Why are some Left Wing Liberals, So intellectually dishonest

[idav]

Were children separated from their parents as they crossed the boarder into the USA under the Obama administration?

We are repeatedly informed that the separation of illegal immigrant children from the family is a policy created by the Obama administration. Is this true or is it just Mr. Sessions policy.

Did President Obama’s administration remove children from their parents when they came to the U.S. illegally? Someone on FaceBook is saying this and I want to see if this is true.

NEWSWEEK: OBAMA HELD MORE THAN DOUBLE THE NUMBER OF CHILDREN IN SHELTERS COMPARED TO TRUMP WHITE HOUSE

Did Bill Clinton enact a law that made it legal to separate migrants from their children. We’re migrants forced to surrender their children during the Obama administration?

THE LAW TO SEPARATE PARENTS FROM THEIR CHILDREN WHEN THEY CROSS THE BORDER ILLEGALLY WAS PASSED IN 1997 By Bill Clintion. NOW IT’S A PROBLEM?



Typical liberal democrats were all for it in 1997,

Now Liberals democrats going against what they supported in 1997.

You don’t have to believe me cause I’m liberal, then believe Ted Cruz a Republican who supports the family separations and Senator of a border state. It’s a Trump policy and Cruz says Obama didn’t do that and explains why.
Ted Cruz says child-parent separations tie to court order

 

[idav]

Why is it that conservatives can never seem to come up with evidence for just about any claim that they make, let alone claims about liberal's intellectual dishonesty? Is that just my impression, or is there any substance to it?

I’ve seen some conservatives citing National Inquirer.

Were children separated from their parents as they crossed the boarder into the USA under the Obama administration?

We are repeatedly informed that the separation of illegal immigrant children from the family is a policy created by the Obama administration. Is this true or is it just Mr. Sessions policy.

Did President Obama’s administration remove children from their parents when they came to the U.S. illegally? Someone on FaceBook is saying this and I want to see if this is true.

NEWSWEEK: OBAMA HELD MORE THAN DOUBLE THE NUMBER OF CHILDREN IN SHELTERS COMPARED TO TRUMP WHITE HOUSE

Did Bill Clinton enact a law that made it legal to separate migrants from their children. We’re migrants forced to surrender their children during the Obama administration?

THE LAW TO SEPARATE PARENTS FROM THEIR CHILDREN WHEN THEY CROSS THE BORDER ILLEGALLY WAS PASSED IN 1997 By Bill Clintion. NOW IT’S A PROBLEM?



Typical liberal democrats were all for it in 1997,

Now Liberals democrats going against what they supported in 1997.

It’s trumps zero that makes criminals out of asylum seekers. Yes it’s a big problem. Just send them back don’t rip families apart and send only the parents packing.

 

[Twilight Hue]

NEWS IMMIGRATION

Before Jeff Sessions Separated Immigrant Families, Obama Did It
May 8, 2018, 6:16pm Tina Vasquez

A program that detains male Mexican migrants near the border and repatriates them far from their area of origin ramped up under the Obama administration—and often led to family separation.

The hardest stories come from the mothers. Between 2010 and 2012, the Obama administration deported more than 200,000 parents of U.S. citizen children, and more since that time. Many of the children of deported parents end up in the child welfare system, and may be separated indefinitely.

To make matters worse, if a mother attempts to return to the United States to unite with her children after being deported, she can face a felony charge with a federal prison sentence of up to 20 years.

The truth is @BarackObama and his administration created the crisis and saw the children as political tools - numbers for use as part of a narrative treating them like animals. The @POTUS has seen the problem - fixed their living conditions and wants to stop the problem






Liberal democrats created the mess under obama, and made the laws. Trump just enforcing the laws liberal democrats made under Obama

That's just the nature of a typical liberal Democrat. Never take responsibility for themselves for the problems they create and then blame the opposition as if they're the cause of it.

 

[David1967]

Why is it that conservatives can never seem to come up with evidence for just about any claim that they make, let alone claims about liberal's intellectual dishonesty? Is that just my impression, or is there any substance to it?

Honestly, I see both sides supplying information supporting their positions. Much
like the CNN V FOX NEWS headlines. If I watch both, well I'm a bit confused. Wish we had an unbiased source of media. It's more than a little frustrating.

 

[Sunstone]

Wish we had an unbiased source of media. It's more than a little frustrating.

I can wholly agree with you there. Of course,. some folks love to point out the obvious -- "all news sources are biased". But it seems to me that ignores the fact some sources are much more biased than others.

I'm for a return to the Fairness Doctrine, under which any station that aired something that could be said to be an opinion was required to give equal air time to an opposing point of view.

 

[TheBannerofHomuraAkemi]

Were children separated from their parents as they crossed the boarder into the USA under the Obama administration?

We are repeatedly informed that the separation of illegal immigrant children from the family is a policy created by the Obama administration. Is this true or is it just Mr. Sessions policy.

Did President Obama’s administration remove children from their parents when they came to the U.S. illegally? Someone on FaceBook is saying this and I want to see if this is true.

