What is the meaning of Acts 1:9-11?

[CG Didymus]

If you believe the stories are not true then why are you worried about what they say?
One minute you are trying to sus out what and even if the disciples saw Jesus ascend and what sort of body it was and then the next minute you are saying the whole thing is just rubbish anyway.

Exactly, why would a Baha'i say somethings are fictional, some things symbolic, and then use somethings, like verses in one gospel, that say that the work of Jesus was finished?

It is not that yesterdays good news has suddenly become not true or out of date for people of today.

But what do Baha'is do with the "good news", the best news, that Born-Again Christians believe in... That Jesus died to pay for your sins and my sins and everybody's sins. All we've got to do is except that free gift of salvation. All we have to do is believe the Jesus story. Which includes the virgin birth, that the tomb was empty and, in the resurrection and ascension. If he didn't rise from the dead, all of that is nothing but a big lie, a big hoax.

Many of us don't believe any of it. But... can a person believe part of it and be "saved"? Maybe, but how much do Baha'is really believe? They get rid of Satan and hell. They don't believe there is any sin debt inherited from Adam. They don't believe the resurrection and ascension of Jesus. So, why believe any of it? What is there left to believe? Even some of the miracles are questionable. And I do believe that they think that the physical body of Jesus died and has rotted away.

So still, for those of us that can't force ourselves to believe the story of Jesus as literal as Born-Again Christians, it does give us an alternative. But what I can't believe is how unimportant and useless they make the Bible and the NT. It becomes, virtually, a work of fiction... almost. For some reason, and in some way, they still say it is the truth from God. And yes, it is. Whatever they say is true is true. Whatever they say is symbolic or fictional, it is.

 

[Mark Charles Compton]

c. I believe that those verses have another meaning, different from what @Brian2 believes. They are about the return of Christ, but not about the return of the same man who was called Jesus.

I read it as an allegorical representation of a funeral pyre, which is even further expressed through one of the characters expressing the symbolic (or allegorical) return of the lost companion through the lighting of a candle or flame in remembrance.

A strong passage, for sure.

 

[Trailblazer]

But what do Baha'is do with the "good news", the best news, that Born-Again Christians believe in... That Jesus died to pay for your sins and my sins and everybody's sins.

Baha'is believe that Jesus died for our sins, we just don't believe that the same way that Christians do.
We do not believe in substitutional atonement since we don't believe in the original sin of Adam and Eve.

What Baha’is believe regarding how Adam brought sin into the world and how Christ saved us from that sin is explained below:

Question.—In verse 22 of chapter 15 of 1 Corinthians it is written: “For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.” What is the meaning of these words?​

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Answer.—Know that there are two natures in man: the physical nature and the spiritual nature. The physical nature is inherited from Adam, and the spiritual nature is inherited from the Reality of the Word of God, which is the spirituality of Christ. The physical nature is born of Adam, but the spiritual nature is born from the bounty of the Holy Spirit. The first is the source of all imperfection; the second is the source of all perfection.​

​

The Christ sacrificed Himself so that men might be freed from the imperfections of the physical nature and might become possessed of the virtues of the spiritual nature. This spiritual nature, which came into existence through the bounty of the Divine Reality, is the union of all perfections and appears through the breath of the Holy Spirit. It is the divine perfections; it is light, spirituality, guidance, exaltation, high aspiration, justice, love, grace, kindness to all, philanthropy, the essence of life. It is the reflection of the splendor of the Sun of Reality.​

​

All sin comes from the demands of nature, and these demands, which arise from the physical qualities, are not sins with respect to the animals, while for man they are sin. The animal is the source of imperfections, such as anger, sensuality, jealousy, avarice, cruelty, pride: all these defects are found in animals but do not constitute sins. But in man they are sins.​

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Adam is the cause of man’s physical life; but the Reality of Christ—that is to say, the Word of God—is the cause of spiritual life. It is “a quickening spirit,” meaning that all the imperfections which come from the requirements of the physical life of man are transformed into human perfections by the teachings and education of that spirit. Therefore, Christ was a quickening spirit, and the cause of life in all mankind.​

