• Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

WHO IS GOD'S TRUE ISRAEL IN THE NEW COVENANT?

3rdAngel

3rdAngel

Well-Known Member
3rdAngel said: No one said there was a single covenant. We are talking about the one that God give through Abraham, Sarah and Issac.
Click to expand...
Your response here...
Ebionite said:
In other words the marginalisation of the covenant the has the descendants of Ishmael amongst the beneficiaries.
For it is written, that Abraham had two sons, the one by a bondmaid, the other by a freewoman.
But he [who was] of the bondwoman was born after the flesh; but he of the freewoman [was] by promise.
Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar.
For this Agar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children.
But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all.
Galatians 4:22-26 The point is that Pauline tradition associates the "Word of God" with religious prejudice.
Click to expand...
Actually no it doesn't. Gods new covenant was only made with Abraham, Sarah, through Isaac according to the Torah. There is no prejudice only scripture that says this. God never made His new covenant promise through Hagar and Ishmael and Islam.

Take Care.
 
Last edited:
Ebionite

Ebionite

Well-Known Member
3rdAngel said:
You missed the point.. in the post you were responding to. The torah mentions it
Click to expand...
No, the point is that the covenant of Genesis 15 is significant because Paul doesn't mention it and you won't talk about it. The fact the the Torah mentions it is obvious.
 
3rdAngel

3rdAngel

Well-Known Member
Ebionite said:
No, the point is that the covenant of Genesis 15 is significant because Paul doesn't mention it and you won't talk about it. The fact the the Torah mentions it is obvious.
Click to expand...
I think you missed the point again. God never made His covenant promise with Islam. This is stated in the Torah.
 
Last edited:
Ebionite

Ebionite

Well-Known Member
3rdAngel said:
Islam claims lineage through Abraham, Hagar and Ishmael. God never made His covenant promise through them.
Click to expand...
The covenant of Genesis 15 was to the benefit of Ishmael's descendants as well as Isaac's because they were both of Abram's/Abrahams's seed.

In the same day YHWH made a covenant with Abram, saying, Unto thy seed have I given this land, from the river of Egypt unto the great river, the river Euphrates:
Genesis 15:18
 
3rdAngel

3rdAngel

Well-Known Member
Ebionite said:
The covenant of Genesis 15 was to the benefit of Ishmael's descendants as well as Isaac's because they were both of Abram's/Abrahams's seed.
In the same day YHWH made a covenant with Abram, saying, Unto thy seed have I given this land, from the river of Egypt unto the great river, the river Euphrates:
Genesis 15:18
Click to expand...
Sorry that is not the same covenant that God gave to Abraham and Sarah through their promised son Isaac.
 
B

Bthoth

Well-Known Member
Ebionite said:
The rest is context which leads to understanding.
Click to expand...
Sure... Hab 2:12 Wo [to] him who is building a city by blood, And establishing a city by iniquity.

Great context that helps with the same understanding that I already comprehend.

Ebionite said:
The covenant of Genesis 15 was to the benefit of Ishmael's descendants as well as Isaac's because they were both of Abram's/Abrahams's seed.

In the same day YHWH made a covenant with Abram, saying, Unto thy seed have I given this land, from the river of Egypt unto the great river, the river Euphrates:
Genesis 15:18
Click to expand...
You mean the story in torah because unless you heard a god say it, you are claiming heresay. At the time of moses, that land was an egyptian held vassal and the Amarna Tablets (in stone) prove it.
 
Ebionite

Ebionite

Well-Known Member
Bthoth said:
Sure... Hab 2:12 Wo [to] him who is building a city by blood, And establishing a city by iniquity.

Great context that helps with the same understanding that I already comprehend.
Click to expand...
That's fine. The point is that more more context there is, the better you're able to comprehend the issue.

Bthoth said:
You mean the story in torah because unless you heard a god say it, you are claiming heresay.
Click to expand...
No, I'm referencing the Torah because it's the most relevant source on the issue of original land rights that relate to modern Israel.
 
B

Bthoth

Well-Known Member
Ebionite said:
That's fine. The point is that more more context there is, the better you're able to comprehend the issue.
Click to expand...

Explain. The context that applies in the real world is the idolatry for that city of blood is the cause of the current divide. if you read enough, you will understanding that the good follow the rules, the others dont. The promise is that over time, the holy of holies (the name) will unveil and mankind with know what IS REAL and the house of knowledge (psion) can be opened.

But that does not fit your opinion, church or even the 3 opinions that you think that you know.


Ebionite said:
No, I'm referencing the Torah because it's the most relevant source on the issue of original land rights that relate to modern Israel.
Click to expand...
I did not see one reference. Lots of barking and telling but no references.

Modern israel exists and per the references, of both current publications and tanakh, not doing very well with following the rules.

Would you like me to give YOU references of both?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top