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Ingledsva

HEATHEN ALASKAN
The Bible is full of real named people, real named places.
There is a lot of religious-myth teachings about the Bible being taught as Scripture, but that does Not make the Bible as wrong but makes the wrong teachings as wrong.
How could a book of human imagination written over 1,500 years have the internal harmony among its many writers as the Bible has.
The Bible has many enemies from within besides without. No one, No ban, has been able to get rid of the Bible nor Bible people who are throughout the earth.
Just as it is written 'the good news of God's kingdom' has reached the vast international scale as recorded at Matthew 24:14; Acts of the Apostles 1:8
The Bible's internal harmony is shown when the Bible is studied by topic or subject arrangement taking one subject or topic at a time to see what the various writers had to say.
The Bible has many corresponding or parallel cross-reference verses and passages unlike any other book.

Sure, if you can show me where the Bible is wrong then you will separate me from my beliefs.
Isn't there harmony between John 11:11-14; Psalms 6:5; Psalms 13:3; Psalms 115:17; Psalms 146:4; Daniel 12:2; Daniel 12:13; Job 14:13-15; Ecclesiastes 9:5

You are forgetting that the stories of Tanakh were first passed by mouth, and much later written down. Such often change over time, and that allows for much "in harmony."

Same with the NT. The stories were written - supposedly from memory," after Jesus died. Those writers appear to have tried to make him match Tanakh Messiah texts, and even added in misinformation-mistranslation in that effort.

There is no way to know what is true and what isn't. But the man-God, trinity stuff looks added in to me. Especially as we don't even have later texts saying that Jesus said - he was a God, or part of any trinity.

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URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
You are forgetting that the stories of Tanakh were first passed by mouth, and much later written down. Such often change over time, and that allows for much "in harmony."
Same with the NT. The stories were written - supposedly from memory," after Jesus died. Those writers appear to have tried to make him match Tanakh Messiah texts, and even added in misinformation-mistranslation in that effort.
There is no way to know what is true and what isn't. But the man-God, trinity stuff looks added in to me. Especially as we don't even have later texts saying that Jesus said - he was a God, or part of any trinity.
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Yes, the man-God trinity stuff was added on.
Only God was before the beginning - Psalms 90:2
Whereas Jesus was the beginning of the creation by God - Revelation 1:5; Revelation 3:14 B
So, only God was ' before ' the beginning. Jesus was Not ' before ' the beginning as God was ' before ' the beginning.
Jesus only claimed to be the Son of God - John 10:36 - and Not greater than his God - John 10:29; John 14:28; Revelation 3:12

We can trace mankind's religious family tree with its trinity-triad god concept all the way back to Noah's great grandson Nimrod - Genesis 10:8-10
As the people migrated out of ancient Babylon they took with them their Babylonian religious concepts and practices and spread them world wide into a greater religious Babylon or Babylon the Great. That is why we see so many similar and overlapping religious-myth ideas spread throughout the earth today. ( many ideas being taught as Scripture but Not what the Bible really teaches )
 

Kelly of the Phoenix

Well-Known Member
From my reading and understanding, this oneness with God is the only thing which can truly meet the innermost need of a person and give someone significance and peace now and forever, because again, that is the sole purpose for human creation... to be eternally included within the Love of God.
The biblical message also shows that sin harms and breaks this relationship. Satan, the initiator of sin, who hates God and humanity seems intent on doing all he can, using any method he can to prevent, disrupt, or destroy such relationships of love and unity between created and Creator.
I concur, but I find that it is usually Christians who tell all of us (current, former, whatever Christians) that we are separated from God. I believe that being connected to the divine, to God, is the default position and a person's mental or spiritual issues are what makes it seem like separation. You know, that "footsteps" poem and such talk. Many Christians say that God will not even be in the same room as sinners (ignoring how Jesus interacted with people and that God had no problem dealing with sinners before). They add to such offensive talk the hypocritical and arrogant position they will decidedly get to be in His presence. Actually, there are many who will claim the VIP seats at the banquet and be told to go to the cheap seats. It won't be unbelievers, who aren't even expecting an invitation, who will be the problem. It is the believers who assume they will be getting all the goody bags at the party who are the problem.