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Adam was the cause of physical life, and as the physical world of man is the world of imperfections, and imperfections are the equivalent of death, Paul compared the physical imperfections to death.​

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But the mass of the Christians believe that, as Adam ate of the forbidden tree, He sinned in that He disobeyed, and that the disastrous consequences of this disobedience have been transmitted as a heritage and have remained among His descendants. Hence Adam became the cause of the death of humanity. This explanation is unreasonable and evidently wrong, for it means that all men, even the Prophets and the Messengers of God, without committing any sin or fault, but simply because they are the posterity of Adam, have become without reason guilty sinners, and until the day of the sacrifice of Christ were held captive in hell in painful torment.​

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This is far from the justice of God. If Adam was a sinner, what is the sin of Abraham? What is the fault of Isaac, or of Joseph? Of what is Moses guilty?​

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Some Answered Questions, pp. 118-120​

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Read more: 29: EXPLANATION OF VERSE TWENTY-TWO, CHAPTER FIFTEEN, OF THE FIRST EPISTLE OF ST. PAUL TO THE CORINTHIANS​

 

[Yokefellow]

Are you suggesting the tree of life in Genesis had reproductive organs complete with ovaries and a monthly cycle?

FWIW such a tree is used symbolically in many different cultures.

Tree of life - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Something like that, yes.

Christians are taught that the concept of a Mother Earth is 'pagan', so they never see what is actually being taught in the Bible.

The Earth in Genesis represents the Mother (or perhaps Mother Potential). The Garden of Eden represents her Womb. The two trees represent two types of Ovary that have been fertilized. The Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil was fertilized by Satan. The Tree of Life was fertilized by God the Father.

Basically, Adam and his Wife were given a choice as to what Body they would like to incarnate into. I believe Adam's Wife was tempted by the thought of giving birth to Children, so she chose the body that would allow that. Adam followed along.

I also believe the World Egg is related to the Forbidden Fruit as both were responsible for creating a 'fallen universe'. You see an Egg being fertilized by the Serpent...

Cosmic egg - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Later, in the Book of Revelation, we find that Mother Earth is holding the Forbidden Fruit in her hand...

Revelation 17:4
"And the woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet colour, and decked with gold and precious stones and pearls, having a golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness of her fornication"

Most Christians do not understand that the contents are literal. We all partook of the Golden Cup in order to incarnate into this world.

 

[Yokefellow]

@Dawnofhope . Here you can see that someone knows the 'Secret' and has symbolized the Uterus in this painting...

• See how the Temple represents a Womb?
• Do you see the Ovary 'Tree' on each side?
• See how they are two different choices?
• See how they are shaped like giant leaves representing a Covering?
• The 'Gates' of the Womb is where the 'Male Seed' enters.
• The Gates are guarded against the uncircumcised Phallus penetrating it.
• The 'Waters' she gives birth to are People, Multitudes, Nations and Tongues (Revelation 17:15).
• Jesus is of course in the Womb but shown on the Cross which represents Conception.
• I'd hate to have to describe that extra 'brown hole' on the bottom where the skull is... lol.

So, basically this is not something I came up with, but something that is known in the Mystery Schools and is hidden from the public.

Here is another version made by Alchemists who knew the Mystery...

Another version by JFC Fuller...

J. F. C. Fuller - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Again, they hide all of this for some reason.

 

[Trailblazer]

And that is part of your problem right there.
But the truth is that when Jesus does describe it, it is no big deal to you to deny it also.
eg Mark 8:30 And Jesus warned them not to tell anyone about Him. 31 Then He began to teach them that the Son of Man must suffer many things and be rejected by the elders, chief priests, and scribes, and that He must be killed and after three days rise again.

The gospel 'according to Mark' is not Jesus describing it.

