Rick O'Shez
Irishman bouncing off walls
Mount Meru is in my back garden and I will be selling tickets. 
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Where is Mount Sumeru?
- Thread starter Subhankar Zac
- Start date
Native
Free Natural Philosopher & Comparative Mythologist
So am I indeed. And I agree in a sense on the north pole issue in ancient cosmologicl/astronical myths.Sun set on Mount Meru (swarga loka) can be another day's debate. Im more keen on understanding the location of Meru
But the sun doesn´t revolve around the north pole This is a significant (and a very nasty) problem, don´t you think?
And the planets also don´t revolve around the north pole, another nasty problem.
In ancient myths it is told that the Sun and the planets moves over the the Sky and goes down in the Underworld This is the common description, but it cannot be imagined as moving around the celestial north pole.
"Sun set on Mount Meru (swarga loka) can be another day's debate" is a real nasty question indeed. Is there a mountain where the Sun sets? How can this be imagined?
Cheers
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Aupmanyav
Be your own guru
Accept that Mount Sumeru is a myth in Hindu mythology as well as in others. We have seen the center of the Milky way galaxy, there is no mountain there but a super dyke, a supermassive black hole of the order of 4.3 million solar masses. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galactic_CenterSO: When modern science states that the Solar System orbits the galactic center, then its real. But it´s a myth when an ancient myth states the very same. That´s inconsistently funny indeed
@Aupmanyav,
If the mythical Meru (peak of which is Swarga) can be conquered by us Humans, there would be no God(s) (super power(s)) ! I believe humans would need higher level of consciousness to get anywhere close to realizing it's existence. I find it funny that some 'materialistically developed nations' have their naval/army bases in these polar areas to guard these mythical entities.
If the mythical Meru (peak of which is Swarga) can be conquered by us Humans, there would be no God(s) (super power(s)) ! I believe humans would need higher level of consciousness to get anywhere close to realizing it's existence. I find it funny that some 'materialistically developed nations' have their naval/army bases in these polar areas to guard these mythical entities.
Aupmanyav
Be your own guru
http://mentalfloss.com/article/67362/9-facts-about-climbing-mount-meru-and-making-documentary-out-it
"Meru Peak is a mountain that lies in the Garwhal Himalayas, in the Uttarakhand region of India. It lies between Thalay Sagar and Shivling, and has some highly challenging routes. It is 6,660 metres (21,850 ft) high. It was the site of the world's highest BASE Jump from 'Earth', by Glenn Singleman and Heather Swan from a height of 6,604 metres (21,667 ft) in June 2006 .. The mountain has three peaks: southern (6,660 metres, 21,850 ft), central (6,310 metres, 20,700 ft), and northern (6,450 metres, 21,160 ft). The two higher peaks were climbed earlier than the harder central peak, which was first climbed in a 2001 solo ascent by Valery Babanov, and for a second and third time in 2006. The Shark's Fin route up the central peak of the mountain has a reputation among mountaineers as one of the hardest routes in the world. It was first climbed in October 2011 by a team consisting of Conrad Anker, Jimmy Chin, and Renan Ozturk." (Wikipedia)
"Meru Peak is a mountain that lies in the Garwhal Himalayas, in the Uttarakhand region of India. It lies between Thalay Sagar and Shivling, and has some highly challenging routes. It is 6,660 metres (21,850 ft) high. It was the site of the world's highest BASE Jump from 'Earth', by Glenn Singleman and Heather Swan from a height of 6,604 metres (21,667 ft) in June 2006 .. The mountain has three peaks: southern (6,660 metres, 21,850 ft), central (6,310 metres, 20,700 ft), and northern (6,450 metres, 21,160 ft). The two higher peaks were climbed earlier than the harder central peak, which was first climbed in a 2001 solo ascent by Valery Babanov, and for a second and third time in 2006. The Shark's Fin route up the central peak of the mountain has a reputation among mountaineers as one of the hardest routes in the world. It was first climbed in October 2011 by a team consisting of Conrad Anker, Jimmy Chin, and Renan Ozturk." (Wikipedia)
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Native
Free Natural Philosopher & Comparative Mythologist
What? Are we now dealing with both metaphysics AND conspiracy teories? As well as astronomy AND mythology as well as the geological interpretation from @Aupmanyav,If the mythical Meru (peak of which is Swarga) can be conquered by us Humans, there would be no God(s) (super power(s)) ! I believe humans would need higher level of consciousness to get anywhere close to realizing it's existence. I find it funny that some 'materialistically developed nations' have their naval/army bases in these polar areas to guard these mythical entities.
