Why Don't Others Try To Conquer The World?

[Valjean]

I've got my eyes on those Unitarian Universalists

 

[Rick O'Shez]

Are they cowards or what?

Probably just too laid back.

 

[JoStories]

Like what Muslims did to Europe in the dark ages.

Christians did much the same during that time frame as well. You seem to be showing a bias here. Or do you deny the Inquisition, the Crusades and the burning of witches by alleged well meaning Christians? Or how about what alleged missionaries have done to cultures and continue to do so even now.

 

[FearGod]

Christians did much the same during that time frame as well. You seem to be showing a bias here. Or do you deny the Inquisition, the Crusades and the burning of witches by alleged well meaning Christians? Or how about what alleged missionaries have done to cultures and continue to do so even now.

Muslims built civilization in Spain whereas the Crusades destroyed the civilization in the region that they occupied.

 

[Augustus]

Muslims built civilization in Spain

Lucky for them that they managed to conquer some cultured and knowledgable empires in the Persians and Romans so that the Arabs started to learn about architecture, construction, science, education, philosophy, etc. The Grand Tent of Cordoba would be less impressive after all.

Europe went backwards largely due to the decline of the Roman Empire and Arab conquests cutting them off from the more lucrative areas of world trade. With declining social conditions religious belief became more extreme and a downward spiral started.

The Muslims, controlling the entire fertile crescent then had the money to fund the arts and sciences and build on the knowledge of the Greeks, Romans, Persians, Chinese, Indians, etc. A rich and successful, multicultural society grew and flourished.

The Arab Golden Age ended when the Arabs ran out of money. The Mongol conquests and changes in international trade meant that the Muslims were no longer awash with money, Europe was again growing wealthy and along with this came scientific and social advancement. The Europeans had the money and facilities to build on the advances made during the Arab Golden Age, just as the Muslims had built on the works of those who came before them.

The Muslims went backwards again, just as the Europeans had done centuries before, until they got so far behind that they were colonised.

People like to construct fancy reasons for the rise and fall of the Golden Age. It started because of Islam valuing knowledge, and declined because of people like al-Ghazali and ibn-Tamiyya making Islam regressive. It's really just about the money though. Societies do well when they have a lot of it and less so when they don't.

It's just as likely that Islam was open and tolerant because of the success of the society, rather than the society was a success because of the openness and tolerance of Islam. With societal decline came the increased popularity of bigoted and insular hardliners like ibn-Taymiyya

History is cyclical, not linear. All cultures borrow from the knowledge and skills of others. As I said earlier, it's silly to look at one snapshot from history as being this special magical time that was better than all the others. They are all important and interconnected. It's like a chain, take one link out and it no longer works. Trying to say that any particular link is the 'best' is just narrow-minded parochialism.

 

[FearGod]

Lucky for them that they managed to conquer some cultured and knowledgable empires in the Persians and Romans so that the Arabs started to learn about architecture, construction, science, education, philosophy, etc. The Grand Tent of Cordoba would be less impressive after all.

Europe went backwards largely due to the decline of the Roman Empire and Arab conquests cutting them off from the more lucrative areas of world trade. With declining social conditions religious belief became more extreme and a downward spiral started.

The Muslims, controlling the entire fertile crescent then had the money to fund the arts and sciences and build on the knowledge of the Greeks, Romans, Persians, Chinese, Indians, etc. A rich and successful, multicultural society grew and flourished.

The Arab Golden Age ended when the Arabs ran out of money. The Mongol conquests and changes in international trade meant that the Muslims were no longer awash with money, Europe was again growing wealthy and along with this came scientific and social advancement. The Europeans had the money and facilities to build on the advances made during the Arab Golden Age, just as the Muslims had built on the works of those who came before them.

The Muslims went backwards again, just as the Europeans had done centuries before, until they got so far behind that they were colonised.

People like to construct fancy reasons for the rise and fall of the Golden Age. It started because of Islam valuing knowledge, and declined because of people like al-Ghazali and ibn-Tamiyya making Islam regressive. It's really just about the money though. Societies do well when they have a lot of it and less so when they don't.

It's just as likely that Islam was open and tolerant because of the success of the society, rather than the society was a success because of the openness and tolerance of Islam. With societal decline came the increased popularity of bigoted and insular hardliners like ibn-Taymiyya

History is cyclical, not linear. All cultures borrow from the knowledge and skills of others. As I said earlier, it's silly to look at one snapshot from history as being this special magical time that was better than all the others. They are all important and interconnected. It's like a chain, take one link out and it no longer works. Trying to say that any particular link is the 'best' is just narrow-minded parochialism.

I didn't say that Muslims were the only civilization that valued knowledge and education but my
point is that they conveyed science to Spain and civilization rather than destruction.

