What makes a Christian?

[Heyo]

LOL - you got me! What does that mean.

Sorry, shouldn't have assumed that those Initials are known to you.
WBC - Westboro Baptist Church
NIFB - New Independent Fundamentalist Baptist - Wikipedia

 

[Heyo]

Biblically speaking, any individual who trusts Jesus for salvation is forgiven of sin now and perfected from doing sin later, to enter Heaven, even skeptics at RF! Praise Jesus!

That sound pretty much like what @Kenny said in post #70.
So, you two agree upon that criterion?

 

[Windwalker]

If the person calls themselves a Christian, (in my previous discussion, a Hindu) then they are. Who am I (or you) to decide for another person how they want to label themselves religiously?

I would agree with this, with one exception. If a person identifies themselves as a Christian, meaning a follower of the teachings of Jesus, and behaves in such a way as to display they act completely contrary to those teachings, such as calling themselves a Christian as they beat unbelievers to death with an iron cross in their hands, then I'd feel comfortable saying they aren't actually Christians.

Just because someone puts a cross on the flag they fly, doesn't make them an actual disciple. Jesus himself taught this in saying, "By their fruits you shall know them". Anyone can say anything about themselves they want, but if their actions don't follow, then I'd not take them at their word. I'd say that exact same thing applies to anyone in any religion claiming to follow its teachings, yet not even trying.

 

[Vinayaka]

I would agree with this, with one exception. If a person identifies themselves as a Christian, meaning a follower of the teachings of Jesus, and behaves in such a way as to display they act completely contrary to those teachings, such as calling themselves a Christian as they beat unbelievers to death with an iron cross in their hands, then I'd feel comfortable saying they aren't actually Christians.

Just because someone puts a cross on the flag they fly, doesn't make them an actual disciple. Jesus himself taught this in saying, "By their fruits you shall know them". Anyone can say anything about themselves they want, but if their actions don't follow, then I'd not take them at their word. I'd say that exact same thing applies to anyone in any religion claiming to follow its teachings, yet not even trying.

For me, that opens a slippery slope, so I'd still leave it up to them. It is exactly this that (actions don't follow) that has everyone claiming others aren't 'real'. At the same time, I leave it up to others to use their own sense of what is or what isn't. I'm fine with a racist bigot telling me I can't be a Hindu. No sense arguing with him.

 

[ChristineM]

I have noticed that most Christians are often adept at gaslighting non-Christians or even other Christians in their fervent attempts to defend Christianity. In fact, I've met some who immediately dismissed my negative experiences when I was a Christian, accusing me of exaggerating, imagining things, or not remembering things correctly. They tried to manipulate me into doubting my own memories and tried to make me feel guilty for sharing my experiences with others. I've been gaslighted on RF, but not just from a Christian.

I've been there too, today is an example

 

[Kenny]

That sound pretty much like what @Kenny said in post #70.
So, you two agree upon that criterion?

I think it is a good criteria. I'm thankful that I'm not the final determinate.

To make it simpler:


Biblically speaking, any individual who trusts Jesus for salvation is forgiven of sin

 

[Kenny]

Sorry, shouldn't have assumed that those Initials are known to you.
WBC - Westboro Baptist Church
NIFB - New Independent Fundamentalist Baptist - Wikipedia

Thanks.

Westboro... IMV... dedicated people but baaaaaaaad leader. Did that sound like a goat? God will talk to him at some point.

NIFB... Yes, part of the body with a very definitive set of beliefs. (Don't know too much about them) - so just a quicky position.)

 

[Heyo]

Thanks.

Westboro... IMV... dedicated people but baaaaaaaad leader. Did that sound like a goat? God will talk to him at some point.

NIFB... Yes, part of the body with a very definitive set of beliefs. (Don't know too much about them) - so just a quicky position.)

Both groups are defined by their hate of homosexuals and therefore listed as hate groups by the Southern Poverty Law Centre. If I were a Christian I wouldn't want to be in the same group as them. But I'm not so I leave it to the Christians to deal with them (and they don't, so it seems to me they are OK with them).

 

[Kenny]

Both groups are defined by their hate of homosexuals and therefore listed as hate groups by the Southern Poverty Law Centre. If I were a Christian I wouldn't want to be in the same group as them. But I'm not so I leave it to the Christians to deal with them (and they don't, so it seems to me they are OK with them).

It is possible.... but I don't use the Southern Poverty Law Centre as a source of truth... in some circles they are listed as a hate group against Christians.

I can't vouch for that Baptist group since I don't know about them. Anti-homosexuality too often is presented as hate homosexuals and, more often than not, is in error.

 

[Ella S.]

It's not my intent to stir the pot, but I have to question whether Wikipedia is a reliable source or not. I've used Wikipedia as a source in the past and have been told by several people that it isn't a reliable source. What do you think? My college-aged children told me that they weren't allowed to use Wiki as a source when they wrote a paper. They were told that it wasn't considered a reliable source.

Wikipedia is an aggregate of sources, making it a tertiary source. It's about as reliable as any other encyclopedia, except for on highly controversial topics and biographies which lead to long edit wars from various interested parties.

