Why God most certainly does not exist

[yourhopeboundheart]

Oh, and by the way, good luck with your plan to construct a operational 747 by sending a tornado through a junkyard or creating a printed and bound dictionary by blowing up a print shop because that is more likely to happen than the evolution of the human body from a state of chaos n ot to mention all creation and the order thereof.

lol. fortunately none of us are in charge of making the body evolve, so you can save the luck for something anyone is actually required to accomplish.

the comparison would go more like - good luck creating a functioning 747 in a 747 factory with only an unlimited supply of airplane parts and a finely tuned airplane-making-machine that has been making airplanes for millions and millions of years.

but, once again, we dont have to waste our precious luck on such things because it's not our job to do. the job does itself, we just happened to notice and document.

[in the future, when using arguments that are taught in sunday school, it's best to double check whether or not they are even slightly relevant. there is no peer reviewing of the clever little pocket sized theological encouragements that are doled out to believers by believers, so when they get out in the sun with the rest of us - who aren't inclined just to say Amen - they just shrivel up.]

 

[Evandr]

lol. fortunately none of us are in charge of making the body evolve, so you can save the luck for something anyone is actually required to accomplish.

the comparison would go more like - good luck creating a functioning 747 in a 747 factory with only an unlimited supply of airplane parts and a finely tuned airplane-making-machine that has been making airplanes for millions and millions of years.

but, once again, we dont have to waste our precious luck on such things because it's not our job to do. the job does itself, we just happened to notice and document.

[in the future, when using arguments that are taught in sunday school, it's best to double check whether or not they are even slightly relevant. there is no peer reviewing of the clever little pocket sized theological encouragements that are doled out to believers by believers, so when they get out in the sun with the rest of us - who aren't inclined just to say Amen - they just shrivel up.]

Very cute but Sunday school has nothing to do with it. You may not believe or even have the capacity to understand but the odds of such things happening can and have been calculated. This may come as a complete surprise to you but the odds of the 747 being build exactly as I have described is better than the likelihood of universal organization from chaos, in fact science itself admits that the age of a universe from cradle to grave is not nearly sufficient for the number of iteration necessary for it to be accomplished (that is if you stretch the imagination far enough to believe that it could happen), that number would be a 1 with more zeroes after it than there are protons, neutrons, and electrons in the known universe, but that is another thread all together, I only mentioned it because the thread originator opened the door to it.

 

[logician]

I keep hearing people like you say religion is not necessary, speak for yourself. The paths I take depend on the goals that I want to achieve. If you do not know what the goal is then, yes, religion is not necessary, scamper about as you will. If you have a goal then you must do what is necessary to achieve it but please do not tell me that religion is not necessary for me to obtain my goals because you obviously have not one iota of understanding about what my goals are and the paths I must follow to obtain them.

Oh, and by the way, good luck with your plan to construct a operational 747 by sending a tornado through a junkyard or creating a printed and bound dictionary by blowing up a print shop because that is more likely to happen than the evolution of the human body from a state of chaos n ot to mention all creation and the order thereof.

Rome wasn't built in a day.

 

[yourhopeboundheart]

the foundation on which the metaphor lies is simply flawed. and using metaphors like these are typically attempts to sway those who are not inclined to do the legwork themselves.

please cite your source.

 

[secularsimon]

well i guess i didnt pick the title too well. that wasnt very well thought up. and I wish I'd know about 'Things for new people...' post. thanks for the welcomes and ill learn as i go along i guess. thats why i am here

Religion is not an idea someone came up with long ago. It's more like an instinct than an idea.

Where else in nature is religion instinctual?

Got to respond to this one... NOTHING in that post disproved the existence of God... If your basis for your lack of belief is science then you must not be correctly informed... Firstly, science in NO way explains everything... As a matter of fact science can explain very little of the natural world.. In FACT the more we know the more we realize how truly complex the universe really is, and we realize how truly ignorant we are.. The scientific theories that back up the atheists, who claim there is no god, are simply that... THEORIES... The FAITH required to believe these theories is no different than the FAITH religious people have in their God... Speaking of scientific theories, the ones used commonly, to prove the lack of a God, are soooo full of holes... My 2-cents.... Respond and I'll be glad to continue...

yes i know i didnt really disprove the existence of god. the title wasnt well thought up. anyway..i didnt say science explained everything. science answers more questions where religion only seems to lead to more questions.
im not aware of any scientific theories that are explicitly out to disprove the existence of god. however gathered evidence points toward the improbability of the existence of a deity.

