When Vivekananda perfomed Kumari Puja on a Muslim girl worshipping her as the Divine Mother...

[Aupmanyav]

Atheism is definitely not the norm in traditional Hinduism.

If that is so, then theistic hindus obviously does not have to follow your views as well in worshipping Shirdi sai or sufi sages.

Poor understanding of advaita as usual.
'No second' does not mean God, but no identification with any impermanent phenomena leading to likes and dislikes, cravings and aversions, with the incessant thinking and emoting process that blurs the Self or Awareness.

The Hindu forums have quality scholars who are capable of quality criticism as well.

The focus here is on the atrocities and human rights violations that the scheduled castes and tribes of India has been subjected to in BJP ruled states, and not reservations.

1. Agree with that. Atheism is not the norm in Hinduism.
2. Can that ever be done? Am I the dictator of India or should I be? Even dictators cannot control the way people think. Did not the Christians go underground in Rome?
3. To clarify say 'according to my view'.
4. To you they are quality scholars, to me they are 'coopa-mandukas' and superstitious. There is no evidence for existence of God/Gods/Goddesses.
5. The atrocities existed even before the BJP rule. What was happening in Uttar Pradesh during the Samajvadi Party rule? Or in Haryana during the Jat rule? Only BJP can end this. Surely, your view may differ.

 

[ajay0]

3. To clarify say 'according to my view'.

You can adopt this, as it is usually your views that deviate from Hinduism.

4. To you they are quality scholars, to me they are 'coopa-mandukas' and superstitious. There is no evidence for existence of God/Gods/Goddesses.

Then why come to the Hinduism forums in the first place !

Also it was your wrong understanding of Advaita that invited criticism in your direction, not discussion of gods and goddesses.

5. The atrocities existed even before the BJP rule. What was happening in Uttar Pradesh during the Samajvadi Party rule? Or in Haryana during the Jat rule? Only BJP can end this. Surely, your view may differ.

The atrocities existed but not to this extent as in the BJP rule, which is why this has been highlighted.

Atrocities against women have also risen in the bjp ruled states as shown by the Kathua and Unnao criminal incidents which involved hindu politicians and a BJP MLA .

 

[Aupmanyav]

You can adopt this, as it is usually your views that deviate from Hinduism.
Then why come to the Hinduism forums in the first place ! Also it was your wrong understanding of Advaita that invited criticism in your direction, not discussion of gods and goddesses.
The atrocities existed but not to this extent as in the BJP rule, which is why this has been highlighted.
Atrocities against women have also risen in the BJP ruled states as shown by the Kathua and Unnao criminal incidents which involved hindu politicians and a BJP MLA .

- Say "deviate from your view of Hinduism". Hinduism is an ocean in which many rivers merge.
- Because I am a Hindu. If the restricted procedure at some place does not suit me, I leave. It is foolish to insist in 21st century that your communication must always begin with a 'namaste'. Again, understanding of something in a particular way depends on the person. Hinduism is not Christianity or Islam that it has to be understood in just one way. Each Hindu has his own variations of belief. For that matter, not even Christianity and Islam are understood in one way, and you expect a Hindu to ditto what you say? Preposterous.
- Who knows if the enemies of BJP are involved in these atrocities (note - they would not stop to adopt any strategy, even breaking Hinduism - Lingayats). At the moment, the opposition parties are making an all-out and unprincipled effort to stop BJP. They even wanted the Supreme Court Chief Justice to be impeached.

So cool down with your view of Hinduism. I am not obliged to follow you. I go by what I think is correct.

 

[ajay0]

- Say "deviate from your view of Hinduism". Hinduism is an ocean in which many rivers merge.

Ravana , Duryodhana and Kamsa too have their views but if people adopt that it would cease to be Hinduism.

- Because I am a Hindu. If the restricted procedure at some place does not suit me, I leave. It is foolish to insist in 21st century that your communication must always begin with a 'namaste'.

The issue from what I understand is that your understanding of advaita invited criticism. The other factors such as Namaste are superficial.

Again, understanding of something in a particular way depends on the person. Hinduism is not Christianity or Islam that it has to be understood in just one way. Each Hindu has his own variations of belief. For that matter, not even Christianity and Islam are understood in one way, and you expect a Hindu to ditto what you say? Preposterous.

As I said, Ravana, Duryodhana, Kamsa and Asaram Bapu all had their own viewpoints as well, but we obviously cannot accomodate all their viewpoints as hinduism.

- Who knows if the enemies of BJP are involved in these atrocities (note - they would not stop to adopt any strategy, even breaking Hinduism - Lingayats). At the moment, the opposition parties are making an all-out and unprincipled effort to stop BJP. They even wanted the Supreme Court Chief Justice to be impeached

The bjp mla's participation in the criminal episode in Unnao is quite confirmed as the girl's father's named his attackers before his death.


Days Before Death, Unnao Teen's Father Named Attacker, Shows Video

Unnao rape case - Wikipedia

So cool down with your view of Hinduism. I am not obliged to follow you. I go by what I think is correct.