Now THAT is really a NASTY combination which only can result in further NASTY questions and so on.
From - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mount_Meru#Hindu_legends
"Mount Meru of Hindu traditions is described as 84,000 Yojan high (about 1,082,000 km (672,000 mi), which would be 85 times the Earth's diameter), and notes that the Sun along with all the planets in the Solar System revolve around Mt. Meru as one unit.
One Yojana can be taken to mean about 11.5 km (9 miles) though its magnitude seems to differ over time periods, e.g. the Earth's circumference is 3,200 yojanas according to Vārāhamihira and slightly less so in the Āryabhatiya, but is said to be 5,026.5 yojanas in the Suryasiddhānta. The Matsya Purana and the Bhāgvata Purāna along with some other Hindu texts consistently give the height of 84,000 yojanas to Mount Meru which translates into 672,000 miles or 1,082,000 kilometers.
Mount Meru was said to be the residence of King Padamja Brahma in antiquity.[16]
The Puranas and Hindu epics, often state that Surya, i.e. the Sun God, along with all its planets and stars taken together as one unit, circumnavigate Mount Meru every day.
Mount Meru is also the abode of Lord Brahma and the Demi-Gods (Dev).
According to the Epic, Mahabharata, Pandavas and Draupadi climbed this mountain to attain heaven. Draupadi and other four Pandavas were cast down for their sins and died. Only Yudhishthira along with his faithful dog climbed the mountain, making him the only one to reach the Divine door".
If ALL and I say ALL these informations don´t fit your hypothesis and your explanations, you are just cherry picking your favorite apple. Aside those which don´t exist at all, as the conspiracy apple.
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Native
Free Natural Philosopher & Comparative Mythologist
Native
Free Natural Philosopher & Comparative Mythologist
@Native
With state of the art telescopes on earth, probes & satellites which are sent into the outer space not able to find this gigantic structure so far (which has 85 times dia of Earth), I can only think that Meru is not visible to a naked eye & something which exists in another dimension.
It makes me wonder how small are we in this universe !.
Cheers !
With state of the art telescopes on earth, probes & satellites which are sent into the outer space not able to find this gigantic structure so far (which has 85 times dia of Earth), I can only think that Meru is not visible to a naked eye & something which exists in another dimension.
It makes me wonder how small are we in this universe
!.Cheers !
Native
Free Natural Philosopher & Comparative Mythologist
You can say that againIt makes me wonder how small are we in this universe
and again and again I´m on my way posting a sort of Mythological/Astronomical/Cosmological/Geological "analyzing method"-scheme.
So hold your horses and have a little patience.
Cheers
gnostic
The Lost One
"Carry on" is just a phrase, like Aupmanyav telling you to "continue" or to "go ahead".I maybe have a dizzy day today
Carrying on with what?
Native
Free Natural Philosopher & Comparative Mythologist
Thanks for your educations
I hope you use the same analyzing effort when you are looking for the overall contents in topics as you do in the grammar.
Cheers
Native
Free Natural Philosopher & Comparative Mythologist
Where is Mount Sumeru? Or what is Mount Meru?
Hello Aupmanyav, (All)
So, are you in a need for a meaningful entertainment? Okay then
Our working Hypothesis:
1. All myths means “myths” for nothing.
2. All myths means something else what is said in the texts.
3. Myths have real cosmological and scientifical meaning, but we´ve forgotten to interpret these.
a) We don’t care and stop the discussion.
b) What do the then mean?
c) What clues do we have?
d) If true, what clues can we find?
e) How do our clues compute to each other.
f) Conclusion.
I suggest we take one § at the time. Where are the connections and the disconnections?
(Remember to quote ALL texts when you reply)
-----------------------------
§ 1. Geographical – https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mount_Meru#Geographical
The dimensions attributed to Mount Meru, all references to it being as a part of the Cosmic Ocean, with several statements that say, "The Sun along with all the planets circle the mountain," make determining its location most difficult, according to most scholars.
