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Why Did God Create Atheists?

firedragon

Veteran Member
The common one, of not having a belief in the existence of God or gods, and often as to rejecting those proposed by all the major religions.

I thought atheism was the absence of belief in theism or divinity.

I didn't know that "often as to....." etc etc was part of the equation. So your personal agenda seems to be especially focus on the "proposed by all the major religions" or maybe you just posited that because you are speaking to a Muslim, intentionally.

So tell me. Is it not the definition of atheism that it is the belief in the absence of anything divine? Basically?
 

Mock Turtle

Oh my, did I say that!
Premium Member
I thought atheism was the absence of belief in theism or divinity.
Just different words for the same thing.
I didn't know that "often as to....." etc etc was part of the equation. So your personal agenda seems to be especially focus on the "proposed by all the major religions" or maybe you just posited that because you are speaking to a Muslim, intentionally.

So tell me. Is it not the definition of atheism that it is the belief in the absence of anything divine? Basically?
My words would be the same to all who might want to dictate as to religious beliefs in schools.

Not interested in getting into discussions as to what atheism means to you and might mean to others.
 

firedragon

Veteran Member
Just different words for the same thing.

Nope. You invented some words.

My words would be the same to all who might want to dictate as to religious beliefs in schools.

Not interested in getting into discussions as to what atheism means to you and might mean to others.

Yep. That's why you invented certain statements in order to do that.

You have some very extreme biases. Strange.
 

BilliardsBall

Veteran Member
There is a famous story told in Chassidic literature that addresses this very question. The Master teaches the student that God created everything in the world to be appreciated, since everything is here to teach us a lesson.

One clever student asks "What lesson can we learn from atheists? Why did God create them?"

The Master responds "God created atheists to teach us the most important lesson of them all - the lesson of true compassion. You see, when an atheist performs an act of charity, visits someone who is sick, helps someone in need, and cares for the world, he is not doing so because of some religious teaching. He does not believe that God commanded him to perform this act. In fact, he does not believe in God at all, so his acts are based on an inner sense of morality. And look at the kindness he can bestow upon others simply because he feels it to be right."

"This means," the Master continued "that when someone reaches out to you for help, you should never say 'I pray that God will help you.' Instead for the moment, you should become an atheist, imagine that there is no God who can help, and say 'I will help you.'"

ETA source: Tales of Hasidim Vol. 2 by Martin Bube

I LOVE this. It seems RF was made by God to help atheists toward the light. BLESSINGS!
 

wellwisher

Well-Known Member
There is a famous story told in Chassidic literature that addresses this very question. The Master teaches the student that God created everything in the world to be appreciated, since everything is here to teach us a lesson.

One clever student asks "What lesson can we learn from atheists? Why did God create them?"

The Master responds "God created atheists to teach us the most important lesson of them all - the lesson of true compassion. You see, when an atheist performs an act of charity, visits someone who is sick, helps someone in need, and cares for the world, he is not doing so because of some religious teaching. He does not believe that God commanded him to perform this act. In fact, he does not believe in God at all, so his acts are based on an inner sense of morality. And look at the kindness he can bestow upon others simply because he feels it to be right."

"This means," the Master continued "that when someone reaches out to you for help, you should never say 'I pray that God will help you.' Instead for the moment, you should become an atheist, imagine that there is no God who can help, and say 'I will help you.'"

ETA source: Tales of Hasidim Vol. 2 by Martin Bube

This affect of opposites is symbolically connected to the tree of knowledge of good and evil, law and original sin. Good and evil are the classic or original opposites. Theists and Atheists are also opposites, with the POV of each, sort of against the law of the other. An atheist cannot accept God nor can a theist deny God or they will violate the unwritten laws of their group belief.

This tendency for the human brain to polarize reality into a perception of opposites, is due to the CPU of the ego. This CPU subroutine wiring does not process data part of an integration, but rather divides reality into parts that appear to are opposite of each other. This is the foundation of reasoning, which itself has two distinct aspects in time and space, that are based on opposites; cause and affect. Law of good and evil came first.

