• Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

Why did WTC 7 Collapse from fire but not Grenfell Tower?

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
What? How did there get to be no resistance from the lower part of the building? Where did the steel structure beneath the free-falling portion go?

What computer models are you talking about? NIST's hand-inputted model didn't resemble the fall of WTC 7 whatsoever.

And you chose a rather poor video. Other videos do show the distortion. This one appears to be by a troofer and at about 1:40 you see the first collapse and you can see the distortion that your video claims does not exist:

 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
I don't suppose anyone here is able to account for A36, noted in FEMA's report. NIST was unable to account for these high temperatures in WTC 7, and and didn't mention A36.
That was explained to. Fires that burned for hours with any way to fight them. The sprinklers failed since there was no water due to the collapse of the Twin Towers cutting the water line. I do believe the diesel fuel for the building's generators may have played a role as well.
 

Nous

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
The structural steel could not put up significant resistance any longer.
Suddenly there was no building beneath the upper portion that was falling. What happened to the building beneath while the upper portion was falling 105 feet? Provide those repeatable experiments.

Explain why NIST's model didn't resemble the real building.
 

Nous

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
That was explained to. Fires that burned for hours with any way to fight them. The sprinklers failed since there was no water due to the collapse of the Twin Towers cutting the water line. I do believe the diesel fuel for the building's generators may have played a role as well.
NIST disagrees with you, and did not mention A36. Are you going to read the NIST report that you linked to at some point?
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
So again I will ask: So you think that there was no conspiracy involved in the events of 9/11, that 19 young men all independently decided to hijack commercial airliners and fly them into buildings on the same morning?
Badly formed question. They did not do so "independently".
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
NIST disagrees with you, and did not mention A36. Are you going to read the NIST report that you linked to at some point?

How do they disagree with me? So far I have only seen you not understanding their work.

I think that you were confused about the video that you looked at. The NIST says they interior collapsed first. The shell is what you see collapse at "free fall speed". By that time the interior was already down. This video makes it clearer and shows the collapse from the start. Almost no videos by the conspiracy theorists show the collapse from the start, something that you should think about:

 

Nous

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
How do they disagree with me?
On just about everything you've said so far. For instance, NIST plainly states that fuel oil fires from the emergency generators "did not play a role in the collapse of WTC 7. The worst-case scenarios associated with fires being fed by the ruptured fuel lines (a) could not have been sustained long enough, or could not have generated sufficient heat, to raise the temperature of the critical interior column to the point of significant loss of strength or stiffness, or (b) would have produced large amounts of visible smoke that would have emanated from the exhaust louvers. No such smoke discharge was observed."

NIST does not attempt to account for the free-fall of WTC 7, period. NIST does not attempt to account for the free-fall rate of collapse of WTC 7 with any mumbo-jumbo about the interior disappearing.

NIST does not attempt to account for A36.

And NIST's hand-inputted computer simulation does not resemble the drop of WTC 7.

So far I have only seen you not understanding their work.
Quote whatever you are referring to I have demonstrated a lack of understanding about.
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
On just about everything you've said so far. For instance, NIST plainly states that fuel oil fires from the emergency generators "did not play a role in the collapse of WTC 7. The worst-case scenarios associated with fires being fed by the ruptured fuel lines (a) could not have been sustained long enough, or could not have generated sufficient heat, to raise the temperature of the critical interior column to the point of significant loss of strength or stiffness, or (b) would have produced large amounts of visible smoke that would have emanated from the exhaust louvers. No such smoke discharge was observed."

Okay, you probably have a point there.

NIST does not attempt to account for the free-fall of WTC 7, period. NIST does not attempt to account for the free-fall rate of collapse of WTC 7 with any mumbo-jumbo about the interior disappearing.

But they did. The model explains that very well.

NIST does not attempt to account for A36.

What makes you say that?

And NIST's hand-inputted computer simulation does not resemble the drop of WTC 7.

I don't think you understand how the computer simulation was made and of course it matches. It matches very well.

Quote whatever you are referring to I have demonstrated a lack of understanding about.

Not bothering to since you have not supported any of your claims except for the first, and that one I said I was not sure on.
 

Nous

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
NIST does not attempt to account for the free-fall of WTC 7, period. NIST does not attempt to account for the free-fall rate of collapse of WTC 7 with any mumbo-jumbo about the interior disappearing.
But they did.
Then quote it.

NIST does not attempt to account for A36.
What makes you say that?
The fact that the NIST report does not mention A36 is the first clue.

I don't think you understand how the computer simulation was made
Again, quote whatever it is in the NIST that you claim I have demonstrated a lack of understanding about.

and of course it matches.
Not only does the hand-inputed NIST simulation not resemble the sudden drop of the roof line, the simulation does not fall at free-fall rate.
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
NIST disagrees with you, and did not mention A36. Are you going to read the NIST report that you linked to at some point?
Why do they need to mention A36? Do you think that they were unaware of what kind of structural steel was in the building? Seriously? The main cause of the collapse appears to be from thermal expansion. The building cooked for hours and that is the only time a building of that size with an internal fire burned uncontrolled for seven hours.


The interior frame had collapsed before the exterior shell came down. There were no support columns to slow it down at that point in time.
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
Then quote it.

The fact that the NIST report does not mention A36 is the first clue.

Again, quote whatever it is in the NIST that you claim I have demonstrated a lack of understanding about.

Not only does the hand-inputed NIST simulation not resemble the sudden drop of the roof line, the simulation does not fall at free-fall rate.
I would have to quote the whole article it appears and without a copy and paste I am not about to do that. That they did not mention A36 is merely a red herring on your part. I asked you why it was important and you had no answer.
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
What is "poorly worded" or "misleading" about this question: Do you agree that the events of 9/11 were the result of a conspiracy?
You have been trying to use equivocation fallacies by tying a conspiracy that we know happened to one that we know did not happen.
 

exchemist

Veteran Member
And I probably do not have to point out to a chemist that a beam painted with "nano-thermite" would have "nano-results":D

(nano of course being the prefix meaning "billionth" for those that did not know).
Is that what they said? Must admit I took one look at the journal and stopped reading. But how funny.
 

Nous

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
Why do they need to mention A36? Do you think that they were unaware of what kind of structural steel was in the building? Seriously? The main cause of the collapse appears to be from thermal expansion. The building cooked for hours and that is the only time a building of that size with an internal fire burned uncontrolled for seven hours.
Are you not able to read or do you just not want to inform yourself about what is in the NIST report you linked to? NIST's worse-case scenario for the fire temperature in WTC 7 is less than one-third that required to produce A36.
 
Top