Some researchers identify Mount Meru or Sumeru with the Pamirs, northwest of Kashmir
In the Suryasiddhanta mentions that Mt. Meru lies in 'the middle of the Earth' ("bhurva-madhya") in the land of the Jambunad (Jambudvip). Narpatijayacharyā, a ninth-century text, based on mostly unpublished texts of Yāmal Tantr, mentions "Sumeruḥ Prithvī-madhye shrūyate drishyate na tu" ('Su-meru is heard to be in the middle of the Earth, but is not seen there'). Vārāhamihira, in his Panch-siddhāntikā, claims Mt. Meru to be at the North Pole (though no mountain exists there). Suryasiddhānt, however, mentions a Mt. Meru in the middle of Earth, besides a Sumeru and a Kumeru at both the Poles.
--------------
§ 2. Mount(d) Meru - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mount_Meru
Mount Meru of Hindu traditions is described as 84,000 Yojan high (about 1,082,000 km (672,000 mi), which would be 85 times the Earth's diameter), and notes that the Sun along with all the planets in the Solar System revolve around Mt. Meru as one unit
One Yojana can be taken to mean about 11.5 km (9 miles) though its magnitude seems to differ over time periods, e.g. the Earth's circumference is 3,200 yojanas according to Vārāhamihira and slightly less so in the Āryabhatiya, but is said to be 5,026.5 yojanas in the Suryasiddhānta. The Matsya Purana and the Bhāgvata Purāna along with some other Hindu texts consistently give the height of 84,000 yojanas to Mount Meru which translates into 672,000 miles or 1,082,000 kilometers.
Mount Meru is also the abode of Lord Brahma and the Demi-Gods (Dev).
§ 3. Lord Brahma - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brahma
Brahma (/ˈbrəmɑː/; Brahmā) is the creator god in the Trimurti of Hinduism. He has four faces, looking in the four directions. Brahma is also known as Svayambhu (self-born), Vāgīśa (Lord of Speech), and the creator of the four Vedas, one from each of his mouths. Brahma is identified with the Vedic god Prajapati, as well as linked to Kama and Hiranyagarbha (the cosmic egg), he is more prominently mentioned in the post-Vedic Hindu epics and the mythologies in the Puranas. In the epics, he is conflated with Purusha.. Brahma, along with Vishnu and Shiva, is part of a Hindu Trinity, however, ancient Hindu texts mention other trinities of gods or goddesses which does not include Brahma.
----------------------------
So, here we have different mythical, astronomical, cosmological and geographical descriptions, explanations and interpretation of the Mount Meru myth and its connections and associations.
How, on Earth, can we connect the right dots? Remember this: We cannot conclude anything before we have taken ALL informations into consideration.
§ 4. Comparative Discussions
§ 5. Conclusion
Cheers
Hello Aupmanyav, (All)
So, are you in a need for a meaningful entertainment? Okay then
Our working Hypothesis:
1. All myths means “myths” for nothing.
2. All myths means something else what is said in the texts.
3. Myths have real cosmological and scientifical meaning, but we´ve forgotten to interpret these.
a) We don’t care and stop the discussion.
b) What do the then mean?
c) What clues do we have?
d) If true, what clues can we find?
e) How do our clues compute to each other.
f) Conclusion.
I suggest we take one § at the time. Where are the connections and the disconnections?
(Remember to quote ALL texts when you reply)
-----------------------------
§ 1. Geographical – https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mount_Meru#Geographical
The dimensions attributed to Mount Meru, all references to it being as a part of the Cosmic Ocean, with several statements that say, "The Sun along with all the planets circle the mountain," make determining its location most difficult, according to most scholars.
Some researchers identify Mount Meru or Sumeru with the Pamirs, northwest of Kashmir
In the Suryasiddhanta mentions that Mt. Meru lies in 'the middle of the Earth' ("bhurva-madhya") in the land of the Jambunad (Jambudvip). Narpatijayacharyā, a ninth-century text, based on mostly unpublished texts of Yāmal Tantr, mentions "Sumeruḥ Prithvī-madhye shrūyate drishyate na tu" ('Su-meru is heard to be in the middle of the Earth, but is not seen there'). Vārāhamihira, in his Panch-siddhāntikā, claims Mt. Meru to be at the North Pole (though no mountain exists there). Suryasiddhānt, however, mentions a Mt. Meru in the middle of Earth, besides a Sumeru and a Kumeru at both the Poles.
