What is "woke" in 2024

[icehorse]

I find this interesting.

It seems like you're being sincere (though we never really know on the internet), but also unaware how this post is basically a big advertisement for just how detached from reality your opinions are.

Other people who use "woke" as an insult: do you agree with the OP?

Why make it personal? Why are you so certain you're not the one detached from reality?

I will give you the same example I've given to several other posters who have failed to respond:

If I'm detached from reality explain the massive influence that Ibram X Kendi and Robin DiAngelo have had?

 

[Argentbear]

One example that leaps to mind is trans activism. We're told that trans people are the most oppressed (although good evidence is scarce as hen's teeth),

73% of transgender youth are abused, emotionally, physically, sexually by their parents. Brian C. Thoma, Disparities in Childhood Abuse Between Transgender and Cisgender Adolescents
78% of transgender youth in high school are bullied (harassed or physically attacked) 20% of this comes from school staff. Ruari-Santiago McBride A literature review of the secondary school experiences of trans youth

Arkansas: Allows any medical professionals to refuse to treat Transgender patients
Mississippi: Allows private insurers to refuse to cover transgender individuals
Alabama: doctors can refuse to treat LGBTQ people
South Carolina: doctors can refuse to treat LGBTQ people
Tennessee: doctors can refuse to treat LGBTQ people
Ohio: doctors can refuse to treat LGBTQ people
Illinois: doctors can refuse to treat LGBTQ people
FLorida Allows any medical professionals to refuse to treat Transgender patients

One in ten trans people has been evicted from their homes because of their gender identity.
40% of transgender individuals have been fired for being trans

I can go on

and presumably that excuses the fact that trans activists routinely get away with horrific misogyny. (And again, I don't want to detour here, but I believe on this topic I have repeatedly advocated for non-zero-sum solutions. We can take this up elsewhere.)

Which is a nice way of saying you have no intention of backing up your sick claim

 

[Quagmire]

Which is why the title of the thread includes "2024".

And I appreciate your nod to McCarthyism, although I suspect you see that happening only from the far right and not also from the far left?

I'm not sure I understand your question.

Do I see what happening only from the far right and not also from the far left?

 

[Father Heathen]

Did you read post 15 concerning the overton window?

Right, but people you claim are influential actually aren't. After all, why is it that none of the liberals/leftists here agreed with any of your list, nor know anyone who does? Abram and Robin are random nobodies.

 

[icehorse]

73% of transgender youth are abused, emotionally, physically, sexually by their parents. Brian C. Thoma, Disparities in Childhood Abuse Between Transgender and Cisgender Adolescents
78% of transgender youth in high school are bullied (harassed or physically attacked) 20% of this comes from school staff. Ruari-Santiago McBride A literature review of the secondary school experiences of trans youth

Arkansas: Allows any medical professionals to refuse to treat Transgender patients
Mississippi: Allows private insurers to refuse to cover transgender individuals
Alabama: doctors can refuse to treat LGBTQ people
South Carolina: doctors can refuse to treat LGBTQ people
Tennessee: doctors can refuse to treat LGBTQ people
Ohio: doctors can refuse to treat LGBTQ people
Illinois: doctors can refuse to treat LGBTQ people
FLorida Allows any medical professionals to refuse to treat Transgender patients

One in ten trans people has been evicted from their homes because of their gender identity.
40% of transgender individuals have been fired for being trans

I can go on






Which is a nice way of saying you have no intention of backing up your sick claim

I will be happy to take this up elsewhere, I think many of your claims above are invalid

 

[icehorse]

Right, but people you claim are influential actually aren't. After all, why is it that none of the liberals/leftists here agreed with any of your list, nor know anyone who does? Abram and Robin are random nobodies.

Hmmm, they are both best selling authors, each having sold hundreds of thousand of books, and they both have speaking tours, talking to thousands of people live, but we should give more credence to a handful of RFer's. Help me out with your math?

 

[anna.]

Hmmm, they are both best selling authors, each having sold hundreds of thousand of books, and they both have speaking tours, talking to thousands of people live, but we should give more credence to a handful of RFer's. Help me out with your math?

I'd never heard of them before you mentioned them here a while back. And I've been around various political forums for well over 20 years.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

What is "woke" in 2024

I appears to be everything the far right doesn't like they identify as woke.

As for your list i pretty much agree with DS and everyone else whi thinks this is nonsense

Yup. They don't even know what it is. They just use it to describe things they don't like. It's just as bad as their garbage of "identity politics." For people turned off by "identity" they sure give an aweful big **** about their identity as American, Christian, Conservative, MAGA, etc. and so on.

 

[icehorse]

I'd never heard of them before you mentioned them here a while back. And I've been around various political forums for well over 20 years.

