Why fight over religion?

[MJFlores]

You will always be able to find those who do wrong within Buddhism too, As you say we are people too. But for most of us we try to do our best to not harm anyone with words, actions or thoughts. And I have no intention to "convince" you about that Buddhism would be right for you, you gave the answer your self. from your posts, it is clear that you only see your own spiritual path as the right one (not a problem for me).

As a buddhist it hurt to see other Buddhists who harm other people or animals for their own gaining of power or land, they do not follow true dharma when they do this.
There is no need to hate or become evil toward others just because they would treat me poorly.

Nobody is perfect - no matter what religion.
Now there is a perfect thing - a religion based on the truth.

 

[Augustus]

In our modern times, people still fight to the death over religion
Examples of which are:
Source: Religious war - Wikipedia

If you look at the examples, (almost) all are based around ethno-linguistic divisions as well as religious.

Actually religious differences tend to map on to ethno-linguistic ones, as different communities often like to preserve their differences by adopting different faiths from their neighbours/oppressors, especially when they don't have great relations with them.

For example, the Catholic faith was important to the Irish as it differentiated them from their British overlords. If the British invaders of Ireland had been Catholic instead of Protestant though, you'd probably have seen a rather rapid spread of Protestantism among the Irish.

 

[Augustus]

Sorry, but Muslims have traditionally been the aggressors. This dates back to the Muhgal Empire when the Muslims conquered and colonized India. Defending one's homeland and culture is hardly picking a fight.

They conquered India half a millennium before the Mughal Empire

 

[paarsurrey]

Now what can be learned from this?
The problem is not about religion but man's attitude toward his neighbor.
Remove the religion aspect and people would still find another reason to kill over
Racism, money, greed, or just the fun of it.

"The problem is not about religion but man's attitude toward his neighbor.
Remove the religion aspect and people would still find another reason to kill over Racism, money, greed, or just the fun of it."

I agree with the above.
I am an Ahmadiyya Muslim, I have never ever fought with anybody over any doctrine.
No world-war was fought over the issue of a religious doctrine.
It is a superficial notion just to malign religion.
Russia belonged to Communism, didn't they wage wars?

Fighting is an inbuilt trait in humans, so it surfaces in different forms and issues, religion cannot be blamed for it. Right, please?

Regards
_____________
[2:31]وَ اِذۡ قَالَ رَبُّکَ لِلۡمَلٰٓئِکَۃِ اِنِّیۡ جَاعِلٌ فِی الۡاَرۡضِ خَلِیۡفَۃً ؕ قَالُوۡۤا اَتَجۡعَلُ فِیۡہَا مَنۡ یُّفۡسِدُ فِیۡہَا وَ یَسۡفِکُ الدِّمَآءَ ۚ وَ نَحۡنُ نُسَبِّحُ بِحَمۡدِکَ وَ نُقَدِّسُ لَکَ ؕ قَالَ اِنِّیۡۤ اَعۡلَمُ مَا لَا تَعۡلَمُوۡنَ ﴿۳۱﴾
And when thy Lord said to the angels: ‘I am about to place a vicegerent in the earth,’ they said: ‘Wilt Thou place therein such as will cause disorder in it, and shed blood? — and we glorify Thee with Thy praise and extol Thy holiness.’ He answered: ‘I know what you know not.’
The Holy Quran - Chapter: 2: Al-Baqarah

 

[Spirit of Light]

Nobody is perfect - no matter what religion.
Now there is a perfect thing - a religion based on the truth.

I don't say your religion is wrong, Nor do I have any interest in claiming Buddhism is better than other true religions when I was younger Buddhism was the spiritual path I chose to walk, But anyone who wish to follow something different is, of course, good too.

 

[MJFlores]

You said in post #5 that there is an ongoing religious war between Hindus and Buddhists. Please provide some examples. Or even one.

There are no war between Hindus and Buddhists - if it happened maybe its a long time ago

However, this is what I found out

Revista de Estudos da Religiãosetembro / 2007 / pp. 157-164ISSN 1677-1222From which moment / period in time the Buddhist-Hindu encounter became manifest and what were the geographical and socio-cultural circumstances under which early encounters occurred?When emperor Ashoka (3rd century BCE) became a powerful patron of Buddhism, he prohibited the killing of animals. This was a severe blow against Brahmanism, because theritual sacrifice of animals was prescribed in the Vedas and formed a major part of the Brahmins’ livelihood. This made it very clear to the Brahmins that a state governed by Buddhists principles would hardly leave any space for them. Buddhism was now perceived not only as an intellectual rival but as a serious threat. And, under Ashoka – with his royal support – Buddhism rapidly spread within and outside the borders of his empire. Hence it is not surprising that after Ashoka’s Maurya dynasty (2nd century BCE) we hear of fierce persecutions of Buddhism in India, inspired by Brahmanical circles.

https://www.pucsp.br/rever/rv3_2007/f_usarski2_en.pdf

Pakistan and India
The All India Muslim League (AIML) was formed in Dhaka in 1906 by Muslims who were suspicious of the Hindu-majority Indian National Congress. They complained that Muslim members did not have the same rights as Hindu members. A number of different scenarios were proposed at various times.This was fuelled by the British policy of "Divide and Rule", which they tried to bring upon every political situation. Among the first to make the demand for a separate state was the writer/philosopher Allama Iqbal, who, in his presidential address to the 1930 convention of the Muslim League said that a separate nation for Muslims was essential in an otherwise Hindu-dominated subcontinent.