 

[JoStories]

Muslims built civilization in Spain whereas the Crusades destroyed the civilization in the region that they occupied.

Agreed but that was my point. You stated :
FearGod said: ↑
Like what Muslims did to Europe in the dark ages" in response to the OP. My point was the Christian hands are far from clean in this drive to conquer the world, insofar as it pertains to making the Church the only faith the world needed.

 

[Augustus]

they conveyed science to Spain and civilization rather than destruction.

I think that the Muslim armies brought some degree of destruction, during the conquest and when they were raiding into the Frankish kingdoms to the north for example.

Violent invasions are just that, violent. Just because the society that they established was successful, and comparatively tolerant and advanced doesn't mean that they arrived bearing gifts and flowers.

The Romans, for example, added to societies wherever they arrived, they certainly brought a fair degree of destruction with them also. Same with the Muslims.

And Spain wasn't quite as 'backward' as you think before the Muslims arrived. It had been part of the Roman Empire for 700 years until the Visigoths conquered it. The great Roman philosopher Seneca was born in Cordoba 650 years before the Muslims arrived for example.

 

[FearGod]

I think that the Muslim armies brought some degree of destruction, during the conquest and when they were raiding into the Frankish kingdoms to the north for example.

Violent invasions are just that, violent. Just because the society that they established was successful, and comparatively tolerant and advanced doesn't mean that they arrived bearing gifts and flowers.

The Romans, for example, added to societies wherever they arrived, they certainly brought a fair degree of destruction with them also. Same with the Muslims.

And Spain wasn't quite as 'backward' as you think before the Muslims arrived. It had been part of the Roman Empire for 700 years until the Visigoths conquered it. The great Roman philosopher Seneca was born in Cordoba 650 years before the Muslims arrived for example.

What evidences, ruins, scientists and achievements that proves that Spain was not "backward" before
the arrival of Muslims to Spain.

 

[Augustus]

What evidences, ruins, scientists and achievements that proves that Spain was not "backward" before
the arrival of Muslims to Spain.

Roman Emperors such as Hadrian and Theodoseus came from Roman Hispania. Famous philosophers like Seneca the Younger and seneca the Elder.

They weren't just some savages living in mud huts...

 

[FearGod]

Roman Emperors such as Hadrian and Theodoseus came from Roman Hispania. Famous philosophers like Seneca the Younger and seneca the Elder.

They weren't just some savages living in mud huts...

A dishonest work of you and i don't know why you needed to do so.

This construction (below) is a new construction and was built only in the 19th century

http://powerpictures.crystalgraphic...built_transport_water_19th_century_still_used

This one (below) was built in Egypt during the ancient Greek between AD 956 and 1323
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lighthouse_of_Alexandria

This one (below) was built in Jordan (138-161 CE)

This one below was built in Spain not known when exactly but expectation is (AD 81-96)

 

[gnostic]

Wait what? Muslims never took over Europe... Now a great example would be the Mongols and Baghdad.

No, they didn't take whole of Europe, but they take much of south east Europe.

You are forgetting the Ottoman Turks, taking Constantinople, and then continuing west into the Balkan, and then into Central Europe. Centuries of wars, between Turks and German-Austrian.

 

[Augustus]

A dishonest work of you and i don't know why you needed to do so.

I think you are a bit confused...

This construction (below) is a new construction and was built only in the 19th century

Sorry, this one was wrongly labelled on the site. My mistake.

The final picture is of a similar Aqueduct anyway so it's hardly a game changer. The Romans built numerous Aqueducts.

This one (below) was built in Egypt during the ancient Greek between AD 956 and 1323
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lighthouse_of_Alexandria

I'm not quite sure how many face palms I can fit into the same reply. Just assume there are A LOT of them though...

The Lighthouse of Alexandria was destroyed by earthquakes 600 years ago, as such it is quite difficult to post a photo of it. Those dates you posted were when it was DESTROYED.

You do know that it was one of the 7 wonders of the world, don't you? Built over 2000 years ago.

The lighthouse I posted is https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tower_of_Hercules , a UNESCO World Heritage site in Galicia

This one (below) was built in Jordan (138-161 CE)

That's nice, but I didn't post a picture of that, I posted a picture of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_Theatre_(Mérida) , another UNECO world heritage site.

This one below was built in Spain not known when exactly but expectation is (AD 81-96)

And...? It was built by the Romans in Spain which is what I was talking about...

Spain was part of the Roman Empire, and the Romans were a pretty advanced civilisation. Do you think that they didn't bother to build anything there for the 500 years they owned it?

 

[FearGod]

I think you are a bit confused...




Sorry, this one was wrongly labelled on the site. My mistake.

The final picture is of a similar Aqueduct anyway so it's hardly a game changer. The Romans built numerous Aqueducts.



