Certainly hateful alleged Christians, totally disregarding what they say they believe say and do spiteful things regarding homosexuals. They are a minority, but those who have a particular agenda make every effort to portray them as a majority, and as representing actual Christian teaching on the matter. In the political world it is called propaganda. If those alleged Christians had kept their mouths shut, or actually learned and followed the behavior required of a Christian, the propagandists would have no fodder to fire, they would be reduced to telling absolute lies. So yes, those wearing the mantle of Christian are partially responsible for the negative views of the faith on this matter.
You seem to be trying to distance the homophobic element from the church and depict it as a small, anomalous, faction. You also think that those who notice them and the harm that they do to the homosexual community is some kind of propaganda campaign designed to tarnish and mischaracterize the church's role.
Like atheists, homosexuals are a marginalized and demonized demographic slowly fighting to gain social parity in a culture that largely disapproves of both. Where do you suppose the impetus to depict both groups as immoral, undesirable, untrustworthy, and second-class citizens comes from? Is it the NFL? Are they the ones judging these scapegoated groups? How about Domino's Pizza? Maybe it's Amazon.com, or the Rotary Club, or the Red Cross, or the banking industry.
Atheophobia and homophobia are prominent aspects of American culture and have been for some time, not a recent hiccup caused by a handful of outliers getting a disproportionate amount press.
- "No, I don't know that atheists should be considered as citizens, nor should they be considered as patriots. This is one nation under God."- American President George H. W. Bush
Also, to an outsider, the church is defined by what it says and does, not what scripture says, which can be used to defend either side of many if not most moral positions. Pointing to the words of Jesus doesn't change what the church is or the public face it presents. Among other things, it's a propagandist delivering more than one bigoted message to indoctrinate a nation.
I realize how maddening reading things like that is to you, and I regret that my words do that if they do, but they are not meant to slander, but rather, to offer ideas that have been considered at length, are sincerely believed, and constructively offered. I consider this phenomenon to be a blight on the lives of millions, and I'd like to see it gone.
And I can't expect any help from you. You can't even see it, which is why you see me as hateful, and roil when I post opinions like these. That's how you view criticism of what you consider sacred, and its source - not as a dispassionate difference of opinion, but as a hate-filled attack.
There is no Christian persecution card to play in this country, yet. What occurs isn't persecution. There are some rather bizarre and stupid things done in the culture wars by Christian haters, but it isn't persecution.
Christian haters? Isn't that you playing the persecution card right there? Anti-theists like me don't hate Christians. I don't hate you or any other Christian posting on RF, and I can remember anything from anybody else that I would call hatred for Christians.
What anti-theists object to is things like the bigotry, the anti-intellectualism / anti-scientism, and the selfishness of the church including its anti-Americanism evidenced in its incessant effort to penetrate the cherished church-state wall and impose Christian values on everybody. We believe that Christianity is for Christians, and should not bleed into the lives of unbelievers where it is probably unwelcome.
When the American church, which is losing cultural hegemony every decade, takes it place beside the other religions in America unable to inform public policy or opinion, then it will cease to be of any more interest to humanists than say the Wiccans or Hindus in America, and what you call hating Christians will disappear.
Conservatives will be in the majority on the court for generations perhaps, be prepared for unfettered abortion to end.
Perhaps so. If so, be prepared for a lot of unwanted babies to be born, young mothers forced to drop out of school and and become waitresses, those that can afford it to go abroad for safe abortions, and a bunch of back alley abortions.
I recently watched the Netflix documentary on Gloria Allred, a prominent American feminist activist and attorney, who was raped at gunpoint at age 25. She was asked if that was the worst thing that had ever happened to her. She answered no, it was the back alley abortion she needed because of the rape (pre-Roe v Wade). She began hemorrhaging and developed a fever of 106 degrees due to infection. She nearly lost her life.
And why?
Because some people think that abortion offends Jesus, and all Americans should be subject to that belief whether they share it or not - that those who defy the church on this matter should expect the state to treat such people as criminals on its behalf.
That's the selfishness of the church to which I referred. Freedom of religion to such people means freedom to obey their religious precepts or go to prison.
