Who were the Magi?

[Димитар]

It was customary for Romans in the 1st century AD to announce significant events and meetings with foreign dignitaries, including heads of state, to the empire.

Still no connection to Matthew.
How would a Jew announce news about another God ?
How can you belive in that ?

Perhaps because nobody in the Roman empire cared? Here we have the four gospels which are the cornerstone of the religion and we don't know when and who wrote them.

It seems to me that you misunderstood the question.
Why the writers of the NT did not mentioned Paul' death?
You also ignore the fact that 1 Thessalonians was probably written between 49-51 AD.

And Gospels are important and the other part of the NT is not?

I would appreciate it though if you stop asking constantly questions and do your own search. Thank you.

I have done my research and i have already passed this.This is why i try to reason with you , but we can't come in the middle.

You made the claim and i challenged you.

I won't do it again.

Peace

 

[Ebionite]

That's OK, but common sense and experiments have sentenced astrology many centuries ago, to be no more than a myth.

It's common sense to think that we know everything about the relationship between consciousness and creation?

 

[Ebionite]

There's no way to justify scientism in the context of non-repeatable phenomena.

 

[Ajax]

I have done my research and i have already passed this.This is why i try to reason with you , but we can't come in the middle.

You made the claim and i challenged you.

I won't do it again.

Peace

I didn't mean that, but you keep asking irrelevant sounding questions without specifying your point . What is the purpose for example of this question whilst we were discussing the Magi and Matthew?

Then why no one mentioned Paul' death ? Why conscpicuously absent is his death ? The single most important event to culminate Paul' ministry, why did nobody wrote about it ?

 

[Ajax]

It's common sense to think that we know everything about the relationship between consciousness and creation?

It depends on what you mean by creation, also what kind of relationship you envisage. On our subject though which is astrology, there have been many experiments which have completely debunked it.

 

[Ebionite]

It depends on what you mean by creation, also what kind of relationship you envisage.

Can you describe an interpretation of creation or that relationship where it would be reasonable to think that we had complete knowledge?

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

There's no way to justify scientism in the context of non-repeatable phenomena.

Blather about "scientism" is an irrelevant diversion irrespective of what you might mean by the term.

 

[Димитар]

I didn't mean that, but you keep asking irrelevant sounding questions without specifying your point.

How are they irrelevant?
I mean you explained and i have read every suggestion and i followed it.And i have asked reasonable questions.
I mean to say that the Jews announced news about other Gods , ask any historian he will laugh at you.That's just non-sense..

Don't forget what was happening in 66AD in Jerusalem - War.

 

[Ajax]

Can you describe an interpretation of creation or that relationship where it would be reasonable to think that we had complete knowledge?

We do not have complete knowledge on many things, but for astrology we do and know it is rubbish.

 

[Ebionite]

We do not have complete knowledge on many things, but for astrology we do and know it is rubbish.

Special pleading. You fail.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Special pleading. You fail.

Nonsense.

 

[Ebionite]

Nonsense.

I'm not going to explain it to you.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

I'm not going to explain it to you.

That's probably best.

 

[Balthazzar]

Magi, wise men, kings are the title type descriptors I was given as a source for my understanding of who they were. They were wealthy enough to bring gifts of value, and wise enough to be wealthy enough to give the gifts, so I will assume the title kings were also attributed to them based on the aforementioned. Magi were typically the learned and educated, if I'm not mistaken, and knowledge is said to be power, so yeah ... Kings, magi, and "wise men" would seem appropriate enough for the gift givers. Beyond this, I haven't a clue aside from the territories they came from, which if I'm not mistaken was Mesopotamia, Persia, and Asia. I'm guessing Persians had the Gold, Mesopotamia and Asia produced the frankincense and myrrh, all were valuable commodities for trade. Learned astronomer's is likely true also, given how the stars were utilized for guidance back then.

