What is your short story or one sentence, Why Do You love God?

[YoursTrue]

The Greek (original) text reads" Πῶς οὗτος γράμματα οἶδε, μὴ μεμαθηκώς?"
meaning literally: "How does he know the letters, since he hasn't learned them?"
In any case, I wrote this because of Jesus' answer in bold.

It still does not mean that Jesus could not read or write. I can go further, but the first three translations I read on this say:
New International Version
The Jews there were amazed and asked, “How did this man get such learning without having been taught?”
New Living Translation
The people were surprised when they heard him. “How does he know so much when he hasn’t been trained?” they asked.
English Standard Version
The Jews therefore marveled, saying, “How is it that this man has learning, when he has never studied?”

(Nothing about being illiterate, plus we know he read from the scroll in the synagogue.) Paul had great learning but didn't mean much insofar as the resurrected Jesus was concerned. So Paul changed his viewpoint.

 

[YoursTrue]

Don't be sorry...
I always try to use scripture to "debunk" scripture, if needed..
As for Jesus, there are conflicting reports in the Gospels, but is irrelevant to our discussion regarding John's education.
John 7:15-16 reads "The Jews marveled at it, saying, “How is it that this man has learning, when he has never studied?” 16 So Jesus answered them, “My teaching is not mine, but his who sent me" Mark 6:2-4 also supports the idea that people at the time believed he was illiterate.. On the other hand Luke (4:16-21) writing about the same story as in Mark's, omits the Jewish doubts about Jesus' education and states that Jesus could read.
We will never find out the truth, although I'm inclined to think that Jesus was probably able to read, or at least was taught orally about the scriptures, as the vast majority of non-elite Jews were.
Have a good day too!

What Jesus said would be in harmony with his teaching. His teaching was not that of the scribes and Pharisees, but rather those of his Father. I appreciate that.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

I am an expression of God, this expression (me) tunes into God's love for his creation and am lost in the love.

 

[Hockeycowboy]

@Ajax , keep in mind that organized schools back then, for Jews, were Rabbinic schools. Israelites, and later, the Jews, were not an illiterate people.

In talking about any Israelite striving to please Jehovah, the psalmist said: “But his delight is in the law of Jehovah, And in his law he reads in an undertone day and night.”

Also, consider what the Scriptures at Mark 1:19,20 say about the future apostles, James & John:

“And after going a little farther he [Jesus] saw James the [son] of Zebʹe·dee and John his brother, in fact, while they were in their boat mending their nets; 20 and without delay he called them. In turn they left their father Zebʹe·dee in the boat with the hired men and went off after him.”

They were running a business, complete with employees.
They weren’t ignorant.

Take care.

 

[Hockeycowboy]

Hey, @Ajax , since you know the Koine Greek language (and its lack of the indefinite articles), what is your take on John 1:1?

And if I may ask, your view of how the Bible describes Satan?

Thanks.

(I’ll try to get back here in a couple days.)

 

[Ajax]

Hey, @Ajax , since you know the Koine Greek language (and its lack of the indefinite articles), what is your take on John 1:1 And if I may ask, your view of how the Bible describes Satan?

John 1:1 refers to the Word (Λόγος}.
Λόγος originate from the verb λέγω, meaning I say/I speak and can mean 1) speech (oral or written) but also 2) fame, tradition 3) the matter spoken of, and other similar meanings.
As such, my personal view (as well as most scholars) is that it refers to the will of God which was expressed orally for the creation, also via prophets and via Jesus, hence "the Word became flesh, and dwelt among us". It is a very far fetched conclusion that it refers to Jesus, although it is convenient for those who want to present Jesus as God.

Satan is seen as an agent subservient to God, typically regarded as a metaphor for evil inclination who prosecutes the nation of Judah in the heavenly court and tests the loyalty of Yahweh's followers, Despite his supposed enmity to God, he is in good terms with Him, to the point that God made him ruler of this world !!!!
During the Deuterocanonical period (about 400 BC to 30 AD when no prophets appeared), and possibly due to influence from the Zoroastrian figure of Angra Mainyu, Satan was developed into a malevolent entity. He was also developed into a convenient excuse for believers to justify their wrongdoings (Satan made me do this..).

 

[Ajax]

@Ajax , keep in mind that organized schools back then, for Jews, were Rabbinic schools. Israelites, and later, the Jews, were not an illiterate people.

In talking about any Israelite striving to please Jehovah, the psalmist said: “But his delight is in the law of Jehovah, And in his law he reads in an undertone day and night.”

Also, consider what the Scriptures at Mark 1:19,20 say about the future apostles, James & John:

“And after going a little farther he [Jesus] saw James the [son] of Zebʹe·dee and John his brother, in fact, while they were in their boat mending their nets; 20 and without delay he called them. In turn they left their father Zebʹe·dee in the boat with the hired men and went off after him.”