If God chose unlimited power or knowledge to know all our choices, then the Adam and Eve scenario would Not have taken place.
Why would God wait until A&E were dead to pass judgement on them unless He chose Not to interfere with their free-will choices.
Having no ability to know is one thing. Choosing not to know is negligence.

We are nearing a soon coming ' time of separation ' to take place on earth
This proves my point that I don't think it is Satan promoting ideas of separation.

There are two (2) eternal options mentioned at 2 Peter 3:9 -> Repent or ' perish ' ( be destroyed )

According to Scripture: Satan will be ' separated ' because Satan will be destroyed - Hebrews 2:14 B
Jesus: Pete, if you are wronged, forgive that dude a whole lotta times.
Random disciple: Uh, when is God forgiving Satan?
Jesus: You have to repent. Satan doesn't.
Random disciple: Did the guy who wronged Pete a whole lotta times repent all those times? Even once? Is grace not freely given?
Jesus: God loves all His lost sheep.
Random disciple: Prove He loves the first of the lost, and I will know He can love the rest of us.

The scriptures are clear that Jesus died for the sins of the world...
And He Himself is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the whole world. 1 John 2:2
I find John (both of them) to be heretics, unwilling or unable to match the tone of the rest of the bible. What the scriptures all agree on is the crucifixion. What meaning there is to be derived outside of the obvious (angry Romans with capital punishment capabilities) is up to us. Returning to life would negate the payment of our sins if death paid for them, yes? Sacrifices are supposed to stay dead. That's how sacrifices work.

Fortunately, I am not hamstrung by an addiction to scriptural sources and so my options are considerably different from what you see available. I'll be going wherever my interests take me and have a great time doing so. I'll pop back ever few millenniums to see if you have grown bored with your choices.
Been debating what to do after I'm dead, but since I have eternity, I guess I can do everything on my "post-bucket list". :)

I suppose you are including the Bible in your list of deary little books. I can't imagine that anyone who has really read the biblical scriptures seeking insight for God would ever consider it as deary.
The bible has lots of cool stories, but some of it, especially The Tale of the Endless Frickin' Legalese, is nap-worthy.

How does one explain that there are evils in abundance today which could Not be put down to a mere consequence of human sin ?
There are evils because there are finite resources and when those dwindle, people get irritable, especially if it's proven the haves are taking from the have-nots.

In my part of the world ' hackers ' are stealing people's ID's and it has created for them an on-going problem.
Technology gave us atomic energy but also the atomic bomb.
Peace talks have Not stopped more weapons from being produced every day, and which include terrorists-type weapons being used.
Where I have worked, and I now hear about on-going stealing at work places. At one drug store it took two years to finally have enough evidence to press charges.
Humans are the equivalent of teenagers: more power than sense.

There's a reason the earth will be inherited by the meek: all the childish people acting like they took Daddy's gun will take themselves out and all the rest of the mature people have to do is wait them out.
 

Ingledsva

HEATHEN ALASKAN
Yes, the man-God trinity stuff was added on.
Only God was before the beginning - Psalms 90:2
Whereas Jesus was the beginning of the creation by God - Revelation 1:5; Revelation 3:14 B
So, only God was ' before ' the beginning. Jesus was Not ' before ' the beginning as God was ' before ' the beginning.

Rev 1:5 says he is the FIRST TO RISE.

Rev 3:14 is being misunderstood. The Messiah is the cornerstone - the awaited one. - He brings the prophesied end, and the kingdom.

Rev 3:14 And unto the angel (messenger/pastor) of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness/martyr, the beginning (cornerstone) of the creation (framework) of God;

Jesus only claimed to be the Son of God - John 10:36 - and Not greater than his God - John 10:29; John 14:28; Revelation 3:12

That is what I said. He never claims to be God. He is a Son of God, just as King David was.

