Which Religious Scripture Is Truly The Word Of God?

[Jabar]

I get that perfectly well. After all, we still don't know exactly what Stonehenge's original purpose was.

It doesn't change the fact that it's a false equivalence, because the Universe has not been demonstrated to be anything like an object or a machine.



"Fact" and "belief" are not synonyms.



OOOH, you wanna go down THAT Rabbit Hole, do you?

See, that's not as easy to determine as you might expect. Even if you looked it up in the dictionary, you'll find all kinds of conflicting definitions. The word is what we call "polysemic", which means it has multiple definitions. Something to remember about English is that there is no such thing as a "correct" one; if a definition is not in the dictionary, then that means the dictionary is what's wrong and needs to be updated, because they're descriptive, not prescriptive.

Anyway, I don't know about the Arabic word Allah, so I can't speak for it. I think it's cognate with the Hebrew word "El", but I don't know for sure since I'm largely unfamiliar with Semitic languages.

But the English word "God" is actually quite tricky to define, because it's used for so many different things in so many different contexts, and has a very unclear etymology. HOWEVER, we are among the peoples from whom it came, and when we were using it to describe certain types of beings, said beings were absolutely not Omnigods. One of the most likely etymologies is that it comes from a PIE word that meant "to invoke" or "that which is invoked." In other words, a God is anything that is worshiped as a God, regardless of its actual inherent qualities.

It is this definition that I use. Therefore, there are plenty of Gods, in the past and now, who are flesh and blood humans with no supernatural powers, but who have been deified. "Emperor" Akihito of Japan comes to mind immediately.

Another later definition might have been something to the effect of "those who belonged to the God-Tribe", who might have been the Esan. There is some indication that the word "God" was once synonymous with "Tiw"; i.e. one of the Esan. The word "Tiw" was sometimes used in titles for other Gods; the Old Norse form Tyr shows up in "Hangatyr", meaning "Hanged God/God of the Hanged" which is one of Woden's titles. During Christianization, then, the word "God" ended up getting grafted onto the Christian God for whatever reason.

In any case, the Esan are not perfect.

Listen, people still know what Stonehenge is. I am saying if they do not know anything about the object or machine.
Not El, Elohim.
The gods you speak of are all man-made.

 

[Riverwolf]

Listen, people still know what Stonehenge is. I am saying if they do not know anything about the object or machine.

We know that it exists, and that it's aligned with Sun on the Solstice, but we don't know why it was built.

So, it fits your description.

Not El, Elohim.

Isn't "Elohim" the plural form?

The gods you speak of are all man-made.

You're certainly free to believe that if you want.

Personally, I've looked a LOT into how indigenous traditions work, and the process of deification. I'm quite aware that it's significantly more complicated than that. You seem focused entirely on this notion of "Scripture", and so I'm not surprised that this isn't an area of expertise for you.

我は汝…汝は我…我は汝の心の海より出ずる者…

 

[Jabar]

We know that it exists, and that it's aligned with Sun on the Solstice, but we don't know why it was built.

So, it fits your description.



Isn't "Elohim" the plural form?



You're certainly free to believe that if you want.

Personally, I've looked a LOT into how indigenous traditions work, and the process of deification. I'm quite aware that it's significantly more complicated than that. You seem focused entirely on this notion of "Scripture", and so I'm not surprised that this isn't an area of expertise for you.

我は汝…汝は我…我は汝の心の海より出ずる者…

Exactly, the example i use is we do not know of the existence until shown.

Yeah, my bad. It is El.

True.

 

[Riverwolf]

Exactly, the example i use is we do not know of the existence until shown.

Which still doesn't work, because regardless of what the Universe's nature is, we know full well that it exists, because we live in it.

Also, consider this: under the definition I provided, a man-made God is still a God.

 

[Jabar]

Which still doesn't work, because regardless of what the Universe's nature is, we know full well that it exists, because we live in it.

Also, consider this: under the definition I provided, a man-made God is still a God.

You have no evidence behind your claim but irrational perspective whilst i do.

A man-made God might be defined as a God in society, but is it truly existing?

Nope.

 

[metis]

To the OP, none, imo.

 

[Jabar]

To the OP, none, imo.

Even with all that evidence?>

LOL

 

[David1967]

When put into comparison, all religious scriptures, which prevails over the other?
They must contain the following

1) Complex literature
2) Prophecies and Scientific evidences
3) Logic
4) No Errors






Peace.

Since you are of the Muslim faith I will have to assume that you believe the Quran fits the criteria you speak of, else you wouldn't be a Muslim.
And peace to you as well Jabar.

 

[metis]

Even with all that evidence?>

LOL

When I see it, then maybe I'll believe it.

 

[Jabar]

Since you are of the Muslim faith I will have to assume that you believe the Quran fits the criteria you speak of, else you wouldn't be a Muslim.
And peace to you as well Jabar.

Well yeah.

Faith is a big part of belief of the Qur'ans divinity.

But evidential information just proves it more.

 

[Jabar]

When I see it, then maybe I'll believe it.

Okay, just a summarization:

Qur'an says Earth is Geo-Spherical in shape. Approved by modern science
Qur'an says Moon is Reflected Light. Approved by modern science.
Qur'an says Sun is rotating about its own axis. Approved by modern science. We learn this really modernly and Qur'an way in past approves.
Who could of said all this?

The sunlight that we have is due to a chemical reaction that is taking place since billions of years and one day this chemical reaction will cease to exist and life on the face of this earth will also cease to exist.

Qur'an says Sun is running for a period determined, and not just a period but a place determined.

Today, science also tells us that the sun and the solar system is moving to a point in the universe which is known as the Solar Apex at the speed of 12 m/s.

What science tells us today is mentioned in the Qur'an 1400 years ago.

Once again who could of mentioned this?

Today Science tells us that the Atmosphere, outside the earth, it prevents and acts like a ceiling prevents the harmful radiation and the ultraviolet rays from entering the earth. If this was not there, then life would not exist on the face of the earth.

Qur'an says Allah made the sky as a protected ceiling.

What science has discovered recently has been mentioned 1400 years ago.

I can say much much more.

Tell me this.

ALL of these scientific evidences along with much more, do you still deny that the Qur'an is not divine?

If so, i am shocked.



ATHEISTS & AGNOSTICS:
HAHAHAH THAT IS FALSE, OBVIOUSLY A HUMAN SAID ALL THAT PFFTTTTT

 

[Father Heathen]

The real question why would a god need mortals to act as interpreters/middlemen/spokespeople? Also, why would god communicate or intervene in vague, convoluted, inefficient, Rube Goldberg-esque ways that cause more confusion than clarification? Why would god allow his word and will to be intermingled and muddled human culture and social norms - especially arbitrary, irrational, and unjust ones?

Edit: Also, one can believe in god without having to believe things that other mere mortals have attributed to god. Such a being would not be defined by or restricted to how different societies have perceived and portrayed them. In fact, religions and their scriptures say far more about the cultures/era from which they originated than they do about any actual god.

 

[metis]

Okay, just a summarization:

Qur'an says Earth is Geo-Spherical in shape. Approved by modern science
Qur'an says Moon is Reflected Light. Approved by modern science.
Qur'an says Sun is rotating about its own axis. Approved by modern science. We learn this really modernly and Qur'an way in past approves.
Who could of said all this?

The sunlight that we have is due to a chemical reaction that is taking place since billions of years and one day this chemical reaction will cease to exist and life on the face of this earth will also cease to exist.

Qur'an says Sun is running for a period determined, and not just a period but a place determined.

Today, science also tells us that the sun and the solar system is moving to a point in the universe which is known as the Solar Apex at the speed of 12 m/s.

What science tells us today is mentioned in the Qur'an 1400 years ago.

Once again who could of mentioned this?

Today Science tells us that the Atmosphere, outside the earth, it prevents and acts like a ceiling prevents the harmful radiation and the ultraviolet rays from entering the earth. If this was not there, then life would not exist on the face of the earth.

Qur'an says Allah made the sky as a protected ceiling.

What science has discovered recently has been mentioned 1400 years ago.

I can say much much more.

Tell me this.

ALL of these scientific evidences along with much more, do you still deny that the Qur'an is not divine?

If so, i am shocked.



ATHEISTS & AGNOSTICS:
HAHAHAH THAT IS FALSE, OBVIOUSLY A HUMAN SAID ALL THAT PFFTTTTT

I have read the Qur'an, and I have found it no more "the word of God" than any other religious book or magazine. If you do, that's fine, but such claims are pretty much universal, so I don't take them seriously.