They were running a business, complete with employees.
They weren’t ignorant.

Take care.

The vast majority of Biblical scholars would agree that the illiteracy rates in Jesus's world were somewhere around 98 percent.
98 percent of Jesus's fellow Jews could neither read nor write.
I didn't say they were ignorant business wise. But the Acts describe them as ignorant regarding reading and writing.
There can be brilliant businessmen despite being illiterate.

 

[walt]

Ephesians 2:8-9
8 For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— 9 not by works, so that no one can boast. New International Version

Obey Jesus’ instructions. (Hebrews 5:9) Those who “observe all the things” that Jesus commanded show by their life course that they are his followers. (Matthew 28:20) They become “doers of the word and not hearers only.”—James 1:22.

The Bible explains that salvation is a gift you cannot earn! And Jesus commands us “observe all the things” (Matthew 28:20). Jesus commanded the Apostles to teach this to all the nations --Matt. 28:19-20

Does one scripture cancel out the other scripture? Or do we include all of them to explain the way we believe?
If you love Me, keep My commands, --John 14:15 Literal Standard Version

a few seconds ago • Edit • Delete • Report

 

[Ajax]

Ephesians 2:8-9
8 For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— 9 not by works, so that no one can boast. New International Version

Obey Jesus’ instructions. (Hebrews 5:9) Those who “observe all the things” that Jesus commanded show by their life course that they are his followers. (Matthew 28:20) They become “doers of the word and not hearers only.”—James 1:22.

The Bible explains that salvation is a gift you cannot earn! And Jesus commands us “observe all the things” (Matthew 28:20). Jesus commanded the Apostles to teach this to all the nations --Matt. 28:19-20

Does one scripture cancel out the other scripture? Or do we include all of them to explain the way we believe?
If you love Me, keep My commands, --John 14:15 Literal Standard Version

a few seconds ago • Edit • Delete • Report

This is the sad parody of Christianity because what you quoted in Ephesians 2:8-9, fully contradicts Jesus instructions and teachings as well as other books of the Bible. And it's a shame that all these contradictions do not bother the vast majority of Christians.

Matthew 5:20 "For I say to you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the scribes and Pharisees, you will not enter the kingdom of heaven."
Matthew 7:21 “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven."
James 2 "So faith by itself, if it has no works, is dead......You see that a man is justified by works and not by faith alone."
Revelation 20:12-13 "And the dead were judged by what was written in the books, by what they had done. 13 And the sea gave up the dead in it, Death and Hades gave up the dead in them, and all were judged by what they had done."

Let alone that Paul claims that neither faith or works saves, because all believers are predestined by God before the world began.

 

[walt]

This is the sad parody of Christianity because what you quoted in Ephesians 2:8-9, fully contradicts Jesus instructions and teachings as well as other books of the Bible. And it's a shame that all these contradictions do not bother the vast majority of Christians.

Matthew 5:20 "For I say to you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the scribes and Pharisees, you will not enter the kingdom of heaven."
Matthew 7:21 “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven."
James 2 "So faith by itself, if it has no works, is dead......You see that a man is justified by works and not by faith alone."
Revelation 20:12-13 "And the dead were judged by what was written in the books, by what they had done. 13 And the sea gave up the dead in it, Death and Hades gave up the dead in them, and all were judged by what they had done."

Let alone that Paul claims that neither faith or works saves, because all believers are predestined by God before the world began.

I agree with every scripture you have quoted. I believe Jesus words and Paul's words are 100% Trustworthy! Jesus died for our sins so we can have salvation, this is something Jesus did! Nothing We do! Paul also says we must obey the Gospel of our Lord Jesus --2 Thessalonians 1:8-9

 

[walt]

In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace; --Ephesians 1:7 King James Bible

Why Did Jesus Die?

The Bible’s answer
Jesus died so that humans could have their sins forgiven and receive endless life. (Romans 6:23; Ephesians 1:7) Jesus’ death also proved that a human can remain loyal to God even when faced with the severest of tests.—Hebrews 4:15.

Consider how the death of one man could accomplish so much.

Jesus died for “the forgiveness of our sins.”—Colossians 1:14.

The first human, Adam, was created perfect, without sin. However, he chose to disobey God. Adam’s disobedience, or sin, profoundly affected all his descendants. “Through the disobedience of the one man,” the Bible explains, “many were made sinners.”—Romans 5:19.

Jesus was also perfect, but he never sinned. Therefore, he could be “an atoning sacrifice for our sins.” (1 John 2:2; footnote) Just as Adam’s disobedience contaminated the human family with sin, so Jesus’ death removed the stain of sin from all who exercise faith in him.

In a sense, Adam sold the human race into sin. Jesus, by willingly dying in our behalf, repurchased humankind as his own. As a result, “if anyone does commit a sin, we have a helper with the Father, Jesus Christ, a righteous one.”—1 John 2:1.