We can trace mankind's religious family tree with its trinity-triad god concept all the way back to Noah's great grandson Nimrod - Genesis 10:8-10
As the people migrated out of ancient Babylon they took with them their Babylonian religious concepts and practices and spread them world wide into a greater religious Babylon or Babylon the Great. That is why we see so many similar and overlapping religious-myth ideas spread throughout the earth today. ( many ideas being taught as Scripture but Not what the Bible really teaches )

That is not likely, - as the "verbal stories" were written down much-much-much later, and there is no proof of authenticity.

But obviously we have a mixing of myth.


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InChrist

Free4ever
I concur, but I find that it is usually Christians who tell all of us (current, former, whatever Christians) that we are separated from God. I believe that being connected to the divine, to God, is the default position and a person's mental or spiritual issues are what makes it seem like separation. You know, that "footsteps" poem and such talk. Many Christians say that God will not even be in the same room as sinners (ignoring how Jesus interacted with people and that God had no problem dealing with sinners before). They add to such offensive talk the hypocritical and arrogant position they will decidedly get to be in His presence. Actually, there are many who will claim the VIP seats at the banquet and be told to go to the cheap seats. It won't be unbelievers, who aren't even expecting an invitation, who will be the problem. It is the believers who assume they will be getting all the goody bags at the party who are the problem.

I appreciate your thoughts and agree with a lot of what you have written concerning hypocrisy among who claim to be Christians. You are correct and it's certainly true that Jesus had no problem interacting with sinners. Actually, according to the scriptures His life and mission was and is about calling sinners to repentance...And when the Pharisees saw it, they said to His disciples, “Why does your Teacher eat with tax collectors and sinners?”When Jesus heard that, He said to them, “Those who are well have no need of a physician, but those who are sick. But go and learn what this means: ‘I desire mercy and not sacrifice. For I did not come to call the righteous, but sinners, to repentance.” Matthew 9:11-13
The scriptures are also just as clear that sin does separate us from God and that everyone (Romans 3:23) is a sinner in need of repentance and the healing that is offered through Jesus the Physician and Savior.
 

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
Rev 1:5 says he is the FIRST TO RISE.
Rev 3:14 is being misunderstood. The Messiah is the cornerstone - the awaited one. - He brings the prophesied end, and the kingdom.
Rev 3:14
And unto the angel (messenger/pastor) of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness/martyr, the beginning (cornerstone) of the creation (framework) of God;
That is what I said. He never claims to be God. He is a Son of God, just as King David was.
That is not likely, - as the "verbal stories" were written down much-much-much later, and there is no proof of authenticity.
But obviously we have a mixing of myth.

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Thanks for your reply.
Yes, Jesus was the first to rise - John 3:13 - and Revelation 1:5 besides 1 Corinthians 15:20
I should have been more clear about the connection I was trying to make.
At Revelation 1:5 Jesus is the: faithful witness.
At Revelation 3:14 B Jesus is the: faithful and true witness.
Yes, Messiah is the cornerstone who brings the end of all badness on earth, and is King of God's Kingdom as Jesus proves to be.
Long before God sent the pre-human Jesus to earth, Jesus was the ' beginning of the creation by God ' - Revelation 3:14 B
So, Not only was Jesus the first to rise - Hebrews 9:24 - but the pre-human heavenly Jesus had a start or a beginning in the heavens - Revelation 3:14 B

Yes, Scripture agrees with your conclusion that Jesus never claims to be God.
David was ' son ' but Jesus was ' Son '. David had No pre-human existence. David was never called God's only-begotten Son as Jesus is.
Jesus sits upon David's throne - Isaiah 9:7 - So, where then will David sit ?
Ezekiel 34:24 places David as a Prince. Jesus reigns: as King, and David then: as Prince on earth - Isaiah 32:1; Psalms 45:16
That is Not a demotion, but the only ' King of Kings ' will be Jesus - Revelation 19:14-16
 
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