The Book of Mark, or Gospel of Mark, is a New Testament book written for Gentile converts and Roman believers. Its primary purpose is to emphasize that Jesus is the Son of God. The Book of Mark is thought to have been authored by John Mark between 60-70 CE while he was in Rome or Syria. Feb 12, 2023

Gospel of Mark History, Summary & Facts | Study.com​

One of those is a false Christ

Only in your opinion.

and yes, the Bible described Him differently than Baha'u'llah does.

Baha'u'llah did not describe Jesus very much since He came to proclaim His new message, but whenever He did describe Jesus it was all good.

Baha'u'llah is not the same Jesus and did not come as described and could not raise the dead and judge them and bring world peace etc etc and so Baha'u'llah had to say that the Bible does not mean what is written in it, but that he would tell them what it means because he is the return of the Christ spirit and so he should know what the Bible actually means.

Baha'u'llah did raise the spiritually dead and judge people, and eventually we will see world peace because of His revelation.

Jesus did not raise the dead and judge them and bring world peace, and He will never do so since He said He was 'no more in the world' and His 'work was finished' here.

And yet the Bible tells us differently and that Jesus would rule on the throne of David forever and be in the New Jerusalem which comes down from heaven to earth. (Rev 21)

No, the Bible does not tell us that, that is what you believe the Bible is saying. Those verses are not a reference to the same Jesus you believe in.

Luke 1:31 Behold, you will conceive and give birth to a son, and you are to give Him the name Jesus. 32 He will be great and will be called the Son of the Most High. The Lord God will give Him the throne of His father David, 33 and He will reign over the house of Jacob forever. His kingdom will never end!”
Is there even one thing that Baha'u'llah said that agrees with the Bible?

Below is what Abdu'l-Baha said about the Coming of Christ and why Jews rejected Jesus.

THE TRUE MEANING OF THE PROPHECIES CONCERNING THE COMING OF CHRIST

“In the Bible there are prophecies of the coming of Christ. The Jews still await the coming of the Messiah, and pray to God day and night to hasten His advent.

When Christ came they denounced and slew Him, saying: ‘This is not the One for whom we wait. Behold when the Messiah shall come, signs and wonders shall testify that He is in truth the Christ. We know the signs and conditions, and they have not appeared. The Messiah will arise out of an unknown city. He shall sit upon the throne of David, and behold, He shall come with a sword of steel, and with a sceptre of iron shall He rule! He shall fulfil the law of the Prophets, He shall conquer the East and the West, and shall glorify His chosen people the Jews. He shall bring with Him a reign of peace, during which even the animals shall cease to be at enmity with man. For behold the wolf and the lamb shall drink from the same spring, and the lion and the doe shall lie down in the same pasture, the serpent and the mouse shall share the same nest, and all God’s creatures shall be at rest’.

According to the Jews, Jesus the Christ fulfilled none of these conditions, for their eyes were holden and they could not see.

He came from Nazareth, no unknown place. He carried no sword in His hand, nor even a stick. He did not sit upon the Throne of David, He was a poor man. He reformed the Law of Moses, and broke the Sabbath Day. He did not conquer the East and the West, but was Himself subject to the Roman Law. He did not exalt the Jews, but taught equality and brotherhood, and rebuked the Scribes and Pharisees. He brought in no reign of peace, for during His lifetime injustice and cruelty reached such a height that even He Himself fell a victim to it, and died a shameful death upon the cross.

Thus the Jews thought and spoke, for they did not understand the Scriptures nor the glorious truths that were contained in them. The letter they knew by heart, but of the life-giving spirit they understood not a word. 56

Hearken, and I will show you the meaning thereof. Although He came from Nazareth, which was a known place, He also came from Heaven. His body was born of Mary, but His Spirit came from Heaven. The sword He carried was the sword of His tongue, with which He divided the good from the evil, the true from the false, the faithful from the unfaithful, and the light from the darkness. His Word was indeed a sharp sword! The Throne upon which He sat is the Eternal Throne from which Christ reigns for ever, a heavenly throne, not an earthly one, for the things of earth pass away but heavenly things pass not away. He re-interpreted and completed the Law of Moses and fulfilled the Law of the Prophets. His word conquered the East and the West. His Kingdom is everlasting. He exalted those Jews who recognized Him. They were men and women of humble birth, but contact with Him made them great and gave them everlasting dignity. The animals who were to live with one another signified the different sects and races, who, once having been at war, were now to dwell in love and charity, drinking together the water of life from Christ the Eternal Spring.