 

[Ajax]

I agree with every scripture you have quoted. I believe Jesus words and Paul's words are 100% Trustworthy! Jesus died for our sins so we can have salvation, this is something Jesus did! Nothing We do! Paul also says we must obey the Gospel of our Lord Jesus --2 Thessalonians 1:8-9

Doesn't Satan believe that Jesus is god? Yes he does.
Will his faith save him? No, because his works let him down....

 

[walt]

No, because his works let him down....

I agree with you here.

 

[Ajax]

I agree with you here.

And aren't the good, righteous people who never heard of Jesus, going to be saved? Of course they will.
So in my view, faith alone does not save. Paul was 100% wrong. He only wanted to bring as many people as possible to Christianity, not caring of what he wrote, hence his contradictions regarding salvation.
After all he admitted it himself, he became “all things to all people”.

 

[walt]

And aren't the good, righteous people who never heard of Jesus, going to be saved? Of course they will.
So in my view, faith alone does not save. Paul was 100% wrong. He only wanted to bring as many people as possible to Christianity, not caring of what he wrote, hence his contradictions regarding salvation.
After all he admitted it himself, he became “all things to all people”.

I believe all these words are important to know, The Bible explains that salvation is a free gift, faith or believing is necessary, and Jesus and the Apostle Paul both agree we must obey or observe all Jesus commands.

2 Timothy 3:15 and that from infancy you have known the holy writings, which are able to make you wise for salvation through faith in Christ Jesus.

Romans 6:23 For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

Ephesians 1:7 In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace; King James Bible

Hebrews 5:9 And after he had been made perfect, he became responsible for everlasting salvation to all those obeying him,
And 2 Thessalonians 1:8-9

Some say the Apostle Paul wrote all these scriptures, whether he did or did not, Why do they have to be considered a contradiction? Didn't Jesus say the same? John 3:16, Mark 13:13, Luke 21:19, Matthew 24:13, Matthew 28:20, John 5:28-29

 

[Ajax]

I believe all these words are important to know, The Bible explains that salvation is a free gift, faith or believing is necessary, and Jesus and the Apostle Paul both agree we must obey or observe all Jesus commands.

2 Timothy 3:15 and that from infancy you have known the holy writings, which are able to make you wise for salvation through faith in Christ Jesus.

Romans 6:23 For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

Ephesians 1:7 In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace; King James Bible

Hebrews 5:9 And after he had been made perfect, he became responsible for everlasting salvation to all those obeying him,
And 2 Thessalonians 1:8-9

Some say the Apostle Paul wrote all these scriptures, whether he did or did not, Why do they have to be considered a contradiction? Didn't Jesus say the same? John 3:16, Mark 13:13, Luke 21:19, Matthew 24:13, Matthew 28:20, John 5:28-29

The verse you quoted before does not say the same...

Ephesians 2:8-9
8 For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— 9 not by works, so that no one can boast. New International Version

In other words salvation is a gift of God, if you have faith only (sola fide); works are not needed.
This is contrary to the words of Jesus, James and Revelation, as I showed you in message #309

 

[walt]

The verse you quoted before does not say the same...

In other words salvation is a gift of God, if you have faith only (sola fide); works are not needed.
This is contrary to the words of Jesus, James and Revelation, as I showed you in message #309

1. Would you agree that the New Testament explains that salvation is a free gift, not by works.
2. The New Testament also explains the value of believing or putting faith in Jesus.
3. The scriptures that we both have mentioned, explain the lifesaving value of obedience to Jesus words.

Obey Jesus’ instructions. (Hebrews 5:9) Those who “observe all the things” that Jesus commanded show by their life course that they are his followers. (Matthew 28:20) They become “doers of the word and not hearers only.”—James 1:22.

The Bible explains that salvation is a gift - not by works, faith is needed, obedience and the value of becoming “doers of the word and not hearers only.”—James 1:22.

You have a perfect right to your viewpoint. My viewpoint includes all of the above, every single scripture in the New Testament is instructions for me to follow closely. I do not favor one scripture over another, each scripture is 100% accurate just like the next one.

Thank you for your kindness, I appreciate your words and knowledge it is obvious that you have studied the scriptures. Thanks again.

 

[Ajax]

Thank you for your kindness, I appreciate your words and knowledge it is obvious that you have studied the scriptures. Thanks again

Thank you too.

 

[walt]

I agree with Ajax the instructions in the Bible, are in conflict with each other, they do not agree at all.

Still even though they don't agree, each scripture is an instruction that is beneficial for us. Each scripture must be important somehow or it wouldn't be written down. Does anyone agree?

 

[RR144]

Is it God telling you what you shoukd and should not do, or is it modern people interpreting Charles Taze Russell interpreting a book written by people who you hope were inspired by God?

Did Russell ever claim to be inspired? If he did, do you have a reference?