Why I think atheism/theism doesn't matter.

[sandandfoam]

I think that God and the Buddhists "big mind" are the same thing. Following Jesus and following the eightfold path lead to the same place. Joining with God or waking up. Both describe a way of being. The same way of being in my view.

One road needs no God, the other does. The destination is the same.
To focus on theism or atheism is to look at the road and see destination rather than journey.

It seems to me that it's the waking up that matters - not the road there.

 

[katiafish]

Yup, I agree When one gets through the first stages of awakening, one realizes that all the diff labels are just there as anchor points, to keep one from straying too far from the path.. Some people need the rigid walls of dogma (whatever it may be) to support them, which is fine, but extremely limiting in my opinion. As soon we proclaim ourselves to be one thing or another, we ultimately build our own box as we lose fluidity.

 

[PolyHedral]

Can someone please explain the destination, then? Because I'm not entirely sure what there is to be enlightened about.

 

[Willamena]

To focus on theism or atheism is to look at the road and see destination rather than journey.

It seems to me that it's the waking up that matters - not the road there.

I like that a lot.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

I think that God and the Buddhists "big mind" are the same thing. Following Jesus and following the eightfold path lead to the same place. Joining with God or waking up. Both describe a way of being. The same way of being in my view.

One road needs no God, the other does. The destination is the same.
To focus on theism or atheism is to look at the road and see destination rather than journey.

It seems to me that it's the waking up that matters - not the road there.

Could you elaborate? Right now this just seems to be a collection of buzz phrases that don't actually mean anything.

 

[A-ManESL]

Can someone please explain the destination, then? Because I'm not entirely sure what there is to be enlightened about.

In my understanding, there is a metaphysical Reality which in its totality is beyond human comprehension. The destination is not to comprehend it but to unite or harmonize ourselves with that Reality. It may be symbolized by the concept of God, in which case an example of harmonizing it would be fanaa or it may be understood as a state to be achieved (nirvana), or in many other ways. What we call God is but one way to approach that Reality so that this uniting/harmonizing is facilitated in a particular path. For other paths, like that of Buddhism, that Reality is approached in a different way through nirvana.

There are as many paths to God as there are souls on Earth. (Hadith of Prophet Muhammad(pbuh))

Regards

 

[Jeremiah]

I think that God and the Buddhists "big mind" are the same thing. Following Jesus and following the eightfold path lead to the same place. Joining with God or waking up. Both describe a way of being. The same way of being in my view.

One road needs no God, the other does. The destination is the same.
To focus on theism or atheism is to look at the road and see destination rather than journey.

It seems to me that it's the waking up that matters - not the road there.

" The destination is the same."

You mean God, right?

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

I think that God and the Buddhists "big mind" are the same thing. Following Jesus and following the eightfold path lead to the same place. Joining with God or waking up. Both describe a way of being. The same way of being in my view.

One road needs no God, the other does. The destination is the same.
To focus on theism or atheism is to look at the road and see destination rather than journey.

It seems to me that it's the waking up that matters - not the road there.

This does not describe my "journey" or my destination. I also don't think that it describes the beliefs of most theists.

 

[Jeremiah]

In my understanding, there is a metaphysical Reality which in its totality is beyond human comprehension. The destination is not to comprehend it but to unite or harmonize ourselves with that Reality. It may be symbolized by the concept of God, in which case an example of harmonizing it would be fanaa or it may be understood as a state to be achieved (nirvana), or in many other ways. What we call God is but one way to approach that Reality so that this uniting/harmonizing is facilitated in a particular path. For other paths, like that of Buddhism, that Reality is approached in a different way through nirvana.

There are as many paths to God as there are souls on Earth. (Hadith of Prophet Muhammad(pbuh))

Regards

"The destination is not to comprehend it but to unite or harmonize ourselves with that Reality."

Maybe we are at the maximum level of reality right now. And all one has to do is pull their head out of the clouds and look.

 

[Jeremiah]

People are always so worried about going places. I think perhaps we should learn to deal with what is in front of us at the moment, instead of some pointless journey. Maybe get our bearings and decide where we want to go, before just blindly flopping ahead.

 

[sandandfoam]

Could you elaborate? Right now this just seems to be a collection of buzz phrases that don't actually mean anything.

Sometimes I forget myself. E.g when I'm outside in nature. Especially in a storm or on a high mountain. I just am.
Some Christian writers I have read have expressed the idea of nature as theophany. God is one way of describing this. It works for me. Christianity has a vein that facilitiates this understanding in my opinion.