Thus, all the spiritual prophecies concerning the coming of Christ were fulfilled, but the Jews shut their eyes that they should not see, and their ears that they should not hear, and the Divine Reality of Christ passed through their midst unheard, unloved and unrecognized.”
Abdu'l-Baha, Paris Talks, pp. 54-56

(Continued on next post)

 

[Trailblazer]

Below is what Abdu'l-Baha said about the Second Coming and the Day of Judgment.

26: THE SECOND COMING OF CHRIST AND THE DAY OF JUDGMENT

“It is said in the Holy Books that Christ will come again, and that His coming depends upon the fulfillment of certain signs: when He comes, it will be with these signs. For example, “The sun will be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven…. And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.” 1 Bahá’u’lláh has explained these verses in the Kitáb-i-Íqán. 2 There is no need of repetition; refer to it, and you will understand these sayings.

But I have something further to say upon this subject. At His first coming Christ also came from heaven, as it is explicitly stated in the Gospel. Christ Himself says: “And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but He that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.” 3

It is clear to all that Christ came from heaven, although apparently He came from the womb of Mary. At the first coming He came from heaven, though apparently from the womb; in the same way, also, at His second coming He will come from heaven, though apparently from the womb. The conditions that are indicated in the Gospel for the second coming of Christ are the same as those that were mentioned for the first coming, as we said before.

The Book of Isaiah announces that the Messiah will conquer the East and the West, and all nations of the world will come under His shadow, that His Kingdom will be established, that He will come from an unknown place, that the sinners will be judged, and that justice will prevail to such a degree that the wolf and the lamb, the leopard and the kid, the sucking child and the asp, shall all gather at one spring, and in one meadow, and one dwelling. 4 The first coming was also under these conditions, though outwardly none of them came to pass. Therefore, the Jews rejected Christ, and, God forbid! called the Messiah masíkh, 5 considered Him to be the destroyer of the edifice of God, regarded Him as the breaker of the Sabbath and the Law, and sentenced Him to death. Nevertheless, each one of these conditions had a signification that the Jews did not understand; therefore, they were debarred from perceiving the truth of Christ.

The second coming of Christ also will be in like manner: the signs and conditions which have been spoken of all have meanings, and are not to be taken literally. Among other things it is said that the stars will fall upon the earth. The stars are endless and innumerable, and modern mathematicians have established and proved scientifically that the globe of the sun is estimated to be about one million and a half times greater than the earth, and each of the fixed stars to be a thousand times larger than the sun. If these stars were to fall upon the surface of the earth, how could they find place there? It would be as though a thousand million of Himalaya mountains were to fall upon a grain of mustard seed. According to reason and science this thing is quite impossible. What is even more strange is that Christ said: “Perhaps I shall come when you are yet asleep, for the coming of the Son of man is like the coming of a thief.” 6 Perhaps the thief will be in the house, and the owner will not know it.

It is clear and evident that these signs have symbolic signification, and that they are not literal. They are fully explained in the Kitáb-i-Íqán. Refer to it.”
Some Answered Questions, pp. 110-112

And more disagreement with the Bible. Is it any wonder that I say that the fruit of Baha'u'llah, the false prophet, is to deny what the Bible says?
Gabriel was sent from God to Mary about her conception. (Luke 1:26)
Gabriel also spoke to Daniel (Dan 9:21)
Gabriel also spoke to Zechariah in the Temple about John the Baptist. (Luke 1:18-19)

No, the Baha'i belief about angels is not in disagreement with the Bible.
There are angels who are humans in this material world and there are angels in the spiritual world.
According to Baha'i beliefs, angels are:

“And now, concerning His words: “And He shall send His angels….” By “angels” is meant those who, reinforced by the power of the spirit, have consumed, with the fire of the love of God, all human traits and limitations, and have clothed themselves with the attributes of the most exalted Beings and of the Cherubim..... And now, inasmuch as these holy beings have sanctified themselves from every human limitation, have become endowed with the attributes of the spiritual, and have been adorned with the noble traits of the blessed, they therefore have been designated as “angels.” Such is the meaning of these verses, every word of which hath been expounded by the aid of the most lucid texts, the most convincing arguments, and the best established evidences.” Bahá’u’lláh, The Kitáb-i-Íqán, pp. 78-80

Baha’i beliefs concur with what is in the Bible, the Old Testament:

Question: "What are cherubim? Are cherubs angels?"

Answer: Cherubim/cherubs are angelic beings involved in the worship and praise of God. The cherubim are first mentioned in the Bible in Genesis 3:24, “After He drove the man out, He placed on the east side of the Garden of Eden cherubim and a flaming sword flashing back and forth to guard the way to the tree of life.” Prior to his rebellion, Satan was a cherub (Ezekiel 28:12-15). The tabernacle and temple along with their articles contained many representations of cherubim (Exodus 25:17-22; 26:1, 31; 36:8; 1 Kings 6:23-35; 7:29-36; 8:6-7; 1 Chronicles 28:18; 2 Chronicles 3:7-14; 2 Chronicles 3:10-13; 5:7-8; Hebrews 9:5).

What are cherubim? Are cherubs angels? | GotQuestions.org

 

[Trailblazer]

Jesus describes Himself as "The Son of Man", the eschatological human figure and there are good reasons why even the use of "The Son of Man" when describing the one who would return, is the same Jesus,,,,,,,,,,,, the one to whom all judgement is given by His Father. (John 5)

"The Son of Man" when describing the one who would return, cannot be the same Jesus unless the Bible is in error ((John 14:19, John 16:10, John 17:4, John 17:11)

All judgment was given to Jesus during the Christian dispensation, but we are no longer living in that dispensation.
You are trying to apply certain verses in the Bible to today's world but they no longer apply.

There is absolutely no reason to believe any differently except that Baha'u'llah claimed himself to be "The Son of Man".
The Son of Man who comes to judge the world has to be Jesus according to the gospels because Jesus is the one to whom all judgement has been given.
Son of man - Wikipedia

Baha'u'llah did not claim to be "The Son of Man"!

All judgment was given to Jesus during the Christian dispensation, but now all judgment has been given to Baha'u'llah.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Son_of_man

Satan will be destroyed when the gospel has been preached to everyone and Jesus comes back. He has an interest in hindering that process and has done that. Certainly the gospel had not been preached to everyone in 1844 even if some journalist somewhere says differently.

Bible scholars agreed that the gospel had been preached to everyone by the mid-19th century.
Nobody is hindering Jesus from coming back except Jesus Himself, since He never planned to come back.

Acts 1: 9 And when he had said these things, as they were looking on, he was lifted up, and a cloud took him out of their sight. 10 And while they were gazing into heaven as he went, behold, two men stood by them in white robes, 11 and said, “Men of Galilee, why do you stand looking into heaven? This Jesus, who was taken up from you into heaven, will come in the same way as you saw him go into heaven.”

Yes it is an angel who was speaking to the disciples and telling them that the same Jesus would come back the same way they saw Him go to heaven.

But who cares, Baha'u'llah says it is not the truth and so you agree.
The truth is that you have been turned away from the real Jesus by the teachings of Baha'u'llah.

So what if Luke wrote that an angel said what is in those verses? Do you think I am going to throw away my eternal life based upon three verses never uttered by Jesus? If you want to do that it is your choice, but it is highly illogical. You can keep waiting for the same Jesus, but when you die and see Jesus in heaven and He asks why you did not recognize Him when He returned, what are you going to say? I would not want to be in your shoes. By contrast, since I have recognized Jesus and Baha'u'llah my eternal life is secure.