NEWSWEEK: OBAMA HELD MORE THAN DOUBLE THE NUMBER OF CHILDREN IN SHELTERS COMPARED TO TRUMP WHITE HOUSE

Did Bill Clinton enact a law that made it legal to separate migrants from their children. We’re migrants forced to surrender their children during the Obama administration?

THE LAW TO SEPARATE PARENTS FROM THEIR CHILDREN WHEN THEY CROSS THE BORDER ILLEGALLY WAS PASSED IN 1997 By Bill Clintion. NOW IT’S A PROBLEM?



Typical liberal democrats were all for it in 1997,

Now Liberals democrats going against what they supported in 1997.

Are we going to provide sources for theses claims or are just going to believe what we read on facebook?

 

[David1967]

I can wholly agree with you there. Of course,. some folks love to point out the obvious -- "all news sources are biased". But it seems to me that ignores the fact some sources are much more biased than others.

I'm for a return to the Fairness Doctrine, under which any station that aired something that could be said to be an opinion was required to give equal air time to an opposing point of view.

I would like that. It's too easy with news the way it is presented today, to just shop for the opinion we find most appealing to our worldview and settle on it as fact. I'm not aiming this at either side exclusively, but both.

 

[idav]

Honestly, I see both sides supplying information supporting their positions. Much
like the CNN V FOX NEWS headlines. If I watch both, well I'm a bit confused. Wish we had an unbiased source of media. It's more than a little frustrating.

It doesn’t help when Sessions and Trump are willing to outright lie about their own policies. Reporting them is just reporting lies. Other politicians are very good at mixing truth making it that much harder to decypher, dang lawyers, they know spin well.

 

[Willamena]

So its OK if you lie to us, But liberals can't??

(3 years late) That's precisely the wrong response. It's not okay if anyone lies.

 

[Epic Beard Man]

The poor will always be with us, this is a fact no matter the country or president.
if you think Trump is some kind of "magic cracker" that will undo that which has always been with us and always will be think again, he's just one president of many.

Wait, but still where are we winning? I want to win! This is what was promised!

 

[Epic Beard Man]

Why is it that conservatives can never seem to come up with evidence for just about any claim that they make, let alone claims about liberal's intellectual dishonesty? Is that just my impression, or is there any substance to it?

You'll never get an accurate response

 

[Subduction Zone]

Wait, but still where are we winning? I want to win! This is what was promised!

Gots to keep our promises:

 

[Valjean]

That's just the nature of a typical liberal Democrat. Never take responsibility for themselves for the problems they create and then blame the opposition as if they're the cause of it.

But they usually are the cause of it. It's the right wing that compartmentalizes; that has little problem holding contradictory ideas in their heads.

US exploitation of Central American countries ruined their economies, forcing emigration to the US. The Immigrants were discriminated against and forced into gangs. We then rounded up the gangs and shipped them back to Central America, where they pretty much took over and now dominate their countries of origin, forcing refugees to flee or die.

Similarly, NAFTA flooded Mexico with cheap American grain and forced farmers into bankruptcy, who then flooded into city slums and over the border to seek employment in the US.

There's your "responsibility." It wasn't the liberals that turned Honduras into a banana republic, effected a CIA coup in Honduras or sent in the Marines to occupy Nicaragua or later organized a Right wing coup in the '70s. It was CIA backed American imperialism, throughout Latin America, that created the poverty and dictatorships that sent refugees North.

Right wing foreign policies created the problem, and now we're shirking responsibility for the resulting misery. Don't blame the liberals. We opposed it all.

 

[Phantasman]

Things aren't that bad in Sweden. Trump has once again lied about that.
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/crime-sweden-rape-capital-europe/
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/crime-sweden-part-ii-refugee-men-overrepresented-swedish-crime/

Also we are not being taken over by Ms 13 members. Once again this is false propaganda, by Trump. There are only 10.000 members in the USA. From October 1st to the end of Trump's first year we only removed 1200 members. So how are we people taken over by them again?

Trump exaggerates number of MS-13 gang members deported

No one wants open borders, we just want to be reasonable and honest about it. Not promoting any form of hate. Matter of fact a lot of democratic members have tried to approach the right on DACA, but they turn back time and time again, by Trump and his poor political performance.

Trump claims Democrats absent from DACA negotiations

It will be more interesting if you told the truth at times.

What makes you think my data came from Trump?

The Internet has stories promoting both sides of any issue. Trump good. Trump bad.

I will admit Trump exaggerates. So does Pelosi and Shumer. Crumbs? Concentration camps?

Sometimes to cut through the US media bs, you have to collectively see what other countries see, Like Pravda, Tass, and others in Europe.

Snopes is a descent fact organisation. They don't advertise so they tend to only be concerned with factual content. Since Politifact has to satisfy advertisers, I doubt their content wouldn't be subjective to ad exec's political affiliations. You have to satisfy the ones who pay the bills.

Whether you want to "argue" that Sweden is having a hard time with immigrants and immigration or not is it's own subject. I have read and heard plenty of Swedes describe the conditions of the country over the past year or so. And Snopes is only dictating a small part of the content I have seen.

We see what we want to see.

