Well you have a point in a way, I guess that my calculations would only apply to ET? But if they apply to ET then in this case they can also br applied to what it took to get us here.
-
Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.
Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:- Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
- Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
- Access to private conversations with other members.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!
Who Can Prove God's Existence?
- Thread starter NGerty
- Start date
Well you have a point in a way, I guess that my calculations would only apply to ET? But if they apply to ET then in this case they can also br applied to what it took to get us here.
Caladan
Agnostic Pantheist
As an atheist I don't shy away from saying that appreciation or faith if you will, in something greater than ourselves can be a positive thing.
A-ManESL
Well-Known Member
This is a seperate question. Perhaps you ought to have started two threads. Anyway, tell me:
(1) Why do you think God can do anything?
(2) Why do you think he wants people to believe in him?
The only reason I am asking these questions is only so that I know a little more about you. It is certainly easier to talk with people whom one understands.
The numbers probably are greatly against our existence, but we are here now nevertheless. The universe is something like 13 billion years old and it is exponentially bigger than our comprehension allows us to envision it. Though life like ours is probably a rarity, I find there is bound to be some other life like ours in the universe given the myriad places it has to arise and the billions of years it has had to do so.
Also, when you say "the chimp thing," do you mean evolution? You say "the chimp thing" quite dismissively and passively... What is your understanding of the theory of evolution?
And what are you talking about when you say "I know God works within nature?" First of all, how do you know? And what do you mean he works "within" nature?
Secondly, you say "God did not define an earthly day until day 4, and time distortion is a real possibility as well."
Time distortion? what does that mean in an out of context, and how is it relevant?
Secondly, you say "God did not define an earthly day until day 4, and time distortion is a real possibility as well."
Time distortion? what does that mean in an out of context, and how is it relevant?
I believe that God created all things to survive and thereby built int each living thing the ability to adapt, evolve if you wish. There is not enough fossil evidence one way or the other to draw a real family tree of anything. My contention is everything was put here similar to what it is now.
I believe God created man (Adam and Eve) as is and others in the world were put here by God that are only mentioned in passing in the Bible.
We measure the age of the universe by distance measured in light years though expansion is also a factor that can not be measured. I really dont want to go int a long drawn out explanation of it but the universe that we know is much older, younger or both than we know.
Why do I think he can do anything? Because he supposedly impregnated a virgin women, can perform miracles, has a divine plan for the universe, is omniscient, is said to have created the entire universe, and listens to millions of people talk to him at once. And I'm pretty sure I've heard God described as "all-powerful," so it doesn't seem a stretch to assume he can do anything.
And why do I think he wants people to believe in him? I don't have an answer for that. Probably, if he exists, he wants people to worship him and follow him blindly like all of history's dictators, and monarchs.
You say there is not enough fossil evidence, but there sure is a lot of it. Though it's not complete, how do you explain the fossils showing human evolution? Evolution doesn't say we evolved from the monkeys we know today, but that the monkeys of today and humans have a common ancestor; That nearly a billion years ago, that line split and evolved separately. One evolved into the present day human, the other into the modern primates. How can you say it's just coincidence that we look strikingly similar to primates and share around 97 of our DNA?
Also, for life to have been created with a snap of God's fingers makes things way too complicated. Evolution makes much more sense in terms of explaining how such complicated life came to exist. The first forms of life were single-celled organisms, and today, 3 billion years later after much slow change, life is the way it is.
And the contention that Adam and Eve were created first seems utterly ridiculous. How can you prove they were created? And when, 6000 years ago like the Bible says? the Earth is around 4 billion years old and the universe is 13.5 billion years old.
The scientific reality, which is testable and proven, doesn't match up with the biblical reality (which is taken from an ancient book that can't be verified or truly) trusted) at all.
Last edited:
McBell
Unbound
A-ManESL
Well-Known Member
You have probably heard all this, and have no "intuition" of your own of God. (I say this because your reponses are based on your own empirical standards to describe "this supposed God".) Have you considered that your knowledge of God may be insufficient and incomplete. If that is so then the answer to your query is simply that the question is inappropriately and incompletely posed.
Assume God is just a symbol for something else, perhaps God is not a distinct diety but all of creation, you and me included. If you have no problems accepting such a God, start from this view, and proceed. Just as you searched in the Bible, search this thought (see here to first choose which tradition suits you best) and see if you find your proof. Do this, if you are serious about finding the answer. Ultimately when you get that insight, your doubts will be automatically resolved.
Regards.
Last edited:
How about doing a full quote next time and take it in it's fullest context. You can prove that similar life forms were here but there is nothing to prove conclusively one way or another that man evolved from anything older than 6,000-60,000 years. There is nothing in the fossil record linking one thing directly to another. Why do you think the evolutionary road map of man is incomplete? There is not one. When Cain was cast out into the wilderness with whom did he procreate? Perhaps evolved creatures? Who knows but as I said nothing can be proven so I choose not to take a chance, I defer to God.
Who is Cain? I'm not familiar with biblical figures...
Though the evolutionary theory is there, there isn't enough proof to make evolution a fact. That I agree with. But there is evidence. Now forget the Bible and provide some evidence, preferably observable and testable evidence that supports the creationist theory.
I can't say evolution is correct, but there is a lot of evidence that lends to it being valid. I don't see any evidence supporting creationism outside of the Bible.
Though the evolutionary theory is there, there isn't enough proof to make evolution a fact. That I agree with. But there is evidence. Now forget the Bible and provide some evidence, preferably observable and testable evidence that supports the creationist theory.
I can't say evolution is correct, but there is a lot of evidence that lends to it being valid. I don't see any evidence supporting creationism outside of the Bible.
It can not be proven either way as to creation or explosion, It is a matter of faith. There is not really anything wrong with believing in no God other than taking a chance with what may be eternal damnation. I through faith see undeniable evidence point to God, others see that same evidence and say it was not God. Choose a side. I prefer the side of hope.
Humanistheart
Well-Known Member
Explosion? What are you talking about? As for creation, no, we know for fact that it's false. And there is the same chance of 'eternal damnation' for all religions as there is for those who don't believe.
Last edited:
Humanistheart
Well-Known Member
Evolution is fact.
Storm
ThrUU the Looking Glass
Ugh. I wouldn't have bothered replying if I'd known this was going to degenerate into yet another evolution thread.....
Not all believers are so unreasonable.
Big Bang.
We know nothing of the sort. There is no proof either way.
Same Chance? One who denies God and tries to convince believers to give up their faith as they say it is false has the exact same chance of salvation as one who accepts that God is real and does their beast to please God?
I disagree with many here of differing faiths but I expect that if they are led to believe in a way differing from mine, yet still accept God, God will be forgiving to them as he will be to me. God made a promise to me and other Christians in his son Jesus. I believe that promise. What other covenants God has made I will not pretend to agree with but if they follow their scriptures I am sure they will also receive some sort of mercy.
The people who completely deny God yet do not attempt to mislead followers will also be judged accordingly.
Those who attempt to destroy all faith and not only deny God but also tamper with his flock shall most likely not see the mercies afforded others.
Erebus
Well-Known Member
Look around you at everyone and everything, including yourself. There's god. Do I get a prize now?
...or were you specifically referring to the Abrahamic god? That's a common mistake around here.