Why did Jesus die again?

[javajo]

For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life. Romans 5:10

 

[Blackdog22]

For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life. Romans 5:10

This doesn't answer anything Java. Saved from what? It can't be sin since we know that sin has physical properties. If its an invisible sin then please explain why we needed saving from an invisible sin that never harmed us to begin with. Also could you explain what this invisible sin is.

 

[Midnight Pete]

This doesn't answer anything Java. Saved from what? It can't be sin since we know that sin has physical properties. If its an invisible sin then please explain why we needed saving from an invisible sin that never harmed us to begin with. Also could you explain what this invisible sin is.

Sin doesn't have physical properties. It's a concept. Concepts are invisible.

How is it that you are so literal-minded?

 

[waitasec]

I wouldn't say that.

that's what i get...
luuucy, you got some essplaining to do....

 

[Midnight Pete]

that's what i get...
luuucy, you got some essplaining to do....

Whatever.

 

[waitasec]

Whatever.

oh come on. really.

you seem to think that god didn't want us to disobey.
what i am trying to get across is that when we think for ourselves is when we disobey. but you don't believe that to be the case, why? how can you back up this notion of yours? where in the bible does it say, "think for yourself"?

 

[waitasec]

According the the myth Jesus never died at all. He cheated death and was brought back to life. In other words, it wasn't a sacrifice at all. More like Jesus had a bad day.

that's an interesting thought.
if jesus was god, he knew he wouldn't die...he's god after all. so you're right. jesus didn't die for our sins...because he didn't die.
pretzel logic.

 

[Midnight Pete]

oh come on. really.

you seem to think that god didn't want us to disobey.
what i am trying to get across is that when we think for ourselves is when we disobey. but you don't believe that to be the case, why? how can you back up this notion of yours? where in the bible does it say, "think for yourself"?

I don't know. I never think for myself.

 

[Nothing]

I often wonder about the idea that Jesus actually died for our sins. I am even more curious as to why people actually believe he accomplished that..

When talking about the reason why Christ had to die we need to go back to Genesis where the original sin took place. It is said that sin was brought in by a perfect man(Adam) and thus a perfect man(Jesus) was needed to take away that original sin. However, this is obviously not so.

When discussing whether Jesus actually took away the original sin I often ask people whether they actually know what the original sin was. The original sin according to Genesis included: Death, Pain in Childbirth, Snakes Eating Dirt and Losing Their Legs, A need work for our food, and the Earth being cursed; which many assume to mean natural disasters.

So we look around us and what do we notice. Do people still die? Yes. Do women still have pain during Birth? Yes, less so with drugs though. Do we have to work for food? Yes. Do Natural Disasters Exist? Yes. Then finally the double whammy, apparently if Jesus died for our sins then snakes not eating dirt would make sense, but their legs not growing back and the above "after effects" of the original sin still being present make very little sense.

If Jesus died for any sins it definitely wasn't the sins the Bible refers to in Genesis. So why did Jesus die again?

I do not beliieve that Jesus literally died for our sins. He died, was buried, and rose again. His point was to prove the ressurection. His point was to prove that life is eternal beyond this physical world and beyond the perception of sin. "To conquer death, all you need to do is die." is what He said. It is true in a literal sense. After you are dead, regardless of where this may be, you have in fact moved past death and therefore conquered it. But to conquer death in life? You need only let die the concept of death. Jesus tried to show us that we are by design eternal. He tried to teach us that our physical death is an illusion. We do not die, we only change in form.

 

[waitasec]

I don't know. I never think for myself.

yes you do.
you still sin don't you?