 

[TheBannerofHomuraAkemi]

What makes you think my data came from Trump?

The Internet has stories promoting both sides of any issue. Trump good. Trump bad.

I will admit Trump exaggerates. So does Pelosi and Shumer. Crumbs? Concentration camps?

Sometimes to cut through the US media bs, you have to collectively see what other countries see, Like Pravda, Tass, and others in Europe.

Snopes is a descent fact organisation. They don't advertise so they tend to only be concerned with factual content. Since Politifact has to satisfy advertisers, I doubt their content wouldn't be subjective to ad exec's political affiliations. You have to satisfy the ones who pay the bills.

Whether you want to "argue" that Sweden is having a hard time with immigrants and immigration or not is it's own subject. I have read and heard plenty of Swedes describe the conditions of the country over the past year or so. And Snopes is only dictating a small part of the content I have seen.

We see what we want to see.

You ignored all the evidence, but provided nothing to back up your claims other then an opinion. Politifact is a non-profit unbias organization. You have provided nothing to to disapprove that. Trump doesn't exaggerate. He flat out lies and you have yet to disprove that.

 

[Phantasman]

Where did you get this idea that Obama ran as a liberal? He never made that claim. Perhaps he seemed liberal in contrast to Bush, but his policies were hardly progressive.
Immigration gone wild? Haven't we had more people leaving than coming for the past decade? When has immigration ever been lower?
There is no immigration crisis, it's a manufactured diversion.
You should look into the history of MS13. They're not a product of liberal policies, and if you object to the proliferation of the homeless, you should look to Republican, 'small government' social policies.
No. The immigrants aren't drug runners, rapists or terrorists. Terror organizations or drug cartels don't need to sneak in through the Southern desert.


The mothers with children aren't running drugs. They're refugies from US foreign policy.
What are you concerned about, increasing population? Republicans don't seem to be promoting any reproductive restrictions.
Is it crime? The immigrants have a lower crime rate than the natives.
Is it jobs? Immigrants are taking jobs employers can't find natives to fill.

It seems to me this is just a reactionary xenophobia, promoted by the Right for political purposes and fueled by economic and social stagnation, and a perceived threat to a previously assumed dominant position in the social hierarchy.
The right-wing orientation prefers simplistic causes and solutions.
The tax cuts for the working classes are temporary. The benefits for the rich are permanent. The money saved by the people will buy them less than the social programs that were previously available to them.

I'm an Independent. Voted for Dem Presidents and Rep Presidents.

I can see your skewed left slant as well as I see skewed right slants.

Obama ran as a Democrat but was a Progressive. No doubts there. Just as Trump ran as a Republican but is more Independent. It's why many Republicans don't like him.

You can view Obama any way you want. But his acts were Progessive, like weak world strength and huge spendings on programs with little return (on investment). How can someone like Obama spend so much money to Iran and not get Iranian hostages out? Yet Trump negotiated hostages from NK not costing the US taxpayer anything?

You can argue the Progressive agenda all day long. You can even deny it. But in the end, the actions and results are what I see. Not the talking heads calling names, spinning or excluding actions/results in "their" favor or trying to convince me that they are the good guys here.

I follow no particular political side. If a Dem has the right idea, I'll agree. Same with the Reps.

But I am not without wisdom in 68 years to understand when someone tries to tell me a bad thing is good. Or a good thing is bad. I decide that for myself. THIS is Freedom.

 

[Woberts]

Typical liberal democrats were all for it in 1997,

Now Liberals democrats going against what they supported in 1997.

This is going to get a bit technical, so hold on. Are you ready?

It's not 1997.

Pretty tough, eh?

 

[SkepticThinker]

Hey what goes around comes around, can't handle it. When it comes back at you.
Typical Liberal democrats.

Now that's amazing how you, yourself lie, Obama ran as a Liberal Democrat, became President as a Liberal Democrat.

"I think you lie, so I'm going to go right ahead and lie too!"

Seems to be what you're saying. Do you think that's an honest position?

 

[Woberts]

THIS is Freedom.

................ roll credits.

 

[Phantasman]

You ignored all the evidence, but provided nothing to back up your claims other then an opinion. Politifact is a non-profit unbias organization. You have provided nothing to to disapprove that. Trump doesn't exaggerate. He flat out lies and you have yet to disprove that.

OK. Trump lies. Who doesn't? You?

Follow who you want. I have no issue with what you like to read.

Yes. My opinion. No evidence. I believe the moon exists. I have no evidence. Same with Jesus.

The Internet is a blessing and a demon. I don't let it get the better of me. I am not a crusader. I don't care what someone believes, but I will question why in many cases. So I'm given links. Are links proof? Nope.

You can't provide evidence any more than I can refute it.

People say "you watch Fox, so you are a right wing advocate". The real reason I watch Fox is because if I want to hear the President, I can hear him in real time. Not through cut up pieces on MSNBC or CNN where pundits discuss partially (though I do watch them too). Trump and many Reps won't give an interview with CNN or MSNBC just as Pelosi and Schumer won't answer interviewers at Fox.

Everyone lies in the bed they make.