 

[yourhopeboundheart]

i didnt say science explained everything. science answers more questions where religion only seems to lead to more questions.

i think you have this backwards.
religion encourages contentment with limited answers. science encourages wonder and devotion to further inquiry. science is self perpetuating because behind EVERY answer is more unique and exciting questions.


i get what you meant, i just dont want anyone unschooled in the wonders of the scientific method to be under the impression that science is a question killer.

 

[Storm]

Where else in nature is religion instinctual?

Where else in nature is a species with capacity for it?

 

[tumbleweed41]

Oh, and by the way, good luck with your plan to construct a operational 747 by sending a tornado through a junkyard or creating a printed and bound dictionary by blowing up a print shop because that is more likely to happen than the evolution of the human body from a state of chaos n ot to mention all creation and the order thereof.

You know, if you actually had any knowledge on the actual mechanisms of Biological Evolution, you would see how your analogy is both irrelevant and irrational.

 

[Breathe]

however gathered evidence points toward the improbability of the existence of a deity.

Please define your opinion on the term deity.

(I know what deity means, btw - I want your opinion on what deity means, what you take it to mean - is it personal, impersonal, physical, non-physical, sentient, conscious or not, omniscient and omnipotent or not, etc, etc. It is more than likely your opinion of this "a deity" you refer to is different to my own conception of it.)

 

[Evandr]

You know, if you actually had any knowledge on the actual mechanisms of Biological Evolution, you would see how your analogy is both irrelevant and irrational.

Stop talking like you are some kind of authority on the subject. These comparisons deal with likelihood. They were derived by people a lot smarter than you or me and they are valid because there is nothing mystic or religious about the calculations, it is pure hard analytical science that put out the numbers, I just repeated them. Comparative relevance is another matter all together.

If you were to drop an apple and an orange out of a tree, you don't discount the calculations about which will hit the ground first because the apple and orange present different variables in the calculations. You use the same formula but you keep the variables of the individual objects in their own realm. This makes comparative analysis valid.

Also, the argument starts at the metamorphosis of matter unorganized into something that can evolve, but even if your argument was relevant simply saying so does not preclude the thought (what I believe is reality) that intelligent design is responsible for the mechanisms of evolution that you want to insist are happening on their own.

 

[Evandr]

Rome wasn't built in a day.

Exactly, but it was built by intelligent design, it did not spring up out of the sand on its own.

 

[fantome profane]

Where else in nature is a species with capacity for it?

Praying mantis?
[FONT=&quot](mantis religiosa)[/FONT]

 

[sandy whitelinger]

Religion is an idea that has been around for thousands of years. It used to answer the seemingly unanswerable. The Greeks had Poseidon, Ares, Dionysus & Zeus, just to name a few. And of course we have the Egyptians that had Ra, Hathor, Seth, Osiris, Horus...etc
All these Gods had a purpose, which was to answer a question of which the truth was not yet known.
Today we have a vast array of technologies, studies, research, discoveries and experiments at our disposal to answer every question imaginable.
The evidence for evolution is far greater than the evidence for creation or the existence of a supernatural deity.

God or the concept of religion is an idea that I find archaic, and no longer necessary. One does not need to subscribe to a Faith in order to be a good and moral person.
We have but one life to live and that is right here, right now, on this earth. There is no magical blissful afterlife, no reunion with long lost loved ones. Which is not something to fear. It does not mean there is no meaning to life.

So much Blah, Blah Blah. If we can answer every question imaginable then why can't we answer whether there is a God or not?

And being moral is not the true meaninf od faith. Faith is the substance of things hoped for and the evidence of things not seen. It is more about having hope for the future.

