Which "deity" is offering the best deal?

[Shermana]

I've edited my post to clarify that the deal that the Christian God is offering. From what I can see, Jews and Muslims have a more agnostic view of God than a Christian view. The biblical Christian views God as an intimate companion, one that he prays to and listens for his voice. One who experiences his presence through manifestations such as healings, prophecy, speaking in tongues, etc. Again, at least in practice Muslims and Jews seem to experience God as something unknowable and distant. Advantage Jesus

Please show some examples of Christians who have directly shown real "Speaking in tongues" (Which is supposed to apply to total fluency in actual real world languages that they never learned as in the ability to communicate with other humans, not strange esoteric babble languages), show some of these healings that aren't "Faith healings" by con artists in show-scams, and explain what kind of "prophecy" a Christian may have these days. When you say "listens for his voice", what do you mean? Are you saying God Himself talks to these Christians through some voice that others may "mistake" it for "Skitzofrenia"?

Better to have a so-called "Agnostic" (I don't think you used that word correctly) view of God who is "Unknowable" And "Distant" than to think you're directly communicating with Him or having "Manifestations" when in fact it's all in your ego-bloated head I'd say. It's amazing how many "Christians" who have "The Spirit" who all believe in drastically different things, surely some of them must be lying, no? How about most or nearly all of them?

And I certainly don't rule out the possibility of Healings, Prophecy, and Speaking in Tongues, but I rule out the possibility of most-so-called "Christians" claims of it by hearsay alone. You're not referring to those charismatic churches are you?

 

[Rainbow Mage]

I was kidding though. I'm not in my religion for me. You can't approach the gods that way or they'll destroy you. They are higher beings of great power. All ancients agreed that those who try to use the gods meet bad ends. That's just it really. Serving them really is a choice. They don't need us.

Like I said earlier in the thread, not to bruise too many egos here, but humans aren't special like we like to think. To the gods we're like dirt they walk on.

 

[BruceDLimber]

"ekaṃ sad viprā bahudhā" means "the Truth is One, the wise know It by many names".

In the immortal words of Olson Johnson,

"Now WHO can argue with THAT??!!!"



Bruce

 

[Gjallarhorn]

Guys can't become goddesses, though, so neener, neener, neener!

Given enough time and adaption decay, guys could become goddesses, women could become gods, and a pleasant dinner could become cannibalism.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Just a thought: this thread asks which religion is the "best deal", but the discussion so far has only really addressed half of the deal: the payout. The other half is the cost. How do the deals look when cost is factored in?

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Thinking about it in benefit/cost ratio terms, I think that once again, the Mormons win: as I understand it, I could live my life the way I am now with no additional costs or effort and end up in Heaven. Maybe not the nicest Heaven, but better than what I have now and hey! It's free!

 

[Me Myself]

Just a thought: this thread asks which religion is the "best deal", but the discussion so far has only really addressed half of the deal: the payout. The other half is the cost. How do the deals look when cost is factored in?

Hey ! I put the cost in!

 

[Iti oj]

Just a thought: this thread asks which religion is the "best deal", but the discussion so far has only really addressed half of the deal: the payout. The other half is the cost. How do the deals look when cost is factored in?

And not just cost but the results of faliure to meet your end of thr deal ie hell etc

 

[Katzpur]

Thinking about it in benefit/cost ratio terms, I think that once again, the Mormons win: as I understand it, I could live my life the way I am now with no additional costs or effort and end up in Heaven. Maybe not the nicest Heaven, but better than what I have now and hey! It's free!

Actually, nothing's ever free. With respect to heaven... it's only free to those who accept Jesus' offer to pay the cost to enter. Those who don't believe He can and wants to pay it for them will have to pay it themselves. But, you're right about them ending up in heaven, too -- eventually. It doesn't seem to me to be the best choice, given the other option, but whatever floats your boat.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Actually, nothing's ever free. With respect to heaven... it's only free to those who accept Jesus' offer to pay the cost to enter. Those who don't believe He can and wants to pay it for them will have to pay it themselves. But, you're right about them ending up in heaven, too -- eventually. It doesn't seem to me to be the best choice, given the other option, but whatever floats your boat.

Hmm... maybe I'll have to revise my answer, then. Personally, I think that accepting the Atonement would be a tremendous moral cost... akin to accepting a gift you knew was made by children in a sweat shop, but many, many times worse.

A question for all the Christians: do any of you *not* believe that to get the afterlife payout you say is coming, you have to proclaim the horrible suffering of the only truly innocent person in existence as a good thing?

 

[Twig pentagram]

Thinking about it in benefit/cost ratio terms, I think that once again, the Mormons win: as I understand it, I could live my life the way I am now with no additional costs or effort and end up in Heaven. Maybe not the nicest Heaven, but better than what I have now and hey! It's free!