Some Buddhist writers I have read speak of "big mind" I think this is describing the same thing.

Most Christians are theists, most Buddhists seem to me to be atheists.
I read in a Buddhist book (Steve Hagens - Buddhism Plain and Simple) the idea that religion is a raft and that the purpose is to gain an understanding of what we are because there lies peace.

I think that theism and atheism are not important. Understanding what we are is. In terms of what we are - I think the Buddhist and the Christian paths point in the same direction.

In Christianity I think the religion is a raft - but the purpose is to gain understanding and this can be lost in concentrating on the raft/path/road - i.e. dogma

 

[A-ManESL]

"The destination is not to comprehend it but to unite or harmonize ourselves with that Reality."

Maybe we are at the maximum level of reality right now. And all one has to do is pull their head out of the clouds and look.

Maybe one has to look take their heads out of the sand too and see that all they were seeing before was not all of Reality. For those who are unable to do so, they certainly wont believe that they are at anything but at the max level. Hence it is fruitless to argue further with such people.

Regards

 

[ImmortalFlame]

Sometimes I forget myself. E.g when I'm outside in nature. Especially in a storm or on a high mountain. I just am.
Some Christian writers I have read have expressed the idea of nature as theophany. God is one way of describing this. It works for me. Christianity has a vein that facilitiates this understanding in my opinion.

If you want to call nature God, fine. Fill your boots. But you haven't enhanced yours or anyone's understanding of either nature or God by simply re-labelling it.

Some Buddhist writers I have read speak of "big mind" I think this is describing the same thing.

Again, that's not really answering anything. Just re-labelling.

Most Christians are theists, most Buddhists seem to me to be atheists.
I read in a Buddhist book (Steve Hagens - Buddhism Plain and Simple) the idea that religion is a raft and that the purpose is to gain an understanding of what we are because there lies peace.

I think that theism and atheism are not important understanding what we are is. In terms of what we are - I think the Buddhist and the Christian paths point in the same direction.

And what is that direction? How can you clarify to us what that direction is and why the paths are the same?

In Christianity I think the religion is a raft - but the purpose is to gain understanding and this can be lost in concentrating on the raft/path/road - i.e. dogma

And what understanding is that?

 

[sandandfoam]

This does not describe my "journey" or my destination. I also don't think that it describes the beliefs of most theists.

Sure. But I wasn't trying to describe yours, or most theists. I was throwing out the latest step in mine for criticism

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

In Christianity I think the religion is a raft - but the purpose is to gain understanding and this can be lost in concentrating on the raft/path/road - i.e. dogma

If you take the position that the "religion" is unimportant, then I think you strip away much of what it means to be Christian... for most Christians, anyhow.

Sure. But I wasn't trying to describe yours, or most theists. I was throwing out the latest step in mine for criticism

You seemed to speak to atheism and theism generally. If what you say doesn't apply to mainstream theists and atheists, then what exactly were you going for?

 

[PolyHedral]

Maybe one has to look take their heads out of the sand too and see that all they were seeing before was not all of Reality. For those who are unable to do so, they certainly wont believe that they are at anything but at the max level. Hence it is fruitless to argue further with such people.
Regards

But how do you distinguish a greater reality from something in your head?

 

[sandandfoam]

If you want to call nature God, fine. Fill your boots. But you haven't enhanced yours or anyone's understanding of either nature or God by simply re-labelling it.

No, no. You miss my point. The experience is the focus.

Again, that's not really answering anything. Just re-labelling.

My point is that the two are the same

And what is that direction? How can you clarify to us what that direction is and why the paths are the same?

I think it is that the boundary between my self and the world is imagined. I'm not arguing that the paths are the same I am arguing that the destination is.
I stated it as plainly as I know how -

And what understanding is that

That each of us is a carrier of "Big Mind" perhaps - I do not myself understand - I am merely working on it

 

[sandandfoam]

If you take the position that the "religion" is unimportant, then I think you strip away much of what it means to be Christian... for most Christians, anyhow.

Maybe

what exactly were you going for?

I am putting what my current thoughts are out for criticism in order to try and see for myself where they are weak. I find discussion/debate excellent for clarifying and improving my own understanding of what I think is going on in my head.

 

[sandandfoam]

But how do you distinguish a greater reality from something in your head?

Isn't that the million dollar question?

I don't think it's do-able but I feel I have to try.

I think going with the 'gut' is as good as I can do

 

[Willamena]

If you take the position that the "religion" is unimportant, then I think you strip away much of what it means to be Christian... for most Christians, anyhow.

And that's a good thing... for Stephen, anyhow.