 

[Elihoenai]

I was an Eastern Orthodox Christian, until I decided to study the Bible for 4 years. I freaked out and have become almost an agnostic. Since then I have done my own unbiased search. There may be a God and Jesus, but the Bible contains so many lies, falsehoods and contradictions that in no way can be taken seriously by me.

1) So Joseph got up and took the Child and His mother while it was still night, and left for Egypt......This was to fulfill what the Lord had spoken by the prophet, “Out of Egypt have I called my son.” (Matthew 2:14)
2) When they had performed everything according to the Law of the Lord, they returned to Galilee, to their own city of Nazareth. (Luke 2:39)

Matthew (as Mark does to a lesser extent), twists the scriptures and tries all the time to find prophecies for Jesus which actually do not exist. Hosea 11:1 is not predictive but retrospective. God looks back on how he showed his love to the people of Israel by calling them out of Egypt at the time of the exodus.
So in order to justify the trip to Egypt and present it as another prophecy with a view to tie together the Torah and Jesus (in order to proselytize Jews), he invented the Magi (from Dio Cassius writings) and the Slaughter of the Innocent.

Luke's gospel on the other hand shows no worries whatsoever about Jesus being killed by Herod together with other newborns.

Thomas Paine: Age of Reason

It's certainly True that the Holy Scriptures/Bible from Genesis to Revelation cannot be Reconciled with Exoteric Knowledge. Exoteric is the Natural and Historical Interpretation. You cannot understand the Holy Scriptures/Bible with Reason. For example, Albert Einstein and Karl Marx didn't understand the Holy Scriptures/Bible.

The Holy Scriptures/Bible from Genesis to Revelation is Reconciled with Esoteric Knowledge. Given that you are Deist you don't believe in the Esoteric Hidden Divine Knowledge.

I Am Christian Gnostic Being the Total Opposite of Deist.


Qlippoth

In the Zohar, Lurianic Kabbalah, and Hermetic Qabalah, the qlippoth (Hebrew: קְלִיפּוֹת, romanized: qəlippoṯ, originally Jewish Babylonian Aramaic: קְלִיפִּין, romanized: qəlippin, plural of קְלִפָּה qəlippā; literally "peels", "shells", or "husks"), are the representation of evil or impure spiritual forces in Jewish mysticism, the opposites of the Sefirot.[1][2] The realm of evil is called Sitra Achra (Jewish Babylonian Aramaic: סִטְרָא אַחְרָא, romanized: siṭrā ʾaḥrā, lit. 'The Other Side') in Kabbalistic texts.

Qlippoth - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Ajax]

It's certainly True that the Holy Scriptures/Bible from Genesis to Revelation cannot be Reconciled with Exoteric Knowledge. Exoteric is the Natural and Historical Interpretation. You cannot understand the Holy Scriptures/Bible with Reason. For example, Albert Einstein and Karl Marx didn't understand the Holy Scriptures/Bible.

The Holy Scriptures/Bible from Genesis to Revelation is Reconciled with Esoteric Knowledge. Given that you are Deist you don't believe in the Esoteric Hidden Divine Knowledge.

I Am Christian Gnostic Being the Total Opposite of Deist.


Qlippoth

So you want to say that the Bible is only for the few who have esoteric knowledge. I'm afraid I don't agree with this thinking. A biblical text is to be deciphered according to the ‘plain meaning’ expressed by its linguistic construction and historical context, otherwise there is no point in presenting it to the people and try to have them believe it. Qlippoth was a fairy tale scare for ancient and generally uneducated people. Needless to say that I don't believe in any evil spirits, but thank you anyway and good luck with your belief.

P.S. Orthodox and Catholic dogma says you must believe first with all your heart, before you will have esoteric knowledge from the Holy Spirit. Sounds like a snake oil salesman tactic.

 

[Elihoenai]

So you want to say that the Bible is only for the few who have esoteric knowledge. I'm afraid I don't agree with this thinking. A biblical text is to be deciphered according to the ‘plain meaning’ expressed by its linguistic construction and historical context, otherwise there is no point in presenting it to the people and try to have them believe it. Qlippoth was a fairy tale scare for ancient and generally uneducated people. Needless to say that I don't believe in any evil spirits, but thank you anyway and good luck with your belief.