 

[waitasec]

I do not beliieve that Jesus literally died for our sins. He died, was buried, and rose again. His point was to prove the ressurection. His point was to prove that life is eternal beyond this physical world and beyond the perception of sin. "To conquer death, all you need to do is die." is what He said. It is true in a literal sense. After you are dead, regardless of where this may be, you have in fact moved past death and therefore conquered it. But to conquer death in life? You need only let die the concept of death. Jesus tried to show us that we are by design eternal. He tried to teach us that our physical death is an illusion. We do not die, we only change in form.

if his point was to prove eternal life was possible then why did he have to die in the first place?

we die. fade to black. the end.
and at that moment of finality in our consciousness, what will be the last thought?
"i hope i made it to heaven"
or
"this was a good life"

 

[Nothing]

if his point was to prove eternal life was possible then why did he have to die in the first place?

The point is He didn't die. Yes, His physical body died, But HE did not. That was his point. The problem with proving this is that proof requires physical evidence. It is impossible to prove what is eternal for eternity is beyond the physical. In other words, it is impossible to even contemplate eternal life if one can only attempt to do so from the perspective that what cannot be physically proven does not exist.

 

[waitasec]

In other words, it is impossible to even contemplate eternal life if one can only attempt to do so from the perspective that what cannot be physically proven does not exist.

how convenient.

 

[Nothing]

how convenient.

That's pretty funny, waitasec, but it is not a convenience, it is a fact. I'll put it to you this way: When contemplating beyond what can be physically proven, we liberate ourselves from the burden of proof. No doubt this sounds even MORE convenient!!
My point is, I try not to prove anything, and I try to avoid looking for proof of anything. I empasize TRY because freedom from proof in a world that demands it is very challenging indeed!

 

[waitasec]

That's pretty funny, waitasec, but it is not a convenience, it is a fact. I'll put it to you this way: When contemplating beyond what can be physically proven, we liberate ourselves from the burden of proof. No doubt this sounds even MORE convenient!!
My point is, I try not to prove anything, and I try to avoid looking for proof of anything. I empasize TRY because freedom from proof from a world that demands it is very challenging indeed!

contemplating death, a concept that is the antithesis of our reality, will require imagination which is limitless.

 

[Nothing]

contemplating death, a concept that is the antithesis of our reality, will require imagination which is limitless.

Well put!! You understand what I'm saying quite well.
Contemplating death, or more accurately , contemplating NO death does require imagination. Imagination is in fact limitless, however as individuals we do place limits on what we will allow ourselves to imagine. Some of us don't allow ourselves to imagine what cannot be proven, and others do. The choice is entirely ours to make.

 

[PolyHedral]

Contemplating a lack of death is trivial: Imagine that no-one ages.

 

[Nothing]

Contemplating a lack of death is trivial: Imagine that no-one ages.

Contemplating a lack of death IS trivial if you imagine no one ages because it is a contemplation from a physical perspective. It is my understanding that life itself, or life Energy is eternal and never changes. The only thing that changes is the physical expression of this energy. That which is physical is finite. It begins and ends. The Energy that is life itself does not die, it moves on. Quite simply, I believe that this Energy is more real then our physical bodies are.

 

[idea]

Jesus died to satisfy justice...

consider this:

“There was a boy fighting in the Union Forces. 19 years old. Went to sleep on guard duty. And the opposition broke through and wiped out a whole flank of the army. Several hundred were killed, including some of the best friends of this young man. But he survived. Court-martialed. Sentenced to die. He expected to die. He thought it was only just that he die. And president Lincoln was ready to sign his death warrant for his execution and a little mother appears on the scene.
She says, “President Lincoln, when this war started, I had a husband and six sons. First I lost my husband, and one by one I lost five of my sons. Now I only have one son left and he’s sentenced to be executed with a firing squad because he went to sleep. He feels awfully badly, he lost some of his best friends and he expects to die. President Lincoln, I’m not asking for the sparing of this boy’s life for his sake, but for his mother’s sake. He’s all I have left. For my sake could you spare him?” President Lincoln said, “For your sake, little mother, I will spare him.” And as far as I know President Lincoln was never criticized for that decision.”

Why was Pres L not criticized? Why was it just for the 19yo to be let off the hook? It was just because a sacrifice was made... same for Jesus... we can be let off the hook, because a sacrifice was made.

 

[lunamoth]

Jesus died because he was human, and humans die.