Baha'u'llah never said anything about those verses, I figured it out all by myself.

The truth is that you have been turned away from the return of Christ by the teachings of Christianity, you and millions of other Christians.

 

[Trailblazer]

Are we discussing what the Bible teaches or something else? There are plenty of examples of Angels appearing and disappearing...

Exodus 3:2
"And the angel of the LORD appeared unto him in a flame of fire out of the midst of a bush: and he looked, and, behold, the bush burned with fire, and the bush was not consumed."

What exactly are we debating? Your imagination?

I do not interpret everything in the Bible literally. I think a lot of the Bible is symbolic.

For example, I don't believe angels appear in a flame of fire out of a bush and I don't believe a bush actually burned with fire.

Why not both?

Because I do not believe there is anything physical in heaven, I believe it is a spiritual world.

Are you sure?

Yes, I am sure that the Tree of Life is symbolic, not a physical tree.

You are 'spiritualizing away' the profound meanings of the Bible.

You are making up your own meanings, meanings I have never heard from any Christian.
Why do you think that you alone know what the Bible means? Who gave you the authority to interpret the Bible?

Taking on a new form consists of entering the Yoni Gates of the New Jerusalem Mother and partaking of the Zygote to be reconceived. It is the opposite of how you got here. You partook of your Mom's 'Forbidden Fruit' and here you are. Now, you must be Born Again of Incorruptible Seed...

Sorry, I do not believe that.

1 Peter 1:23
"Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever."

Again, the Seed is the Word of God.

I can agree that the seed is the Word of God.

It? Really?

Proverbs 3:18
"She is a tree of life to them that lay hold upon her: and happy is every one that retaineth her."

Is there something wrong with the word 'She'? Is that offensive now?

I did not write that. I just grabbed it from what someone else wrote. Now I see it is 'She' in the actual Bible translations, but so what?

Don't ask me what that verse or chapter means because I don't pretend to know, or care.

And Spirit. You are missing the most important part.

That depends upon what you mean by Spirit.
Below is what I believe about the spirit and the soul.

“The human spirit which distinguishes man from the animal is the rational soul, and these two names—the human spirit and the rational soul—designate one thing. This spirit, which in the terminology of the philosophers is the rational soul, embraces all beings, and as far as human ability permits discovers the realities of things and becomes cognizant of their peculiarities and effects, and of the qualities and properties of beings. But the human spirit, unless assisted by the spirit of faith, does not become acquainted with the divine secrets and the heavenly realities. It is like a mirror which, although clear, polished and brilliant, is still in need of light. Until a ray of the sun reflects upon it, it cannot discover the heavenly secrets.

But the mind is the power of the human spirit. Spirit is the lamp; mind is the light which shines from the lamp. Spirit is the tree, and the mind is the fruit. Mind is the perfection of the spirit and is its essential quality, as the sun’s rays are the essential necessity of the sun.”
Some Answered Questions, pp. 208-209

55: SOUL, SPIRIT AND MIND

A New Heaven and New Earth is literally the definition of a Parallel Universe...

Isaiah 65:17
"For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: and the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind."

Isaiah 66:22
"For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the LORD, so shall your seed and your name remain."

2 Peter 3:13
"Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness."

Revelation 21:1
"And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea."

I do not believe that a New Heaven and New Earth is the definition of a Parallel Universe...
Again, I do not pretend to know what the Bible means because I was never a Christian!

I can only say what I believe the according to the Baha'i Writings, and in them is no indication of a new heaven, only a new earth.

Baha'is believe that we will live on a New Earth after Christ returns, and we believe that Baha'u'llah was the return of Christ.

Baha'is and Christians believe differently about what the New Earth will be and how it will be established.
Baha'is believe that the New Earth will be established in the present age, which began in 1844 AD, and it will be established by people working together to build it.

The Guardian of the Baha'i Faith called this age "the Great, the Golden Age of a long-divided, a long-afflicted humanity."

