Why are you patriotic?

[Valjean]

Why are we expected to support a country just cause we chanced to be born within its borders?

What if we find the government oppressive or otherwise objectionable, why can't we choose our own patriotic persuasion, just as we choose our own religion? Why can't I be born and raised in the US yet be a New Zealand patriot and fly a New Zealand flag in my yard?

Where does a power elite get the idea they can claim automatic support and fealty from someone just because s/he was born within the turf they've currently laid claim to?

How is a government/country any different than a very large gang -- like the Crips? Should someone born in Compton, Los Angeles be expected to support his local Crips?
It seems to me the same relationship obtains.

 

[Kilgore Trout]

Why are we expected to support a country just cause we chanced to be born within its borders?

What if we find the government oppressive or otherwise objectionable, why can't we choose our own patriotic persuasion, just as we choose our own religion? Why can't I be born and raised in the US yet be a New Zealand patriot and fly a New Zealand flag in my yard?

Where does a power elite get the idea they can claim automatic support and fealty from someone just because s/he was born within the turf they've currently laid claim to?

How is a government/country any different than a very large gang -- like the Crips? Should someone born in Compton, Los Angeles be expected to support his local Crips?
It seems to me the same relationship obtains.

Yep, life isn't fair.

 

[Sunstone]

I suppose for many people, patriotism is more or less the equivalent of brand loyalty -- only on a larger scale.

 

[FlyingTeaPot]

I wouldn't say I'm patriotic, but I feel fortunate to live in the United States, as it is the ideal environment for someone of my personality and abilities to succeed and flourish.

Yeah, this was where I was going with my OP. I wouldn't say I'm patriotic just because I happen to have been born in a particular place. I think it is the same argument for religion too. I am not religious just because I happened to be born in a religious family.

 

[FlyingTeaPot]

I suppose for many people, patriotism is more or less the equivalent of brand loyalty -- only on a larger scale.

True dat.

 

[Father Heathen]

But your country is its government, HH. You're saying you love your terrain.

Wrong. A country is defined by values it was founded upon, not by the politicians who try to undermine those values.

"Dissent is the highest form of patriotism" - Thomas Jefferson

 

[kai]

Why are we expected to support a country just cause we chanced to be born within its borders?

What if we find the government oppressive or otherwise objectionable, why can't we choose our own patriotic persuasion, just as we choose our own religion?

Why can't I be born and raised in the US yet be a New Zealand patriot and fly a New Zealand flag in my yard?

Where does a power elite get the idea they can claim automatic support and fealty from someone just because s/he was born within the turf they've currently laid claim to?

How is a government/country any different than a very large gang -- like the Crips? Should someone born in Compton, Los Angeles be expected to support his local Crips?
It seems to me the same relationship obtains.

why cant you???

 

[Desert Snake]

Why not? Beats voting for the other guy.

 

[Valjean]

Wrong. A country is defined by values it was founded upon, not by the politicians who try to undermine those values.

"Dissent is the highest form of patriotism" - Thomas Jefferson

How many countries actually honor the values they were founded on? Likely as not the values were no more than PR even at the time of the founding.

These ideals are pie-in-the-sky, idealistic abstractions; fantasies. Real life = Realpolitik.
Realistically, we must deal with the world we actually inhabit.

A country is its government; its politics.

 

[Father Heathen]

How many countries actually honor the values they were founded on? Likely as not the values were no more than PR even at the time of the founding.

These ideals are pie-in-the-sky, idealistic abstractions; fantasies. Real life = Realpolitik.
Realistically, we must deal with the world we actually inhabit.

A country is its government; its politics.

Is it not also its culture and its history? Also, it's no more idealistic than veganism.

 

[Reverend Rick]

Yes, I'm patriotic.

[youtube]QX9X5zJ91Ac[/youtube]
MERLE HAGGARD - Fightin' Side Of Me - YouTube

 

[Valjean]

Is it not also its culture and its history? Also, it's no more idealistic than veganism.

Its culture and history are important factors in a government's evolution, but regardless of history we have to deal with a country as it is -- however it got there.

 

[Caladan]

Why are we expected to support a country just cause we chanced to be born within its borders?

This is what patriotism today seem to mean. but it wasn't always the case. there were time that patriotism meant making reforms in your own society. today when we think of the word patriotism the first thing that comes to mind is an American flag!
and I'm not even American.

 

[FlyingTeaPot]

Yes, I'm patriotic.

[youtube]QX9X5zJ91Ac[/youtube]
MERLE HAGGARD - Fightin' Side Of Me - YouTube

The question was why.

 

[kai]

This is what patriotism today seem to mean. but it wasn't always the case. there were time that patriotism meant making reforms in your own society. today when we think of the word patriotism the first thing that comes to mind is an American flag!
and I'm not even American.

First thing that comes to my mind is the Union flag

 

[Reverend Rick]

The question was why.

OK, I'm patriotic because I have faith and pride that my country will allow me, my children. and grand children the freedom to pursuit happiness.

I'm proud that we can go anywhere in the world and do whatever we deem necessary at any time.

I love to live in a country where we will fight for the right to let someone disagree with one another.

I truly believe in Liberty and Justice for all.

 

[Desert Snake]

I like the concepts that America was built on, yes, if that;s what the OP means by "patriotism".

 

[Kathryn]

But your country is its government, HH. You're saying you love your terrain.

I disagree with this. As Father Heathen (I think) pointed out, "Dissent is the highest form of patriotism." And I love the fact that as Americans, we can dissent without disappearing (so far).

I love so many things about being American, and Southern American, and a native Louisianan, and a Texan, and living in my small town in Texas, and my neighborhood, and the home I love, and my family and circle of friends.

A few reasons why I'm patriotic:

 

[Caladan]

First thing that comes to my mind is the Union flag

It's by far one the prettiest flags. also there is the phenomenon of being patriotic about a culture which essentialy you were not born into.
many Israelis for example are anglophiles, its an apolitical appreciation of English history and culture.

 

[Kathryn]

Some more reasons why I'm patriotic: