Why "Feminist" and Not "Egalitarian"?

[Debater Slayer]

What are your reasons for calling yourself a "feminist" rather than an "egalitarian"? If you believe that feminism stands for gender equality, why wouldn't the label "egalitarian" suffice to express your stance on gender equality?

Please remember not to bash outsiders in an exclusive forum section. Thank you.

 

[Iti oj]

What are your reasons for calling yourself a "feminist" rather than an "egalitarian"? If you believe that feminism stands for gender equality, why wouldn't the label "egalitarian" suffice to express your stance on gender equality?

Please remember not to bash outsiders in an exclusive forum section. Thank you.

I identify as both. I use feminism as it represents are particular problem that needs to be addressed . Feminism is also a more readily recognized name. Also as a show is support why quarrel over titles

 

[Quintessence]

As with Iti, I would use both. Though a term that conveys "stands up in support of minority or disempowered groups being abused by the majority and the powerful" would be the most accurate. It's about raising up the disenfranchised to the same level as others, rather than taking those in power down a peg. If that makes sense?

 

[crossfire]

I use both labels as well. When you consider an egalitarian issue such as human trafficking, it is very much a feminist issue as well.

 

[MysticSang'ha]

What are your reasons for calling yourself a "feminist" rather than an "egalitarian"? If you believe that feminism stands for gender equality, why wouldn't the label "egalitarian" suffice to express your stance on gender equality?

Please remember not to bash outsiders in an exclusive forum section. Thank you.

The term itself as "egalitarian" does not recognize the gender specific struggles cis and trans women experience. It's an overall term for equality but does not address the important and pertinent details like feminism does.

 

[Sunstone]

From a marketing standpoint, early feminists should perhaps have named the movement "egalitarianism" since the term "feminist" seems to mislead large numbers of people in several ways. For instance, it lends itself to the misconception that only women are feminists, or that feminism promotes female supremacy.

Having said that, I guess we're stuck with "feminism".

 

[Shadow Wolf]

My default approach is egalitarianism. However, there is no one movement or philosophy that can realistically keep up with the struggles faced by all the different groups. I am a feminist because feminism specifically addresses issues faced by women.

 

[Riverwolf]

I tend to think of "egalitarianism" as kind of an umbrella term, underneath which are the various movements which focus on more specific marginalized groups, among which is feminism. There's definitely a lot of overlap between the various egalitarian movements, but the problems faced by different marginalized groups are also distinct enough to necessitate distinct movements for them.

 

[Iti oj]

Well that was a unified group of replies wow

 

[Erebus]

What are your reasons for calling yourself a "feminist" rather than an "egalitarian"? If you believe that feminism stands for gender equality, why wouldn't the label "egalitarian" suffice to express your stance on gender equality?

Please remember not to bash outsiders in an exclusive forum section. Thank you.

For a long while, I actually didn't call myself a feminist. I felt that feminism gives people the wrong impression. I don't see why anybody should be discriminated because of their sex, gender identity, ethnicity, sexual preferences etc. It was only after discussing it with a friend that I came to appreciate the term "feminist."

The break down of that conversation went something like this:

I explained my stance based on what I wrote above.
She asked me, "Well, do you believe that men and women are equal in terms of societal, political and economic issues?"
I said, "No."
"Who's lagging behind the most then?"
"Women."
"So is it not fair to say that, although there are areas where men are disadvantaged, women need more done to make them equal?"
"Yes... that's fair."
"So is feminism really such a bad term?"
"I guess not."

So sure, I believe in equal opportunity for everybody. That doesn't mean I'm not also a feminist.

 

[Wherenextcolumbus]

I think what most folks around here don't seem to understand is that a large portion of feminist theory and history is centred around female liberation from patriarchy and not equality of the sexes. Although equality is part of it, the context is female centred. Feminism and Womanism are two of my favourite words.

 

[Riverwolf]

I think what most folks around here don't seem to understand is that a large portion of feminist theory and history is centred around female liberation from patriarchy and not equality of the sexes.

"Liberation from patriarchy" means "equality of the sexes."

 

[Wherenextcolumbus]

"Liberation from patriarchy" means "equality of the sexes."

Not if the standard of equality is a patriarchal male standard.
There is making women into priests and there is abandoning the church all together.

 

[Riverwolf]

Not if the standard of equality is a patriarchal male standard.
There is making women into priests and there is abandoning the church all together.

There is, and has always been, disagreements within feminism about what that equality looks like.

I think a more secular example is the issue of pornography. There are feminists who believe porn is inherently demeaning, and therefore can never exist in a feminist context; and there's feminists who believe porn is not inherently demeaning, and that it's largely "mainstream"/"male-gaze" porn which is. Both ideas are well within a feminist paradigm.

