced, I fail to see how this lives up to being a violation of hate the sin but love the sinner. Legislating someone to allow something that one feels to wrong is not loving.

But don’t some people consider worshiping a different “God” a sin? Could the people of California vote to not allow certain kinds of worship? Would that be ok? Isn’t this the same thing?

 

[Man of Faith]

I will admit, it is possible the earth is young, and everything, including the fossil record was created as is, but it's about a .00000 a million more 0's 0000001% chance of being real. Evolution is based on pure observation, so even if the Earth is young, that means God made it so his own creation would lead us to observe evolution as having had happened.Which means that logically the Earth is very old, or god is intentionally giving us bad evidence to deliberately mislead us away from him.

The fossil record didn't have to be created as is, it could have been produced during the global flood.

 

[The_Evelyonian]

The fossil record didn't have to be created as is, it could have been produced during the global flood.

From TalkOrigins:

How was the fossil record sorted in an order convenient for evolution? Ecological zonation, hydrodynamic sorting, and differential escape fail to explain:

• the extremely good sorting observed. Why didn't at least one dinosaur make it to the high ground with the elephants?
• the relative positions of plants and other non-motile life. (Yun, 1989, describes beautifully preserved algae from Late Precambrian sediments. Why don't any modern-looking plants appear that low in the geological column?)
• why some groups of organisms, such as mollusks, are found in many geologic strata.
• why organisms (such as brachiopods) which are very similar hydrodynamically (all nearly the same size, shape, and weight) are still perfectly sorted.
• why extinct animals which lived in the same niches as present animals didn't survive as well. Why did no pterodons make it to high ground?
• how coral reefs hundreds of feet thick and miles long were preserved intact with other fossils below them.
• why small organisms dominate the lower strata, whereas fluid mechanics says they would sink slower and thus end up in upper strata.
• why artifacts such as footprints and burrows are also sorted. [Crimes & Droser, 1992]
• why no human artifacts are found except in the very uppermost strata. If, at the time of the Flood, the earth was overpopulated by people with technology for shipbuilding, why were none of their tools or buildings mixed with trilobite or dinosaur fossils?
• why different parts of the same organisms are sorted together. Pollen and spores are found in association with the trunks, leaves, branches, and roots produced by the same plants [Stewart, 1983].
• why ecological information is consistent within but not between layers. Fossil pollen is one of the more important indicators of different levels of strata. Each plant has different and distinct pollen, and, by telling which plants produced the fossil pollen, it is easy to see what the climate was like in different strata. Was the pollen hydraulically sorted by the flood water so that the climatic evidence is different for each layer?

 

[Jose Fly]

You're putting actual thought into this, and that becomes the point at which you and MoF diverge. Anything beyond "Teh Bible sez..." is gibberish to MoF.

Heck, when I was 8 years old I knew enough to ask my Sunday School teacher why trilobites and crabs weren't found mixed together. (Her answer was to "have faith", and she then had a talk with my mother about me "asking too many questions")

 

[Autodidact]

The fossil record didn't have to be created as is, it could have been produced during the global flood.

No, it couldn't. Unless you can explain why a flood would cause flying creatures to be buried in layers below crawling ones? Why, for example, pterodactyls are much lower in the rock layers than sloths or moles?

 

[The Voice of Reason]

The fossil record didn't have to be created as is, it could have been produced during the global flood.

Sure it could have. I mean, if you don't buy into the miracle of God just making it happen, you can always fall back on the flood myth. If you need a couple of other options, I'd offer up something along the lines of "Thor put them there", or "Isis willed it to be so".

You're really only limited by your imagination or the depth of your knowledge about Gods and myths. I mean, why not Paul Bunyon put them there, or Johnny Appleseed planting them?

 

[painted wolf]

Why are so many fossils not in sedimentary rock but volcanic ash? Why would those critters be in layers between sedimentary ones? Did the flood recede and then come back?

wa:do

 

[McBell]

No, it couldn't. Unless you can explain why a flood would cause flying creatures to be buried in layers below crawling ones? Why, for example, pterodactyls are much lower in the rock layers than sloths or moles?

Thats easy.
Please pick the one you like best:

It is not true.
pterodactyls are actually not lower than anything else.

God did that on purpose to test our faith.

The world wide flood also covered that place where God resides outside of time and thus it caused a wash-back effect that mixed up all the creatures from all the times.
Even the future.
​

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I'm sure he knows the truth now.

Yes, he does. Which is something that non of us can say.

The fossil record didn't have to be created as is, it could have been produced during the global flood.

For one thing, there isn't enough water on this planet to cause a global flood, and even if there was, it would have been seen in the fossil record, of which a global flood would have created it's own signature like any other event does. Everything from floods, volcanic eruptions, dry spells, wet spells, and just about every other even in nature leaves some sort of mark on the fossil and earth records.