Baha'u'llah referred to this new age as the Day of God. Gleanings, p. 13
and He further stated that this is the Day in which humanity would be united in perfect unity and peace.

“This is the Day in which God’s most excellent favors have been poured out upon men, the Day in which His most mighty grace hath been infused into all created things. It is incumbent upon all the peoples of the world to reconcile their differences, and, with perfect unity and peace, abide beneath the shadow of the Tree of His care and loving-kindness. It behoveth them to cleave to whatsoever will, in this Day, be conducive to the exaltation of their stations, and to the promotion of their best interests. Happy are those whom the all-glorious Pen was moved to remember, 7 and blessed are those men whose names, by virtue of Our inscrutable decree, We have preferred to conceal.​

​

Beseech ye the one true God to grant that all men may be graciously assisted to fulfil that which is acceptable in Our sight. Soon will the present-day order be rolled up, and a new one spread out in its stead. Verily, thy Lord speaketh the truth, and is the Knower of things unseen.”​

​

Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 6- 7​

Baha'is believe that the New Earth is a new world order in which we will see the spiritualization of the peoples of the world and man will become a noble being adorned with divine virtues and perfections: New Race of Men

The “World Order” that Baha’is envision pertains to a number of subjects: politics and governance, economics, society, and religion, as is covered briefly in this blog: Toward a New World Order?

Obviously, the verses are not talking about where we are now.

John went through a Portal...

Revelation 4:1
"After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter."

John traveled to a Parallel Universe and back. Those are the facts. Now you know, but will you remember? Will you acknowledge? I have my doubts. I am not trying to be mean, but you come off as someone who would rather ignore that which is presented to you.

No, those are not facts. Nothing in the Bible is a fact, since a fact is something that has been proven to be true.
This is simply your interpretation of some Bible verses but if I asked other Christians they'd all have different interpretations.

Ok and? What are you saying? Because you or someone else does not know, that means no one else knows? Are you the gatekeeper of knowledge?

No, I am not saying that because I do not know and someone else does not know, that means no one else knows.
Are you the gatekeeper of knowledge? God only knows what those verses mean.

The Bible is clear...

2 Peter 3:12
"Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?"

Not just one Heaven, but ALL Heavens will be dissolved. This is like Bible 101. Who are these so called 'Christians' you are getting your Info from? They sound incredibly misinformed.

This is symbolic language, not literal truth, but you are free to believe it if you want to.

This is not Bible 101. It is @Yokefellow 101.

Oh, so the Kingdom of God is like Seed is it? Seed is the Word? You mean to tell me that the Kingdom of God is a Seed Bank in the form of Genetic Sequences?

But wait...

God said that we are made of corrupted Seed. You mean to tell me that the Kingdom of God Genome has corrupted sequences leading to cancer, sickness and death?

Not a literal seed. Seed is symbolic of something that grows, and it grows from small beginnings.
The Kingdom of God on earth is just beginning to grow so it is still small.

Well, what do you know. They got that part correct. Beware the Leaven (corrupted words) of the Pharisees...

Matthew 16:12
"Then understood they how that he bade them not beware of the leaven of bread, but of the doctrine of the Pharisees and of the Sadducees."

That verse is easy to understand and it is not symbolic so there is no need to ascribe anything to it but the plain meaning.

Christians can be ignorant. What else is new?

If it is not generally interpreted that way in this parable that means Christians are ignorant?.

Luke 24:39
"Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have."

Jesus did not say that, Luke wrote that, but Luke never knew Jesus, and that was written long after Jesus lived.

Luke 24:51-53, continued with John 1:1-16, on Papyrus 75, written about AD 175-225.

when was luke 24 written - Google Search

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Again, you are free to believe whatever you want to believe but don't expect me to believe it.
I will never believe that Jesus rose in a physical body, NEVER.

 

[CG Didymus]

Satan will be destroyed when the gospel has been preached to everyone and Jesus comes back. He has an interest in hindering that process and has done that. Certainly the gospel had not been preached to everyone in 1844 even if some journalist somewhere says differently.

