Which existed first "something" or "nothing"?

[Ben Dhyan]

There is no such thing as "nothing".

But I like to know what this nothing-and-something is all about, before I say anything more.

I agree with you...but big bang theory says before the big bang...there was absolutely nothing...no space...no time...then with the bb...something came into existence...

 

[gnostic]

I disagree. An atheist only has to accept that "Matter and/or energy has always existed (in some form or another), and occasionally give rise to more complex things made of the same eternal stuff." A theist has to accept that:

1. Supernatural spiritual beings can exist.
2. Spiritual beings can exist eternally.
3. Spiritual beings can create new matter and energy from nothing.
4. Spiritual beings can exist outside of space and time.
5. Spiritual beings can think and store information.
6. Spiritual beings have needs or emotions that lead them to create things.
7. Spiritual beings can have knowledge without ever being educated.

6. How could God or the Universe just always exist? | 500 Questions about God & Christianity

The weird theist reasoning claiming that since humans make sandwiches a bigger and more powerful equivalent of a human is required to make universes maybe sounded logical to our ancestors but in this day and age...?

What a theists believe in, are largely the results of fear and ignorance...in another word - "superstition".

Christian-Muslim religions is a concept of people fearing death, and wanting to live forever, so they make up outlandish belief of all-powerful deity, promising paradise if you convert, or eternal torment for those who refused their respective religions. That's in the nutshell, is superstition...as well as a heavy doses of wishful thinking.

While the concept of afterlife is a very fascinating subject, it is also utterly absurd when people still believe in such thing today.

Christianity and Islam are holding on to primitive superstitions, that was first started by the Egyptians, about 4000 years earlier.

I am not saying that Egyptian religion is the first religion to believe in afterlife and resurrection, but they are the first to actually record their belief on the walls of half dozen Old Kingdom pyramids at Saqqara, written in hieroglyphs (about mid 3rd millennium BCE). These hieroglyphs contain spells for resurrection.

 

[gnostic]

I agree with you...but big bang theory says before the big bang...there was absolutely nothing...no space...no time...then with the bb...something came into existence...

No, it is not. You don't understand that the scientists actually have no idea what it was like before the Big Bang.

They can only observe the observable universe. Our current technology cannot observed the opaque veil beyond the Big Bang, so at best, they can only speculate what the singularity is...but that doesn't mean there was nothing before BB.

All we do know, is that the universe was hot and dense, but it became increasingly cooler, as space expand.

Until we have better technology, we can only speculate what it was like before BB.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

No, it is not. You don't understand that the scientists actually have no idea what it was like before the Big Bang.

They can only observe the observable universe. Our current technology cannot observed the opaque veil beyond the Big Bang, so at best, they can only speculate what the singularity is...but that doesn't mean there was nothing before BB.

All we do know, is that the universe was hot and dense, but it became increasingly cooler, as space expand.

Until we have better technology, we can only speculate what it was like before BB.

It is you who are mistaken...while there are a growing number of scientists who believe there is a multiverse or infinite universe in which this big bang is not unique......most experts believe there was nothing in existence before the big bang....no time...no space...absolutely nothing..

Big Bang Theory

Another misconception is that we tend to image the singularity as a little fireball appearing somewhere in space. According to the many experts however, space didn't exist prior to the Big Bang. Back in the late '60s and early '70s, when men first walked upon the moon, "three British astrophysicists, Steven Hawking, George Ellis, and Roger Penrose turned their attention to the Theory of Relativity and its implications regarding our notions of time. In 1968 and 1970, they published papers in which they extended Einstein's Theory of General Relativity to include measurements of time and space.1, 2 According to their calculations, time and space had a finite beginning that corresponded to the origin of matter and energy."3 The singularity didn't appear in space; rather, space began inside of the singularity. Prior to the singularity, nothing existed, not space, time, matter, or energy - nothing. So where and in what did the singularity appear if not in space? We don't know. We don't know where it came from, why it's here, or even where it is. All we really know is that we are inside of it and at one time it didn't exist and neither did we. -

 

[Willamena]

or none of them unless the ONE who created/evolved them communicates and informs us which one.
Topic open for Theists and Atheists alike.

Regards

Ostensibly, both of them, since one is just the negative of the other.

 

[Deathbydefault]

Why do you think there needs to be a beginning to absolute reality? The concept of real means something that is not illusory.....not some phantom that comes and goes.....it is really real...cosmic existence is absolute reality...it has no beginning and no ending like temporary things...

Eh, but what about after death?
What about life in general?

I realize that many of you are talking about the existence of matter, but I am talking about life.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

Eh, but what about after death?
What about life in general?

I realize that many of you are talking about the existence of matter, but I am talking about life.

Given an eternal Cosmos....then galaxies, stars, planets, creatures, plants, etc., while all individually are relatively temporary manifestations....in the generic sense, there was never a beginning to these continuous manifestations, nor an ending.....like the whole...

 

[Deathbydefault]

Given an eternal Cosmos....then galaxies, stars, planets, creatures, plants, etc., while all individually are relatively temporary manifestations....in the generic sense, have never had a beginning, nor an ending.....like the whole...

Yes, that would be matter.
I'm talking about "You" and "Me".
Who we are inside our heads is what is subject to something and nothing.
At least from my world view anyways.

Maybe I should have been for specific, scratch out "life" and replace it with "consciousness".

 

[Ben Dhyan]

Yes, that would be matter.
I'm talking about "You" and "Me".
Who we are inside our heads is what is subject to something and nothing.
At least from my world view anyways.

Maybe I should have been for specific, scratch out "life" and replace it with "consciousness".

No, not just matter has been around forever, ....the creatures like us as well....

 

[Deathbydefault]

No, not just matter has been around forever, ....the creatures like us as well....

lol, wut

I don't understand, are you saying something sentient can be eternal?

 

[Ben Dhyan]

lol, wut

I don't understand, are you saying something sentient can be eternal?

I explained...in the generic sense...galaxies come and go...in them, star systems come and go....in them, planets come and go...on them, creatures come and go....there was never a beginning to eternal nature...

 

[Deathbydefault]

I explained...in the generic sense...galaxies come and go...in them, star systems come and go....in them, planets come and go...on them, creatures come and go....there was never a beginning to eternal nature...

But there is a beginning to sentience, it isn't something that is just there.
Nor is there a guarantee that it will always be there.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

But there is a beginning to sentience, it isn't something that is just there.
Nor is there a guarantee that it will always be there.

There was no beginning to sentience in the generic sense...only wrt the particular....

Btw, where and when in eternity do you think it had its beginning? lol...

 

[Deathbydefault]

There was no beginning to sentience in the generic sense...only wrt the particular....

Btw, where and when in eternity do you think it had its beginning? lol...

When life evolved to the point where it could consciously decide things for itself.

 

[paarsurrey]

I just meant in the way we currently understand the terms "something" and "nothing".

The words "something" and "nothing" exist in the lexicons from many centuries and are being used by everybody everyday currently. Why use them as terminologies of science in a stretched sense?
Regards

 

[paarsurrey]

I don't believe in the existence of "nothing".

No harm in it.
Regards

 

[Thief]

or none of them unless the ONE who created/evolved them communicates and informs us which one.
Topic open for Theists and Atheists alike.

Regards

got here late....sorry...

Spirit First.
Substance needs a push to move.
Substance cannot beget life.

Spirit First.

 

[paarsurrey]

It is not known how life came into being.
Our bodies break down and return to the earth. We continue to exist as nourishment for the soil, plants and animals. We are all immortal in this sense.
That is enough for me.
I suspect that there is more, but I haven't a clue what.

Your suspicion is al-right and not ill-founded.
Regards

 

[leibowde84]

Does science claim that every snapshot by camera is beautiful?
Do cameras have a check on ugliness or complexity? Please
Regards

No. Of course not. My point is why would they have to? I don't even get where you are coming from with this last comment.

 

[Thief]

Does science claim that every snapshot by camera is beautiful?
Do cameras have a check on ugliness or complexity? Please
Regards

I've seen on scientist make discussion....time is like a series of photos.
Snapshots already taken.

I don't buy it.