--------------
§ 2. Mount(d) Meru - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mount_Meru
Mount Meru of Hindu traditions is described as 84,000 Yojan high (about 1,082,000 km (672,000 mi), which would be 85 times the Earth's diameter), and notes that the Sun along with all the planets in the Solar System revolve around Mt. Meru as one unit
One Yojana can be taken to mean about 11.5 km (9 miles) though its magnitude seems to differ over time periods, e.g. the Earth's circumference is 3,200 yojanas according to Vārāhamihira and slightly less so in the Āryabhatiya, but is said to be 5,026.5 yojanas in the Suryasiddhānta. The Matsya Purana and the Bhāgvata Purāna along with some other Hindu texts consistently give the height of 84,000 yojanas to Mount Meru which translates into 672,000 miles or 1,082,000 kilometers.
Mount Meru is also the abode of Lord Brahma and the Demi-Gods (Dev).
§ 3. Lord Brahma - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brahma
Brahma (/ˈbrəmɑː/; Brahmā) is the creator god in the Trimurti of Hinduism. He has four faces, looking in the four directions. Brahma is also known as Svayambhu (self-born), Vāgīśa (Lord of Speech), and the creator of the four Vedas, one from each of his mouths. Brahma is identified with the Vedic god Prajapati, as well as linked to Kama and Hiranyagarbha (the cosmic egg), he is more prominently mentioned in the post-Vedic Hindu epics and the mythologies in the Puranas. In the epics, he is conflated with Purusha.. Brahma, along with Vishnu and Shiva, is part of a Hindu Trinity, however, ancient Hindu texts mention other trinities of gods or goddesses which does not include Brahma.
----------------------------
So, here we have different mythical, astronomical, cosmological and geographical descriptions, explanations and interpretation of the Mount Meru myth and its connections and associations.
How, on Earth, can we connect the right dots? Remember this: We cannot conclude anything before we have taken ALL informations into consideration.
§ 4. Comparative Discussions
§ 5. Conclusion
Cheers
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Native, Good start, let's connect the dots .
To break this down into stages, we need to ascertain;
1) Dimension of Mount Meru
2) It's probable location
3) It's physical existence on Earth
4) It's Alignment/Movement with respect to Sun, Moon, rest of the planets in our solar system, big dipper and pole star.
I'll start with discrepancies;
'1. Dimensions' :
There seems to be a big disconnect on the dimensions of this mountain in various ancient texts:
The concept of a Meru mountain at the north pole, also called Sumeru mountain, is found in the Mahabharata, Puranas, Jain Cosmology and in Aryabhatta. Using the Aryabhatiyan scale for yojanas, the dimensions of Meru are:
Mahabharata : 193 km inside the earth’s surface, 1017 km above.
Puranas : 193776 km inside the earth’s surface, 823548 km above.
Jain Cosmology : 12111 km inside the earth’s surface, 1198989 km above.
Aryabhatta : Cylindrical in shape, of height 12 km and diameter 12 km
Out of the above Aryabhatta's reference seems some what imaginable, while the rest aren't.
Awaiting rest of the forum's views on this aspect.
Cheers !
.To break this down into stages, we need to ascertain;
1) Dimension of Mount Meru
2) It's probable location
3) It's physical existence on Earth
4) It's Alignment/Movement with respect to Sun, Moon, rest of the planets in our solar system, big dipper and pole star.
I'll start with discrepancies;
'1. Dimensions' :
There seems to be a big disconnect on the dimensions of this mountain in various ancient texts:
The concept of a Meru mountain at the north pole, also called Sumeru mountain, is found in the Mahabharata, Puranas, Jain Cosmology and in Aryabhatta. Using the Aryabhatiyan scale for yojanas, the dimensions of Meru are:
Mahabharata : 193 km inside the earth’s surface, 1017 km above.
Puranas : 193776 km inside the earth’s surface, 823548 km above.
Jain Cosmology : 12111 km inside the earth’s surface, 1198989 km above.
Aryabhatta : Cylindrical in shape, of height 12 km and diameter 12 km
Out of the above Aryabhatta's reference seems some what imaginable, while the rest aren't.
Awaiting rest of the forum's views on this aspect.
Cheers !
gnostic
The Lost One
Wow.
Considering that the earth's diameter is a little over 12,000 km, and Everest stands less than 9 km above sea level, I can see why Meru is such a great myth.
Native
Free Natural Philosopher & Comparative Mythologist
Yes it is anyway "a high myth"Considering that the earth's diameter is a little over 12,000 km, and Everest stands less than 9 km above sea level, I can see why Meru is such a great myth.
Wait a couple of minutes, I´m on my way with a reply to your former post.