The Mormons are winning in my book.

 

[Alceste]

Just a thought: this thread asks which religion is the "best deal", but the discussion so far has only really addressed half of the deal: the payout. The other half is the cost. How do the deals look when cost is factored in?

Just having to give up my Sunday mornings rules out most of the Christian gods.

Thinking about it in benefit/cost ratio terms, I think that once again, the Mormons win: as I understand it, I could live my life the way I am now with no additional costs or effort and end up in Heaven. Maybe not the nicest Heaven, but better than what I have now and hey! It's free!

I think you have to give up caffeine. That's another deal breaker for me. I am not a morning person.

 

[Shermana]

I actually think the Mormons have something right going there, it explains all the planets and galaxies and ahem....Extra-terrestrials, something other "Christians' can merely attribute to aesthetics or saying doesn't exist.

 

[Katzpur]

A question for all the Christians: do any of you *not* believe that to get the afterlife payout you say is coming, you have to proclaim the horrible suffering of the only truly innocent person in existence as a good thing?

Horrible suffering is never a good thing. What it ultimately had the power to bring about -- the immortality and eternal life of man -- is more than "good."

 

[Katzpur]

I think you have to give up caffeine. That's another deal breaker for me. I am not a morning person.

If you don't mind your caffeine in the form of Coke, you'd be okay. (I know, it's complicated. )

 

[Breathe]

If you don't mind your caffeine in the form of Coke, you'd be okay. (I know, it's complicated. )

I've been wondering this for a while: what about something like iced tea or a frappuccino? Decaf tea and coffee is still okay, right? Wrong?

 

[Alceste]

If you don't mind your caffeine in the form of Coke, you'd be okay. (I know, it's complicated. )

Really? Because I don't do soft drinks. I pretty much only drink coffee, water and pinot noir, and I can not function without coffee.

Unless...

Do Mormons have to get out of bed in the morning?

 

[-Peacemaker-]

Please show some examples of Christians who have directly shown real "Speaking in tongues" (Which is supposed to apply to total fluency in actual real world languages that they never learned as in the ability to communicate with other humans, not strange esoteric babble languages), show some of these healings that aren't "Faith healings" by con artists in show-scams, and explain what kind of "prophecy" a Christian may have these days. When you say "listens for his voice", what do you mean? Are you saying God Himself talks to these Christians through some voice that others may "mistake" it for "Skitzofrenia"?

Better to have a so-called "Agnostic" (I don't think you used that word correctly) view of God who is "Unknowable" And "Distant" than to think you're directly communicating with Him or having "Manifestations" when in fact it's all in your ego-bloated head I'd say. It's amazing how many "Christians" who have "The Spirit" who all believe in drastically different things, surely some of them must be lying, no? How about most or nearly all of them?

And I certainly don't rule out the possibility of Healings, Prophecy, and Speaking in Tongues, but I rule out the possibility of most-so-called "Christians" claims of it by hearsay alone. You're not referring to those charismatic churches are you?

you'd probably have to find a church with some charismatic influences to see such things. Something else from Scripture that can perhaps shed some light on the nature of the relationship that Christians believe extsts between them and God is the story of Jesus in the garden. From what I've heard about the original text, Jesus uses the word "Abba" when praying to God. From what I've read it would be unheard of for Jews to refer to God so informally as the word "Abba" is akin to "daddy".

 

[Shermana]

you'd probably have to find a church with some charismatic influences to see such things. Something else from Scripture that can perhaps shed some light on the nature of the relationship that Christians believe extsts between them and God is the story of Jesus in the garden. From what I've heard about the original text, Jesus uses the word "Abba" when praying to God. From what I've read it would be unheard of for Jews to refer to God so informally as the word "Abba" is akin to "daddy".

Seems like you're saying that Charismatic Churches are the "real deal" Christians. Do you believe that their claims to speaking in tongues is Authentic? Does it match with what Acts and Paul's epistles say the event is supposed to be like?

I fail to see how the informal father-son relation communication between Jesus and the Father in any way whatsoever has to do with what I said. Please explain how that's not a total non-sequitur.

And you said that being a Christian involves listening for the Voice of God. As I asked, what does that mean exactly? Are you talking about hearing literal auditory voices? And what about "prophecy"? You say that these are things that "Christians" can expect, right?

 

[predavlad]

I would say none. I don't think I could believe in any religion unless I accepted Pascal's wager.

I'd rather live in the present rather than in a future that may not exist. Try and be good here, and be rewarded here. Value and cherish friends and family, and hope you get the same from them. That is the best reward I can hope for in this life - the only one we are sure about.