Another example of what you're talking about, I think, is in the topic of feminism in media: how to depict fictional women. There's an idea called "man with boobs" (no, really), which basically posits that simply writing a male character and gender-flipping before release isn't proper representation. Having a female body inherently changes how a person is going to experience life, after all, and this should be represented. And yet a MtF gender-flipped character might still be empowering for non-binary/trans people.

That's not even getting into the issues of "white feminism/intersectional feminism", or feminism in different cultures.

It's a question of what we, as feminists, believe equality and liberation from patriarchy look like. In my experience, "liberation from patriarchy" and "equality of the sexes" have been used interchangably, and that is what I meant.

 

[ADigitalArtist]

The difference between equality and equity differentiates the modern use of feminism vs the modern use of equitarianism(obviously with some exception based on interpretation). The former of which acknowledges the disadvantages women have and giving appropriate resources to bring women (including trans women who I believe to be the most disadvantaged) to the same level of opportunities as men. The latter of which focuses on distributing resources equally but not giving more resources to more disadvantaged.
Here is an image which helps illustrate the difference in my view:

 

[Riverwolf]

The difference between equality and equity differentiates the modern use of feminism vs the modern use of equitarianism(obviously with some exception based on interpretation). The former of which acknowledges the disadvantages women have and giving appropriate resources to bring women (including trans women who I believe to be the most disadvantaged) to the same level of opportunities as men. The latter of which focuses on distributing resources equally but not giving more resources to more disadvantaged.
Here is an image which helps illustrate the difference in my view:

I've seen that picture before, but didn't realize there was a different term. Thanks for sharing.

 

[Wherenextcolumbus]

There is, and has always been, disagreements within feminism about what that equality looks like.

I think a more secular example is the issue of pornography. There are feminists who believe porn is inherently demeaning, and therefore can never exist in a feminist context; and there's feminists who believe porn is not inherently demeaning, and that it's largely "mainstream"/"male-gaze" porn which is. Both ideas are well within a feminist paradigm.

Another example of what you're talking about, I think, is in the topic of feminism in media: how to depict fictional women. There's an idea called "man with boobs" (no, really), which basically posits that simply writing a male character and gender-flipping before release isn't proper representation. Having a female body inherently changes how a person is going to experience life, after all, and this should be represented. And yet a MtF gender-flipped character might still be empowering for non-binary/trans people.

That's not even getting into the issues of "white feminism/intersectional feminism", or feminism in different cultures.

It's a question of what we, as feminists, believe equality and liberation from patriarchy look like. In my experience, "liberation from patriarchy" and "equality of the sexes" have been used interchangably, and that is what I meant.

Yeah but my point was it's about the female experience under patriarchy and also sisterhood.

 

[Riverwolf]

Yeah but my point was it's about the female experience under patriarchy and also sisterhood.

I'm not sure I understand you.

 

[Politesse]

Because I'm about valuing women, for women, not creating gender-blindness. I'd be happy calling myself egalitarian, but only in the sense that I favor equal rights on a civic and political level. Ideologically, I am pro-women and feel that female dialogues and female voices need to be celebrated if they are to be recovered from the centuries of silencing. No, that doesn't mean being anti-men. But it does mean realizing that a sprinkling of equality on top of a whole complex of systemic inequality reverses nothing, it just drags you slightly toward the norm.

"When I’m sometimes asked when will there be enough [women on the supreme court]? And I say ‘When there are nine.’ People are shocked. But there’d been nine men, and nobody’s ever raised a question about that." ~Ruth Bader Ginsburg​

 

[Melinda Rose]

I think that in our society the worst thing you can be is a young woman and I feel that way for many reasons. I play sports, but volleyball is not a male heavy sport so no one comes to our games like the football team. They have a huge field, expensive bleachers, expensive lights, a band plays for their games. For our games, only our families and friends come and we can't even play football even if we love the game. Our things mostly come from our parents pockets or what we manage to do for work.

In school and in these types of forums when I talk with others of the opposite sex they are often trying to make it sexual in some way and it comes from people of all ages. I get called "Missy", "Cutie", and whatever which is pretty creepy from someone older than my dad. It also seems to me that this is acceptable to most people and I've got in trouble at school for arguing about it. It can be just an out of place sexual joke, but I think that in many ways they are trying to convince me that I am good for only one thing.

This is why feminism is important to me it is not about oppressing men, but about not having other girls suffer like me. It should not be OK to say these things, ignore peoples concerns for what sex they are, or treat their interests as less important because it is a girl thing to do.