I always quote the verse that says there will be wars and rumors of wars but that is not yet the end. But isn't there supposed to be an anti-christ or some evil leader that comes before Jesus returns? You know all that stuff about can't buy or sell without having the mark of the beast. And about things being so bad that if allowed to continue no one would be able to survive? That hasn't literally happened. The Baha'is don't address all of them, and the ones they do, they have their own "symbolic" way of interpreting them to make them fit.

How do you interpret those verses that are believed to be end-time prophecies?

 

[URAVIP2ME]

I always quote the verse that says there will be wars and rumors of wars but that is not yet the end. But isn't there supposed to be an anti-christ or some evil leader that comes before Jesus returns? You know all that stuff about can't buy or sell without having the mark of the beast. And about things being so bad that if allowed to continue no one would be able to survive? That hasn't literally happened. The Baha'is don't address all of them, and the ones they do, they have their own "symbolic" way of interpreting them to make them fit.
How do you interpret those verses that are believed to be end-time prophecies?

A lot of people I find look for an Anti-Christ person to come.
In Scripture anti-Christ is anyone who is against Christ.
'Evil leader' as found at 1st Thessalonians 5:2-3 - when 'they' (who are the powers in charge) will be saying, "Peace and Security..." but that Rosy saying is to lead people down that old Primrose Path instead that Rosy saying will prove to be the precursor to the coming great tribulation of Revelation 7:14.
Also, false clergy (who seat themselves in the 'temple' aka houses of worship) are really anti-God. - 2nd Thess. 2:2-4
Yes, unless the great tribulation days are cut short No one would survive - Matthew 24:21-22

 

[CG Didymus]

A lot of people I find look for an Anti-Christ person to come.
In Scripture anti-Christ is anyone who is against Christ.
'Evil leader' as found at 1st Thessalonians 5:2-3 - when 'they' (who are the powers in charge) will be saying, "Peace and Security..." but that Rosy saying is to lead people down that old Primrose Path instead that Rosy saying will prove to be the precursor to the coming great tribulation of Revelation 7:14.
Also, false clergy (who seat themselves in the 'temple' aka houses of worship) are really anti-God. - 2nd Thess. 2:2-4
Yes, unless the great tribulation days are cut short No one would survive - Matthew 24:21-22

How about the beast and false prophet stuff in Revelation?

 

[Bthoth]

@Brian2 and I have been discussing the following verses and what they mean for over 10 years. The discussion began on another forum and it has continued here. This thread was inspired by the following post on another thread.

In post #690, @Brian2 said:
We start off with the idea that Jesus rose bodily from the dead, as the gospels stories tell us. Then we have the disciples and Jesus (in His resurrection body presumably) ascending in front of His disciples and being hidden by cloud.
It's not complicated really. Just read it slowly and think about it as you do, I'm sure you will be able to see it. Give it a go.

Acts 1:9 After he said this, he was taken up before their very eyes, and a cloud hid him from their sight. 10 They were looking intently up into the sky as he was going, when suddenly two men dressed in white stood beside them. 11 “Men of Galilee,” they said, “why do you stand here looking into the sky? This same Jesus, who has been taken from you into heaven, will come back in the same way you have seen him go into heaven.”


I could not figure out how to insert a Poll, so please select one or more from the following options.

a. I believe that Jesus ascended into the physical clouds in the sky in His resurrection body in front of His disciples. I also believe that Jesus will return to earth, descending from heaven on the clouds.

b. I do not believe that Jesus ascended into the physical clouds in the sky in His resurrection body in front of His disciples. I also do not believe that Jesus will return to earth, descending from heaven on the clouds.

c. I believe that those verses have another meaning, different from what @Brian2 believes. They are about the return of Christ, but not about the return of the same man who was called Jesus.

d. I believe that those verses are only part of a made-up fictional story, not about anything that ever happened or ever will ever happen.

b... No and no. Jesus was a teacher/student, not a god, nor child representing god.