P.S. Orthodox and Catholic dogma says you must believe first with all your heart, before you will have esoteric knowledge from the Holy Spirit. Sounds like a snake oil salesman tactic.

Yeshua/Jesus in the Historical Context and the Plain Meaning does Not Save anybody. Do you believe that we must be Saved? You have affirmed disbelief in Evil Spirits. Do you believe there is such a thing as Sin? Do you believe in the existence of Evil?

Christian Gnosticism is the Total Opposite of Roman Catholic and Orthodox Dogma and there is always only a Few of Us throughout the ages:

Gnosticism, the Enduring Heresy

 

[Ajax]

Yeshua/Jesus in the Historical Context and the Plain Meaning does Not Save anybody. Do you believe that we must be Saved? You have affirmed disbelief in Evil Spirits. Do you believe there is such a thing as Sin? Do you believe in the existence of Evil?

I'm sorry, but I do not believe in such things. There is no need for an invisible, intangible and vague substance called soul. We now know that all soul's supposed attributes are performed by the brain. Also the word "sin" refers to any act or thought that violates moral or ethical principles. It does not apply to the varying orders of different gods only.

Humans are classified as animals. Taxonomically, humans belong to the animal kingdom, specifically the phylum Chordata and the class Mammalia. Like other mammals, humans are warm-blooded, have vertebrae, give birth to live young, and nurse their offspring with milk. While humans possess unique cognitive abilities and complex social structures that distinguish us from other animals, biologically we share many similarities with other members of the animal kingdom. Therefore, do other animals have souls? Are other animals saved? Or our old anthropocentrism created the idea that only humans are saved?

 

[Elihoenai]

I'm sorry, but I do not believe in such things. There is no need for an invisible, intangible and vague substance called soul. We now know that all soul's supposed attributes are performed by the brain. Also the word "sin" refers to any act or thought that violates moral or ethical principles. It does not apply to the varying orders of different gods only.

Christianity is All about Sin and Salvation From Sin. Why do you call yourself Christian when you don't believe in the teachings of Christianity? You are Anti-Christian while in your profile you have stated that you are Christian.

Humans are classified as animals. Taxonomically, humans belong to the animal kingdom, specifically the phylum Chordata and the class Mammalia. Like other mammals, humans are warm-blooded, have vertebrae, give birth to live young, and nurse their offspring with milk. While humans possess unique cognitive abilities and complex social structures that distinguish us from other animals, biologically we share many similarities with other members of the animal kingdom. Therefore, do other animals have souls? Are other animals saved? Or our old anthropocentrism created the idea that only humans are saved?

Ecclesiastes 3:18

18 I said in mine heart concerning the estate of the sons of men, that God might manifest them, and that they might see that they themselves are beasts.


It's absolutely correct that Men/Women are Beasts/Animals. Elohim/God sent Yeshua Messiah/Jesus Christ to show The Way to Transcend the Beast. No, Certainly Not, the Man/Beast and Animals don't have Souls. Christian Gnosticism attains the Soul in the Journey to Transcending the Beast.

 

[Ajax]

Christianity is All about Sin and Salvation From Sin. Why do you call yourself Christian when you don't believe in the teachings of Christianity? You are Anti-Christian while in your profile you have stated that you are Christian.

I am an agnostic now. Certainly not anti-Christian.

It's absolutely correct that Men/Women are Beasts/Animals. Elohim/God sent Yeshua Messiah/Jesus Christ to show The Way to Transcend the Beast. No, Certainly Not, the Man/Beast and Animals don't have Souls. Christian Gnosticism attains the Soul in the Journey to Transcending the Beast.

Failed to understand what you mean. If men/women don't have souls, then whose soul is attained in Gnosticism?