Buddhist uprising

In a country where the Buddhist majority was estimated to be between 70 and 90 percent, Diem ruled with a strong religious bias. As a member of the Catholic Vietnamese minority, he pursued pro-Catholic policies that antagonized many Buddhists.

I believe Buddhist and Hindus have an on-going religious war of their own right now and I do believe they are not part of the Abrahamic religions.

Maybe I was misunderstood in this statement.

Which should have been Buddhist have an on going religious war on their own
and the Hindus have an on going religious war on their own too

And to clarify things, I did not use "each other" or "against each other"

 

[MJFlores]

"The problem is not about religion but man's attitude toward his neighbor.
Remove the religion aspect and people would still find another reason to kill over Racism, money, greed, or just the fun of it."

I agree with the above.
I am an Ahmadiyya Muslim, I have never ever fought with anybody over any doctrine.
No world-war was fought over the issue of a religious doctrine.
It is a superficial notion just to malign religion.
Russia belonged to Communism, didn't they wage wars?

Fighting is an inbuilt trait in humans, so it surfaces in different forms and issues, religion cannot be blamed for it. Right, please?

Regards
_____________
[2:31]وَ اِذۡ قَالَ رَبُّکَ لِلۡمَلٰٓئِکَۃِ اِنِّیۡ جَاعِلٌ فِی الۡاَرۡضِ خَلِیۡفَۃً ؕ قَالُوۡۤا اَتَجۡعَلُ فِیۡہَا مَنۡ یُّفۡسِدُ فِیۡہَا وَ یَسۡفِکُ الدِّمَآءَ ۚ وَ نَحۡنُ نُسَبِّحُ بِحَمۡدِکَ وَ نُقَدِّسُ لَکَ ؕ قَالَ اِنِّیۡۤ اَعۡلَمُ مَا لَا تَعۡلَمُوۡنَ ﴿۳۱﴾
And when thy Lord said to the angels: ‘I am about to place a vicegerent in the earth,’ they said: ‘Wilt Thou place therein such as will cause disorder in it, and shed blood? — and we glorify Thee with Thy praise and extol Thy holiness.’ He answered: ‘I know what you know not.’
The Holy Quran - Chapter: 2: Al-Baqarah

Discussing religion is not fighting
Debating religion is not fighting
Talking is not fighting
However, maybe this one is.....

We can talk about religion provided no one pulls a gun or something
Because when that happens, it does not make sense.

 

[Vinayaka]

Why would Buddhists fight Hindus? If a Buddhist fight someone he or she has not understood the dharma

Sri Lanka comes to mind, but it really wasn't so much about Buddhist versus Hindu, but rather Sinhalese versus Tamil. The Tamil insurgency leaders were Christian, and Muslim Tamils, Hindu Tamils all in various ways fought against Sinhalese Buddhista and Sinhalese Christians (I think).

The situation in Mayanmar also comes to mind involving Buddhists but that too is more ethnicity than religion.

 

[MJFlores]

I don't say your religion is wrong, Nor do I have any interest in claiming Buddhism is better than other true religions when I was younger Buddhism was the spiritual path I chose to walk, But anyone who wish to follow something different is, of course, good too.

But for me, I welcome a person who says my religion is wrong.
Because if my religion is wrong and someone points out that it is fake
I wouldn't want to stay any minute longer
To stay would mean I would be wasting my time, energy and money
over a fake religion.

I took on a religion because it is my insurance policy
My assurance with God that on the day when He orders
His Son back, I will be saved

And while this world keeps on turning, I would pray
without doubting, all my problems to God and ask for the things that I need
in the name of His Son, my Lord and Savior
Jesus Christ

 

[Spirit of Light]

Sri Lanka comes to mind, but it really wasn't so much about Buddhist versus Hindu, but rather Sinhalese versus Tamil. The Tamil insurgency leaders were Christian, and Muslim Tamils, Hindu Tamils all in various ways fought against Sinhalese Buddhista and Sinhalese Christians (I think).

The situation in Mayanmar also comes to mind involving Buddhists but that too is more ethnicity than religion.

Unfortunately, there have been cases where Buddhist communities have done immoral action toward others yes. But if we look at the teachings then it says clearly that we should not take part in any harmful action, words or thoughts of others. But there are many who are by culture born into Buddhism and thereby is seen as true Buddhists, this is not the case. because to be a true Buddhist one should understand the 4 noble truths and be guided by the 8 folded paths toward a more righteous way of life.