Tertiary sources aren't really sources. Secondary sources are preferred, while primary sources are ideal. Wikipedia can be used to find secondary and primary sources, however, since they are cited by the articles. You will want to check these sources yourself because these citations are not always accurate.

So Wikipedia isn't a reliable source but that doesn't mean it's useless or that it should be discounted as a reference entirely.

 

[Vee]

What are, in your opinion, the defining characteristics of a Christian?

By definition a Christian is a follower of Christ. In Matthew 16:24 Jesus invited his disciples to be his followers by saying " “If anyone wants to come after me, let him disown himself and pick up his torture stake and keep following me."
Christians view the Bible as the inspired Word of God and they know that a mere confession of faith is not enough. Christians have to behave according to their belief.

 

[Heyo]

By definition a Christian is a follower of Christ. In Matthew 16:24 Jesus invited his disciples to be his followers by saying " “If anyone wants to come after me, let him disown himself and pick up his torture stake and keep following me."
Christians view the Bible as the inspired Word of God and they know that a mere confession of faith is not enough. Christians have to behave according to their belief.

Thank you for your contribution. Glad to have another Christian put their criteria up for debate. Though I fear your exclusive criteria will not get much acclaim by the other Christians as it would make Christianity into a fringe religion comparable to Jedi and Pastafarians in numbers.

 

[Wildswanderer]

Oh, so that absolves us from doing good? So, now I can go out and rob banks as long as someone else does good? What kind of "Christianity" is that???

Diversion. That's not what I said.

 

[Wildswanderer]

A lot of words but you still missed the point in your previous post, as the Goats were condemned because they disobeyed Jesus' command to help others in need.

OTOH, an implication of what you had said is what I call "rocking-chair religion", namely just sit back and have nice p.c. thoughts.

Nope, you didn't read my post.

 

[Ponder This]

What are, in your opinion, the defining characteristics of a Christian?

There are 41,000+ denominations in Christianity. That fact alone shows that there have to be a lot of differences between them. But are there still communalities left? Has the claim to be a Christian any value any more?
Being an atheist answers exactly one question and nothing more. Does being a Christian tell me more?

Anyone can call himself a Christian.

The question is: To what does a person refer?

A person may refer to cultural upbringing.
A person may refer to attendance at Church.
A person may refer to belief in Christ.
A person may refer to spiritual knowledge.

There are many ways to use the word "Christian" and every reference is implied. IMO, the spiritual understanding is the most defining characteristic. YMMV

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Do I understand you correctly that you argue, unlike most other Christians here, against inclusivity? You would exclude many denominations who don't adhere to your interpretation of the Bible from Christianity?

Any denomination that is out of harmony with Jesus' teachings as presented in the Bible
Any denomination that uses church tradition, church customs as being taught as being Scripture when Not Scripture.
So, any teaching should be compared lined up against what Jesus teaches.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

An example of christians being accused of cannibalism.....................

I heard it said that in the OT we read of cannibalism at -> 2 kings 8:1

 

[Heyo]

Any denomination that is out of harmony with Jesus' teachings as presented in the Bible
Any denomination that uses church tradition, church customs as being taught as being Scripture when Not Scripture.
So, any teaching should be compared lined up against what Jesus teaches.

So, you agree with @Vee and are on the "splitter" side of the debate. I'm looking forward to you trying to convince @Kenny and @BilliardsBall.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Here it is for culture in Denmark. Because we are state protestants, then over time the love thy neighbor as yourself, it became a part of the state and government without the same religious culture that you are a part.
So the odd thing is than as absurd as it is, we Danes are by culture Christian, yet also not standard religious by your standard. How? Well, love thy neighbor as yourself is both the responsibility of me as an individual and the state/government.

And I find the standard responsibility of genuine Christians is found in Jesus' New commandment - John 13:34-35
Jesus' followers would have the same self-sacrificing love for others as Jesus has.
In other words, his followers would now love neighbor MORE than self, more than the Golden Rule - Leviticus 19:18

 

[URAVIP2ME]

So, you agree with @Vee and are on the "splitter" side of the debate. I'm looking forward to you trying to convince @Kenny and @BilliardsBall.

Well, I think we need to keep in mind as one historian concluded that out of all the people Jesus came in contact that only 1% became a follower.
Remember: the good news gospel message is a 'witness' to the nations and Not a conversion of them - Matthew 24:14
Seems to me most do Not accept the gospel good news message to be an attractive message about: Earth.
That Jesus is to come and undo all the damage Satan and Adam brought upon us, upon humanity.
Satan and Adam brought sin with sickness and death to mankind, to Earth.
No sin, no sickness nor death in Heaven but are earthly problems.
So, by everyone being invited to pray to God for Jesus to come is to come and end sin, sickness and death on Earth.
ALL the resurrections Jesus preformed were happy-and-healthy physical resurrections restoring to life on Earth.
Jesus was giving us a preview, a coming attraction on a small scale what he will be doing on a Grand Global Scale.
Thus, what makes a Christian is Not only that some resurrected ones will be in Heaven with Jesus but the belief that the majority of people can be resurrected to live forever on Earth as originally offered to Adam before his downfall.