I'm not quite sure how many face palms I can fit into the same reply. Just assume there are A LOT of them though...

The Lighthouse of Alexandria was destroyed by earthquakes 600 years ago, as such it is quite difficult to post a photo of it.

That lighthouse is https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tower_of_Hercules , a UNESCO World Heritage site in Galicia



That's nice, but I didn't post a picture of that, I posted a picture of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_Theatre_(Mérida) , another UNECO world heritage site.



And...? It was built by the Romans in Spain which is what I was talking about...

Spain was part of the Roman Empire, and the Romans were a pretty advanced civilisation. Do you think that they didn't bother to build anything there for the 500 years they owned it?

My question was clear and which is what proofs you got that Spain wasn't (backward) when Muslims arrived,
that means evidences should be between 8th and 10th century.

Do you got any ?

 

[Augustus]

My question was clear and which is what proofs you got that Spain wasn't (backward) when Muslims arrived,
that means evidences should be between 8th and 10th century.

Do you got any ?

The problem is you have this comicbook simple view of history of Super Muslims and Europeans living in mud huts

When the 'backward' Arabs took over the 'civilised' Roman and Persian Empires, what happened to these advanced societies? Did they crumble and disappear overnight or did the Arabs learn from them?

The Roman cities didn't vanish when the Visigoths conquered them either. The people living in the cities didn't suddenly forget all of their knowledge

Were the nomadic Berber tribesmen who helped conquer Spain more 'civilised' than people living in modern cities like Toledo and Cordoba?

Regarding The Grand Mosque "It is an architectural hybrid that joins together many of the artistic values of East and West and includes elements hitherto unheard-of in Islamic religious architecture, including the use of double arches to support the roof. The direct forerunners to this can be found in the Los Milagros (Miracles) Aqueduct in Merida. Its building techniques - the use of stone with brick - were a novelty reusing and integrating Roman/Visigoth techniques."

There were probably countless non-Muslims who helped build it.

During the golden age, the Muslim Empire was more advanced than Western Europe as it was much richer and had the opportunity to build on the knowledge of the Greeks Romans and Persians. Western Europe was nowhere near as 'backward' as you think it was though, read a bit of history.

 

[FearGod]

The problem is you have this comicbook simple view of history of Super Muslims and Europeans living in mud huts

When the 'backward' Arabs took over the 'civilised' Roman and Persian Empires, what happened to these advanced societies? Did they crumble and disappear overnight or did the Arabs learn from them?

The Roman cities didn't vanish when the Visigoths conquered them either. The people living in the cities didn't suddenly forget all of their knowledge

Were the nomadic Berber tribesmen who helped conquer Spain more 'civilised' than people living in modern cities like Toledo and Cordoba?

Regarding The Grand Mosque "It is an architectural hybrid that joins together many of the artistic values of East and West and includes elements hitherto unheard-of in Islamic religious architecture, including the use of double arches to support the roof. The direct forerunners to this can be found in the Los Milagros (Miracles) Aqueduct in Merida. Its building techniques - the use of stone with brick - were a novelty reusing and integrating Roman/Visigoth techniques."

There were probably countless non-Muslims who helped build it.

During the golden age, the Muslim Empire was more advanced than Western Europe as it was much richer and had the opportunity to build on the knowledge of the Greeks Romans and Persians. Western Europe was nowhere near as 'backward' as you think it was though, read a bit of history.

The history says they were in the dark ages, i asked you for evidences and not to write a composition.

 

[Augustus]

The history says they were in the dark ages,

Might want to read up about that, even if you just read the wikipedia page and you would know 100 times more than you do now.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark_Ages_(historiography)

i asked you for evidences and not to write a composition.

You don't really understand the concept of either 'evidence' or 'history' which is the problem.

How for example, do you explain the idea that the Mosque of Cordoba contained 'Visigothic techniques' if they were living in their mud huts at the time? Where do you imagine the stonemasons who built such 'Visigothic techniques' came from? What about the arches in the Mosque based on Roman architecture? Who built them? The Berbers?

[this, btw, is evidence]

 

[paarsurrey]

Religions don't try to conquer the world...psychopaths do. Psychopaths who use religion to abuse others...try to 'conquer' the world. If you are at peace in your life, you have no need to conquer anyone, let alone the world.

I agree with you.
The truthful religions has nothing to do with conquering the world or occupying lands and territories. The truthful religions wins the hearts and souls of the humans.
Regards

 

[The Emperor of Mankind]

Roman emperor Hadrian stopped expanding and fortified the borders; Scotland wasn't worth it.

Just another case of wine-drinkers experiencing sour grapes.

 

[David1967]

Yea , like what dinosaurs did before that.

The dinosaurs did have a good run......but I have no idea what religion they were. Saurapodian perhaps?