It can be informative to spend a little time skimming Amazon's best seller lists - it can help a person be more attached to reality

 

[anna.]

It can be informative to spend a little time skimming Amazon's best seller lists - it can help a person be more attached to reality

I guess that explains a lot about your OP list... you culled it from Amazon comments?

Hey everyone who wants to be more attached to reality! You should definitely spend more time skimming Amazon's best seller lists!

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I will be happy to take this up elsewhere, I think many of your claims above are invalid

More accurate than your nonsensical list in your OP. Where did you even get some of this stuff? All white people are racist? All white cultures are imperialist? Only Western cultures can be criticized? Critical thinking is a tool of oppressors?
What loony bin did you scrape this bizarre and outlandish list from?

 

[icehorse]

I guess that explains a lot about your OP list... you culled it from Amazon comments?

Hey everyone who wants to be more attached to reality! You should definitely spend more time skimming Amazon's best seller lists!

No I did not cull it from Amazon comments ffs.

Let's see if I'm understanding you correctly: Your "team" is arguing that I'm detached from reality, and you're also arguing that books that sell hundreds of thousands of copies aren't a good metric of reality?

Help me understand your math

 

[icehorse]

More accurate than your nonsensical list in your OP. Where did you even get some of this stuff? All white people are racist? All white cultures are imperialist? Only Western cultures can be criticized? Critical thinking is a tool of oppressors?
What loony bin did you scrape this bizarre and outlandish list from?

I believe you will be the 4th RFer I've said this to:

Explain your logic in the face of Kendi's and DiAngelo's best selling books and speaking tours?

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Let's see if I'm understanding you correctly: Your "team" is arguing that I'm detached from reality, and you're also arguing that books that sell hundreds of thousands of copies aren't a good metric of reality?

Ad populum only serves to tell us how popular something is. Being popular doesn't mean it's correct or grounded in reality.

 

[Jimmy]

Woke now is just a sales pitch

 

[anna.]

No I did not cull it from Amazon comments ffs.

Let's see if I'm understanding you correctly: Your "team" is arguing that I'm detached from reality, and you're also arguing that books that sell hundreds of thousands of copies aren't a good metric of reality?

Help me understand your math

I don't have a "team." Are you trying to shove people onto "teams" again?

And the bandwagon fallacy applies to your argument, as @Shadow Wolf has pointed out already.

 

[icehorse]

Ad populum only serves to tell us how popular something is. Being popular doesn't mean it's correct or grounded in reality.

FWIW, Kendi and DiAngelo are advocates for the ideas in the OP list.

The fact that they have such broad audiences means that these views are not "detached from reality", they are in fact quite common.

As for correctness, I don't think they're correct.

 

[icehorse]

I don't have a "team." Are you trying to shove people onto "teams" again?

And the bandwagon fallacy applies to your argument, as @Shadow Wolf has pointed out already.

Well in this thread it's basically me against everyone else. (I welcome the challenge )

So an informal "team" has sprung up on this thread.

Again, if hundreds of thousands of people agree with the ideas on this list, then explain how you can argue that the list is detached from reality?

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I believe you will be the 4th RFer I've said this to:

Explain your logic in the face of Kendi's and DiAngelo's best selling books and speaking tours?

Explain why you don't know this very basic, 101, into to philosophy and logic stuff but try to pass yourself off as knowledgeable of them? Seriously, one of the first things you learn in such a path is invalid and illogical arguments. Argumentum ad populum is one these very basic things freshman year philosophy students learn about, and it's something anyone who pays attention realizes, such as the over abundance of very common fallacies that are widely believed, like that we only use 10% of our brain. That fallacy is very widely believed, very popular in common discourse, but it has no basis at all in reality. "Luke, I am your father" is frustratingly popular, but watch the movie; that is NOT what was said. There's even a term for it, the Mendela Effect, where a fantasy that didn't happen becomes the popular "how it happened" in society at large.
Or we can go back to sacrificing virgins because that one was super popular amongst the various peoples. Or how about we collect the heads of those who were killed in war? That was a very popular and believed to be necessary practice among the Celts and Samurai. And there's blood letting, a practice that lived for many, many centuries until we learned the popular treatment is wrong and probably even killed some people being treated with it.

 

[anna.]

Well in this thread it's basically me against everyone else. (I welcome the challenge )

So an informal "team" has sprung up on this thread.

Again, if hundreds of thousands of people agree with the ideas on this list, then explain how you can argue that the list is detached from reality?

No. There is no informal "team" so I'm not a member. Maybe quit trying to shoehorn people into your identity politics by assigning them identities of your choosing. I know you like being oppositional, why not just revel in it? You set the stage for it over and over again here with your identity politicking.

I admit that when I call someone “woke”, I’m guilty of using IP.