 

[dogsgod]

So much Blah, Blah Blah. If we can answer every question imaginable then why can't we answer whether there is a God or not?

We can answer whether there is a God or not, it's just that people don't like the answer.

 

[Ankit_Mishra]

actually denying god's existent is the start of religion , congrats u r on the way!!!!

 

[dogsgod]

actually denying god's existent is the start of religion , congrats u r on the way!!!!

You wish.

 

[.lava]

Religion is an idea that has been around for thousands of years. It used to answer the seemingly unanswerable. The Greeks had Poseidon, Ares, Dionysus & Zeus, just to name a few. And of course we have the Egyptians that had Ra, Hathor, Seth, Osiris, Horus...etc
All these Gods had a purpose, which was to answer a question of which the truth was not yet known.
Today we have a vast array of technologies, studies, research, discoveries and experiments at our disposal to answer every question imaginable.
The evidence for evolution is far greater than the evidence for creation or the existence of a supernatural deity.

God or the concept of religion is an idea that I find archaic, and no longer necessary. One does not need to subscribe to a Faith in order to be a good and moral person.
We have but one life to live and that is right here, right now, on this earth. There is no magical blissful afterlife, no reunion with long lost loved ones. Which is not something to fear. It does not mean there is no meaning to life.

IMO time is now, it's always been now. i do believe in after life but it does not matter until it is "now". religion is not just an idea. it is a practice and a way of life. like any other action, it has results. one witness these results in a now, not later. i am happy with what i am given in return, something that you can't give me, something that no idea could offer .... basically something, some taste that i can not find in other things. so, we are all alone and on our owns. i hope you find happiness and peace

.

 

[K.Venugopal]

IMO time is now, it's always been now. i do believe in after life but it does not matter until it is "now". religion is not just an idea. it is a practice and a way of life. like any other action, it has results. one witness these results in a now, not later. i am happy with what i am given in return, something that you can't give me, something that no idea could offer .... basically something, some taste that i can not find in other things. so, we are all alone and on our owns. i hope you find happiness and peace

.

Dear lava, As you often do, you have said something superb when you talked about "now". I think there is no living except in the here and now, whether here or in the hereafter.

 

[Thief]

I expect people, who do not believe in life after death to deny the existence of God.

Denial doesn't affirm the topic title.

 

[Evandr]

IMO time is now, it's always been now. i do believe in after life but it does not matter until it is "now". religion is not just an idea. it is a practice and a way of life. like any other action, it has results. one witness these results in a now, not later. i am happy with what i am given in return, something that you can't give me, something that no idea could offer .... basically something, some taste that i can not find in other things. so, we are all alone and on our owns. i hope you find happiness and peace

.

It is said that those who do not learn from the past are doomed to repeat it. That implies that avoiding the mistakes of the past means preparing in the now to meet the future. Those who take the "eat, drink, and be merry for tomorrow we die" approach to life will be swallowed up by cunning and well prepared enemies (temporal and spiritual) laying in wait to snare those who fail to prepare, such will deserve exactly what they get.

No man is an island so always being happy in the now is dependent upon preparing, in a world full of people living in the now, for tomorrow to become the now, which it always does and those who ignore its coming are often disappointed by its arrival. I too hope for happiness and peace for all but I am not foolish enough to sit idely by with nothing but hope to go on, I will do everything in my power to stack the deck (so to speak) so that happiness and peace has the best chance I can give it to become a reality. For me that includes listening to others whom I consider to be wiser than myself. The wisest of us all is God and His only begotten son Jesus Christ. Doing so always prepares one to meet tomorrow regardless of how easy or difficult it may seem.

Understanding "Who I am", "Where I came from", "Why I am here", and "Where I am going" is extreamly important and most certainly demands that I consider the full spectrum of possibilities and then choose wisely the path I will take. To do that requires that I learn from the past (others as well as my own), paying attention to the present, and preparing for the future, all the while looking to divine guidance to make sure I get it right. We only get one shot so getting it wrong is not an option any of us can afford to risk.