This neural CPU of the ego, which subconsciously processes data for the conscious mind, has a tendency to divide reality into opposites; tree of knowledge of good and evil. We do not perceive reality as a unity, but will have an urge and tendency to redefine it in the context of opposites. If we say a certain food is good someone else will see it a yucky, to complete the set. The terrible two's of child develop where the word, "no" appears too often, may be when this CPU starts to kick in. It fixates on the opposite.

The belief in God will need to be opposed by no belief in God. The two polar opposite become part of the law for each, defining the other, as the antagonist to itself. It is a brain game that started with civilization and law. But this has been conditioned into humans, for so long that it appears to be innate. This seems to be connected to the way the left brain works, where the ego migrated, at the time of Adam and Eve; civilization. Instinct is more right brain and has a different way to process data; more 3-D.

Left brain is differential and right brain is more integral in terms of how data is processed. In math differentiation finds the slope of a curve at a given point. While integration finds the area under the curve from A to B. The slope, is based on the angle at a point on a curve, needs two coordinates (X,Y) that are different but connected.

One would need an update in the operating system of the brain, to leave this classic Satan CPU writing and migrate to the other core CPU that processes in 3-D, so opposites can be seen as parts of the whole; tree of life.

If you look at the two main political parties in the USA, they approach public service as opposites. They both are trying to help the common good, but each has a different view of the common good. They see each other as the enemy, thereby limiting their perception of what is the common good, based to their own polarized niche as one of the opposites. The same thing also occurs for the theist and the atheists. Faith places one in contact with the third alternative, since this connects us to the right brain.

If you look at love, such as in the family, love can overcome opposites. One can have two children who are total opposites. Rather than antagonize them and polarize them even more to the nth degree, love places them under the same umbrella of the family, as parts of the whole, that complement each other, to make the family complete. Love is not something one can do on command, but often it happens to you via fate, so this approach is not yet innate and/or continuous for most. The ego is still stuck in the left brain which has advantages; reason, but is also the source of polarizations within the subjectivity of human nature.

The primitive fear of novelty has a connection to this current ego CPU. When something new appears, there is no opposite, day one, since it is new and self standing. The CPU prefers it be defined in terms of a polarization. So it is no longer just new and exciting, but also old and scary to complete the opposite. The rewards of Heaven also has an opposite, which is the punishment of Hell. It is hard to have one without the other, since each set help to contrast, the other so we can differentiate it even better; better slope. The shadow side of the personality, that lies below the ego, follows us like our shadow from the sun. Within the light of the sun is the shadow so the 2-D is made complete; Satan CPU.
 

Mock Turtle

Oh my, did I say that!
Premium Member
Nope. You invented some words.



Yep. That's why you invented certain statements in order to do that.

You have some very extreme biases. Strange.
Having a religious belief like yours is probably worse as to bias, given you aren't open to many things, whilst I am at least somewhat agnostic as to the possibly of there being a God. :oops:
 

Mock Turtle

Oh my, did I say that!
Premium Member
That is irrelevant too. Your bias is so deeply instilled in you that you can't see logical fallacies or reason and logic. Too far gone.
Ta. I'll ponder that when it makes sense, but you still can't answer a simple issue - your belief trumping anything else and hence the worst of biases. :D
 

firedragon

Veteran Member
The bit after the dash - unless you don't see a belief in any one religion as not being a bias in any sense.

Lol. You think a belief is a bias?

Do you believe science is good? Is that a bias? Do you believe language is good? Is that a bias?

Let me tell you what a bias is. Without any research, dismissing other peoples research simply because "he is a theist" is bias. Haha. Your argument is so lame. If someone believes his religion is the ultimate truth, that's bias? :) Nope. In that case, you have to provide research and study upon study to prove that all are in fact equal and if the claimant has not done any study whatsoever, and even looking at your extensive research, still refuses, then that could be called bias.

When you let go of your fanatical bias, you might understand simple things.
 

MikeF

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
I didn't say "yes". But okay. Let's say I grant you that. So what?

If one can exercise reason and logic and still be biased, then reason and logic alone are not a shield to bias. You have indicated that research and study are ways to mitigate bias, but how do you know the material you are studying is not biased in some way, or that you are selective in the material in which you study?