 

[Jabar]

I have read the Qur'an, and I have found it no more "the word of God" than any other religious book or magazine. If you do, that's fine, but such claims are pretty much universal, so I don't take them seriously.

Only somewhat universal in society.

Imagine it 1400 years ago, i think it is beyond human capacity to be totally honest.

This is divinity.

 

[Jabar]

The real question why would a god need mortals to act as interpreters/middlemen/spokespeople? Also, why would god communicate or intervene in vague, convoluted, inefficient, Rube Goldberg-esque ways that cause more confusion than clarification? Why would god allow his word and will to be intermingled and muddled human culture and social norms - especially arbitrary, irrational, and unjust ones?

1) If you mean Prophets, they were brought to give people the message.
2) He did not communicate in vague, the humans interpret it like that and have technology at their fingertips but they do not use it.
3) God did not allow it to intermingled, the people chose to by making misconceptions or reason of arrogance and ignorance.

Allah gave people a free will and made the world diverse for a reason.

It all fits like a puzzle piece.

 

[metis]

Only somewhat universal in society.

Imagine it 1400 years ago, i think it is beyond human capacity to be totally honest.

This is divinity.

You are only "seeing" what you pretty much want to see, and the name for this in psycholiv=gy is called "confirmation bias", and it is indeed pretty much universal.

Listen, what you choose to believe is what you choose to believe, but what someone else chooses to believe (or not) is what they may choose to believe. I can respect what you may chose to believe, but I don't have any respect for those who try and tell me o others what I or they should believe (or not).

BTW, if you believe that the Qur'an is "the word of God", welcome to the world of idolatry. The Qur'an is not God, nor is God the Qur'an, so if you think an object is God or a piece of God, that's very alien to my way of thinking.

 

[Ingledsva]

Qur'an says Earth is Geo-Spherical in shape. Approved by modern science
Qur'an says Moon is Reflected Light. Approved by modern science.
Qur'an says Sun is rotating about its own axis. Approved by modern science. We learn this really modernly and Qur'an way in past approves.
Who could of said all this?

The sunlight that we have is due to a chemical reaction that is taking place since billions of years and one day this chemical reaction will cease to exist and life on the face of this earth will also cease to exist.

Qur'an says Sun is running for a period determined, and not just a period but a place determined.

Today, science also tells us that the sun and the solar system is moving to a point in the universe which is known as the Solar Apex at the speed of 12 m/s.

What science tells us today is mentioned in the Qur'an 1400 years ago.

Once again who could of mentioned this?

Today Science tells us that the Atmosphere, outside the earth, it prevents and acts like a ceiling prevents the harmful radiation and the ultraviolet rays from entering the earth. If this was not there, then life would not exist on the face of the earth.

Qur'an says Allah made the sky as a protected ceiling.

What science has discovered recently has been mentioned 1400 years ago.

I can say much much more.

Tell me this.

ALL of these scientific evidences along with much more, do you still deny that the Qur'an is not divine?

If so, i am shocked.



ATHEISTS & AGNOSTICS:
HAHAHAH THAT IS FALSE, OBVIOUSLY A HUMAN SAID ALL THAT PFFTTTTT

This has all been brought up before and proved to be false, rewriting/retranslating, or previously know info.

For instance Aristotle (384-322 BC) argued in his writings that the Earth was spherical, because of the circular shadow it cast on the Moon, during a lunar eclipse.

The Quran is supposedly from 610 AD. In other words people knew the earth was spherical long before Mohammed.

Also please add verse and number so we can look them up to see what they actually say.

*

 

[Flankerl]

Who could of said all this?

How about the people who said it before Islam was around?

You know just because its not a hot topic with those who live among the sand dunes of the Arabian desert doesn't mean that no one else is talking about it.

 

[Subhankar Zac]

Bottomline: Quran is the literal word of God. if you disagree, it will create a hundred loops here to land on te same topic that the Quran in infallible.

But to stir up some controversy: The Bhagavad Gita is the literal word of God.

 

[Ingledsva]

Qur'an says Moon is Reflected Light. Approved by modern science.
...
ATHEISTS & AGNOSTICS:
HAHAHAH THAT IS FALSE, OBVIOUSLY A HUMAN SAID ALL THAT PFFTTTTT

Nope.