As stated earlier, Ravana, Duryodhana, Kamsa also went by what they thought is correct .

 

[Aupmanyav]

Well, Ravana was Jaya of Lord Vishnu's Vaikuntha, he had Vishnu-rupa in Vaikuntha. Ravana was the knower of four Vedas and Six darshanas. Even today we sing his Tandava Stotram with delight. He was against Lord Rama for the sole reason that he wanted to return to Vaikuntha as early as possible, with just three incarnations instead of seven. Duryodhana too was an upright king, the only one who accepted Karna when everyone ostracized Karna. Kamsa too was a nice person loving his sister Devaki dearly before Mata Sarswati changed his 'buddhi'. There are no purely evil or purely pious people in Hindu mythology other than the Gods. Even the Gods falter some of the time. Whether Ravana, Duryodhana or Kamsa, they were not 'satans' in Abrahamic sense. Ajay, you know all this yourself, so why mispost?

Here are Ravana and Kumbhakarna before the curse by Sanatkumaras.

 

[Aupmanyav]

If the currently BJP MLA is involved in the rape, then law will take care of it. Sengar is an "Ayaram, gayaram", his roots are not in BJP. "The MLA is not some committed party member - Sengar only joined the BJP before the 2017 state election after defecting from the Samajwadi Party (SP). In fact, he was elected on a Bahujan Samaj Party (BSP) ticket in 2002, an SP ticket in 2007 and 2012, and the BJP ticket in 2017 (The importance of Kuldeep Sengar and BJP’s social engineering strategy in Uttar Pradesh). It is the caste politics of BSP and SP which makes BJP accept such persons. But be sure, the Supreme Court will not allow Sengar to escape.

 

[atanu]

@ajay0 , long time back on advice of a mod I put someone on ignore list. It is better that way.

 

[ajay0]

Well, Ravana was Jaya of Lord Vishnu's Vaikuntha, he had Vishnu-rupa in Vaikuntha. He was the knower of four Vedas and Six darshanas. Even today we sing his Tandava Stotram with delight. He was against Lord Rama for the sole reason that he wanted to return to Vaikuntha as early as possible, with just three incarnations instead of seven. Duryodhana too was an upright king, the only one who accepted Karna when everyone ostracized Karna. Kamsa too was a nice person loving his sister Devaki dearly before Mata Sarswati changed his 'buddhi'. There are no purely evil or purely pious people in Hindu mythology other than the Gods. Even the Gods falter some of the time. Whether Ravana, Duryodhana or Kamsa, they were not 'satans' in Abrahamic sense. Ajay, you know all this yourself, so why mispost?


Here are Ravana and Kumbhakarna before the curse by Sanatkumaras.

So why not change Ramayan to Ravanayan ! Or worship Kumbhakarna instead of Rama . Similarly worship Kamsa and Dusshasana instead of Krishna.

 

[Aupmanyav]

As regards my view of Advaita, I find it in Vedas, Upanishads and BhagawdGita. You have no idea of 'Advaita'. You are 'Dvaitists' as you accept the existence of a God apart from yourself. 'Tat twam asi" said Chandogya. What God?

"Vidyam chavidyam cha yah tad vedobhayam saha; avidyaya mrityum tirtva vidyayamritam ashnute.
Andham tamah pravishanti ye 'sambhutim upasate; tato bhuya iva te tamo ya u sambhutyam rataha."

 

[Aupmanyav]

Kumbhakarna was a nice person. He warned Ravana against what Ravana was doing. But Ravana was in a hurry to return to Vaikuntha. Kumbhakarna was like Bhishma, knowing what is correct and what is wrong, but bound by duty to his elder brother. In that way he was better than Vibhishana who defected to the enemy.

Haha, Atanu, you still have me on ignore? I did not know.
No need to put me on ignore. Vinayaka does not do that. I am just one (Orthodox, Atheist, Advaitist) Hindu, and you should allow me to have my own view. I am not asking anyone to follow me. I know that I am a miniscule part of Hinduism. No need to get a fixation on me. I am not going to change my views ever.

 

[ajay0]

As regards my view of Advaita, I find it in Vedas, Upanishads and BhagawdGita. You have no idea of 'Advaita'. You are 'Dvaitists' as you accept the existence of a God apart from yourself. 'Tat twam asi" said Chandogya. What God?

"Vidyam chavidyam cha yah tad vedobhayam saha; avidyaya mrityum tirtva vidyayamritam ashnute.
Andham tamah pravishanti ye 'sambhutim upasate; tato bhuya iva te tamo ya u sambhutyam rataha."

All flawed arguments !

Nirguna Brahman is considered as impersonal God in Hinduism.

If you have no idea what advaita or brahman is, you can stop talking about it and thereby spare yourself the embarrasment of criticism from here and there. Why do you wish to keep on advertising your flawed pov inspite of constant and continuous criticism in forums and making yourself an object of mockery and jest!

Imo, you can stick to your domain of information and insights on Hindu mythology and temple rituals, even though you are a self-proclaimed atheist. You can be useful there.

 

[Aupmanyav]

I said I would not change my views and I am none other than Brahman because there is no second. It is 'dvaita' and 'avidya' which makes you think so. Your unscholarly criticism does not affect me. Get on to something else.

 

[ajay0]

I said I would not change my views and I am none other than Brahman because there is no second. It is 'dvaita' and 'avidya' which makes you think so. Your unscholarly criticism does not affect me. Get on to something else.

You have no idea of advaita and brahman, which is quite clear from the content of your posts, and then you accuse me of 'dvaita' and 'avidya'. That is laughable.

You even had the nerve to accuse me of being ignorant in failing to recognize your 'enlightened state' in the vedanta forums. Imo, you are suffering from megalomania and delusion probably stemming from senility or mental illhealth.

The sooner you recognize this, the lesser you will be subjected to criticism in this and other forums.

 

[Aupmanyav]

Ajay, such personal accusation is against the forum rules and shows your frustration. I have found my answers and I am satisfied with that. Is there anything wrong with that? You are the only one who is criticizing me in the forum. It shows that you are the only one foolish enough to do that. Terese is Vaishnava, Devi Chaya is a Shakta and so on. People here in the Hindu forum have various views. I never criticize their views - on the contrary try to strengthen what they write about their views. It is by helping each other, we can make Hinduism strong and not by criticizing if our views are different.

 

[ajay0]

Ajay, such personal accusation is against the forum rules and shows your frustration.

But you have also accused me of 'unscholarly' and 'ignorance' which is personal accusation in itself.

I have found my answers and I am satisfied with that. Is there anything wrong with that? You are the only one who is criticizing me in the forum. It shows that you are the only one foolish enough to do that. Terese is Vaishnava, Devi Chaya is a Shakta and so on. People here in the Hindu forum have various views. I never criticize their views - on the contrary try to strengthen what they write about their views. It is by helping each other, we can make Hinduism strong and not by criticizing if our views are different.

Well, for starters you can stop criticizing my pov, and hindu thestic worshippers of Shirdi Sai in this thread, and thereby helping me, make Hinduism strong.

 

[Aupmanyav]

Why should I leave you that cheaply? You too have pestered me for a long time. Is this person a God? Which scripture mentions him? Why should a Hindu worship him? Are you a Hindu? Heretics like you make Hinduism weaker.

 

[Shantanu]

You have no idea of 'Advaita'. You are 'Dvaitists' as you accept the existence of a God apart from yourself. 'Tat twam asi" said Chandogya. What God?

When you yourself are all the God you need because you are at one with that God, that is advaita not dvaita.

 

[atanu]

Ajay, such personal accusation is against the forum rules and shows your frustration. I have found my answers and I am satisfied with that. Is there anything wrong with that? You are the only one who is criticizing me in the forum. It shows that you are the only one foolish enough to do that. Terese is Vaishnava, Devi Chaya is a Shakta and so on. People here in the Hindu forum have various views. I never criticize their views - on the contrary try to strengthen what they write about their views. It is by helping each other, we can make Hinduism strong and not by criticizing if our views are different.

No. Many people have pointed out that in name of being an Advaitin, you are following your own agenda. You are not truthful.

It has been many times pointed out that you wilfully misrepresent advaita.

 

[atanu]

I said I would not change my views and I am none other than Brahman because there is no second. It is 'dvaita' and 'avidya' which makes you think so. Your unscholarly criticism does not affect me. Get on to something else.

Hah. There is no second to this guy. But he sees ignorant people all around him.

 

[Aupmanyav]

Hah. There is no second to this guy. But he sees ignorant people all around him.

That is not correct. There are many people in the forum who understand this. Vinayaka, Sayak, Jai are some such people. Terese, Satyam and Devi Chaya are calmly content with their own views and I am happy about that. I have named just a few, there are others as well. Now you tell me, how can I accept the existence of God when my books say that there is no other? Even the Nirguna Brhman cannot be termed as a God, because it is not into change, it is not into creation. It is not neither into birth nor into death. It has no guna at all. It does not require any worship and will not give you anything extra if you do it. It is 'supremely neutral' to all things in the world, that is why it is 'nirguna'. Only an ignorant person will worship 'Nirguna Brahman'. To accept a God will make me a 'dvaitist' which I am not. The books say you too are Brahman, not just me. The books say all things here are Brahman. Only you do not realize it. If you are theist and a 'Dvaitist', then I have no problem with that. That is a different view, part of Hinduism, which I will always accept. But one cnnot be an 'advaitist' and at the same time accept the existence of God. That will be contradiction. Kindly tell me, where do I go wrong?

No. Many people have pointed out that in name of being an Advaitin, you are following your own agenda. You are not truthful. It has been many times pointed out that you wilfully misrepresent advaita.

Tell me in what way I am not truthful and how one who claims to be an 'advaitist', can accept the existence of God? (For the reasons that I have described in the post above). Don't just abuse me, argue, give your reasons and the proof thereof.