Bias is a psychological phenomena that we all exhibit to some extent or another. What is a pernicious attribute of bias is that it has its strongest influence with strongly held beliefs or strongly desired outcomes. If there is a strong emotional component to a belief, the odds are high that bias is present and reason and logic will not be effective.

One can feel that they are being objective, yet subconsciously they will be selective in the information they consider, discount or dismiss information contrary to the belief, or interpret ambiguous information in a way that benefits their belief.

Absent being an outside observer, completely disinterested in any particular outcome, we must have strategies to help identify and guard against any bias we may exhibit.

I am suggesting that relying on reason, logic, research, and study is insufficient to guard against or mitigate bias.
 

Evangelicalhumanist

"Truth" isn't a thing...
Premium Member
This affect of opposites is symbolically connected to the tree of knowledge of good and evil, law and original sin. Good and evil are the classic or original opposites. Theists and Atheists are also opposites, with the POV of each, sort of against the law of the other. An atheist cannot accept God nor can a theist deny God or they will violate the unwritten laws of their group belief.

This tendency for the human brain to polarize reality into a perception of opposites, is due to the CPU of the ego. This CPU subroutine wiring does not process data part of an integration, but rather divides reality into parts that appear to are opposite of each other. This is the foundation of reasoning, which itself has two distinct aspects in time and space, that are based on opposites; cause and affect. Law of good and evil came first.

This neural CPU of the ego, which subconsciously processes data for the conscious mind, has a tendency to divide reality into opposites; tree of knowledge of good and evil. We do not perceive reality as a unity, but will have an urge and tendency to redefine it in the context of opposites. If we say a certain food is good someone else will see it a yucky, to complete the set. The terrible two's of child develop where the word, "no" appears too often, may be when this CPU starts to kick in. It fixates on the opposite.

The belief in God will need to be opposed by no belief in God. The two polar opposite become part of the law for each, defining the other, as the antagonist to itself. It is a brain game that started with civilization and law. But this has been conditioned into humans, for so long that it appears to be innate. This seems to be connected to the way the left brain works, where the ego migrated, at the time of Adam and Eve; civilization. Instinct is more right brain and has a different way to process data; more 3-D.

Left brain is differential and right brain is more integral in terms of how data is processed. In math differentiation finds the slope of a curve at a given point. While integration finds the area under the curve from A to B. The slope, is based on the angle at a point on a curve, needs two coordinates (X,Y) that are different but connected.

One would need an update in the operating system of the brain, to leave this classic Satan CPU writing and migrate to the other core CPU that processes in 3-D, so opposites can be seen as parts of the whole; tree of life.

If you look at the two main political parties in the USA, they approach public service as opposites. They both are trying to help the common good, but each has a different view of the common good. They see each other as the enemy, thereby limiting their perception of what is the common good, based to their own polarized niche as one of the opposites. The same thing also occurs for the theist and the atheists. Faith places one in contact with the third alternative, since this connects us to the right brain.

If you look at love, such as in the family, love can overcome opposites. One can have two children who are total opposites. Rather than antagonize them and polarize them even more to the nth degree, love places them under the same umbrella of the family, as parts of the whole, that complement each other, to make the family complete. Love is not something one can do on command, but often it happens to you via fate, so this approach is not yet innate and/or continuous for most. The ego is still stuck in the left brain which has advantages; reason, but is also the source of polarizations within the subjectivity of human nature.

The primitive fear of novelty has a connection to this current ego CPU. When something new appears, there is no opposite, day one, since it is new and self standing. The CPU prefers it be defined in terms of a polarization. So it is no longer just new and exciting, but also old and scary to complete the opposite. The rewards of Heaven also has an opposite, which is the punishment of Hell. It is hard to have one without the other, since each set help to contrast, the other so we can differentiate it even better; better slope. The shadow side of the personality, that lies below the ego, follows us like our shadow from the sun. Within the light of the sun is the shadow so the 2-D is made complete; Satan CPU.
Um....you don't say!? :shrug:
 
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