But looking at the world today more and more people become cultural attached to religion than actually practicing it. That leads to faults similar to what we discuss here

 

[Vinayaka]

Unfortunately, there have been cases where Buddhist communities have done immoral action toward others yes. But if we look at the teachings then it says clearly that we should not take part in any harmful action, words or thoughts of others. But there are many who are by culture born into Buddhism and thereby is seen as true Buddhists, this is not the case. because to be a true Buddhist one should understand the 4 noble truths and be guided by the 8 folded paths toward a more righteous way of life.

But looking at the world today more and more people become cultural attached to religion than actually practicing it. That leads to faults similar to what we discuss here

Besides that, often just defending yourself is turned into some sort of violent activity due to media exaggeration. Certain forces don't like to see peaceful religions looking good, so they exaggerate one side, all the while downplaying the other.

 

[Spirit of Light]

But for me, I welcome a person who says my religion is wrong.
Because if my religion is wrong and someone points out that it is fake
I wouldn't want to stay any minute longer
To stay would mean I would be wasting my time, energy and money
over a fake religion.

I took on a religion because it is my insurance policy
My assurance with God that on the day when He orders
His Son back, I will be saved

And while this world keeps on turning, I would pray
without doubting, all my problems to God and ask for the things that I need
in the name of His Son, my Lord and Savior
Jesus Christ

That is good I do not blame someone for pointing out my mistakes as a Buddhist either. And it does happen from time to time someone comes along and teaches me new wisdom within Buddhism.
It looks like the difference in our practice is that you rely fully on God or Jesus to save you whereas, for me, I must save my self by insight and wisdom guided by the teaching of Buddha Sakyamuni. And by understanding the teaching of 4 noble truths about suffering, and use the 8 folded path to lead me toward enlightenment (if i can realize the enlightenment)

 

[Spirit of Light]

Besides that, often just defending yourself is turned into some sort of violent activity due to media exaggeration. Certain forces don't like to see peaceful religions looking good, so they exaggerate one side, all the while downplaying the other.

As a practicing Buddhist, i follow pacifism but I will be able to block a punch or protect my fianceè in the matter of using my self as a shield for her, But i will not harm others.

 

[Cooky]

Besides that, often just defending yourself is turned into some sort of violent activity due to media exaggeration. Certain forces don't like to see peaceful religions looking good, so they exaggerate one side, all the while downplaying the other.

Buddhists and Hindus can hop off their high-horses now, and realize that humans are humans, and not every Buudhist or Hindu is perfect, just like not every RC or EO is perfect.

 

[Spirit of Light]

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/a4/8d/a4/a48da465923302d2061d4a4651a0db64.gif

Buddhists and Hindus can hop off their high-horses now, and realize that humans are humans, and not every Buudhist or Hindu is perfect, just like not every RC or EO is perfect.

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/a4/8d/a4/a48da465923302d2061d4a4651a0db64.gif

 

[PureX]

Why belong to a religion where people fight, even to death, over doctrine? Any religion worth anything would allow for individual differences because we are not a one-size-fits-all kind of creature. The more I see the two of the four Abrahamic religions fight, the more I am thankful that I no longer belong to any of them. Chill out!

For a lot of humans, righteousness matters far more than individuality, or freedom of choice.

 

[Nakosis]

Why belong to a religion where people fight, even to death, over doctrine? Any religion worth anything would allow for individual differences because we are not a one-size-fits-all kind of creature. The more I see the two of the four Abrahamic religions fight, the more I am thankful that I no longer belong to any of them. Chill out!

I think what they fight over is the truth. A truth that promises them something.

If their truth is wrong, then they get nothing. No heaven, no afterlife, no immortality, no reunion with God/universe. Just one crappy old life. A momentary existence then they are gone.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Why belong to a religion where people fight, even to death, over doctrine? Any religion worth anything would allow for individual differences because we are not a one-size-fits-all kind of creature. The more I see the two of the four Abrahamic religions fight, the more I am thankful that I no longer belong to any of them. Chill out!

What and miss the broom fight?

 

[Vee]

Why belong to a religion where people fight, even to death, over doctrine? Any religion worth anything would allow for individual differences because we are not a one-size-fits-all kind of creature. The more I see the two of the four Abrahamic religions fight, the more I am thankful that I no longer belong to any of them. Chill out!

I'm ready to fight for my right to have my beliefs and to live according to my principles. I'm also happy to teach anyone who wants to know about my religion and our beliefs, but I'm not going to fight with anyone. Let my behavior speak for itself and people can get to their own conclusions.
In my opinion there is no better witness than one's actions and people who get into fights to force their views on others are missing the point.

 

[iam1me]

Why belong to a religion where people fight, even to death, over doctrine? Any religion worth anything would allow for individual differences because we are not a one-size-fits-all kind of creature. The more I see the two of the four Abrahamic religions fight, the more I am thankful that I no longer belong to any of them. Chill out!

Debating doctrine is good and helps people to refine their understanding. As long as people approach discussions in that light, there is no problem. And, as you say, we shouldn't expect everyone to have the exact same understanding and interpretation of things - that is quite unreasonable.

Some people take things too far - but they aren't acting in accordance with the teachings of Judaism/Christianity.