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Why is hell eternal?

Hockeycowboy

Hockeycowboy

Witness for Jehovah
Premium Member
danieldemol said:
As a liberal, truth is more important to me than what a text says.

Thus I don’t believe in an eternal hell, not because I think the bible does or doesn’t teach this, but simply because I don’t believe that finite man is capable of the infinite crime which would surely be necessary to justify eternal punishment.

Kind regards :)
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Very good post! And good reasoning!
You've just displayed justice. Now if we have this ability.... shouldn't we think God has it, to an even greater degree?
 
Skwim

Skwim

Veteran Member
Jollybear said:
Does context play a role in this verse?

Exodus 21:2-6
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I agree the context certainly does favor

then his master will bring him before God. He will bring him to the door or the doorpost. There his master will pierce his ear with a pointed tool, and he will serve him as his slave for life.
​
over

Then his master shall bring him unto the judges; he shall also bring him to the door, or unto the door post; and his master shall bore his ear through with an aul; and he shall serve him forever.
​
which is why I said it's too bad the Bible plays so fast and loose with its wording. If one only reads one of the 20+ Bibles wherein Exodus 21:6 uses the word "forever" the reader is deceived into believing this is the truth (I don't believe it's what was meant to be believed). Why the Hebrew writers chose to use `owlam (וֹלָם ), meaning "forever," is beyond me, because it certainly doesn't make much sense, but there you are; they did and these 20 some translations picked up on it and passed it along.

To me, this serves as a black mark against the reliability of the Bible.

.
 
Jollybear

Jollybear

Hey
Skwim said:
I agree the context certainly does favor

then his master will bring him before God. He will bring him to the door or the doorpost. There his master will pierce his ear with a pointed tool, and he will serve him as his slave for life.
​
over

Then his master shall bring him unto the judges; he shall also bring him to the door, or unto the door post; and his master shall bore his ear through with an aul; and he shall serve him forever.
​
which is why I said it's too bad the Bible plays so fast and loose with its wording. If one only reads one of the 20+ Bibles wherein Exodus 21:6 uses the word "forever" the reader is deceived into believing this is the truth (I don't believe it's what was meant to be believed). Why the Hebrew writers chose to use `owlam (וֹלָם ), meaning "forever," is beyond me, because it certainly doesn't make much sense, but there you are; they did and these 20 some translations picked up on it and passed it along.

To me, this serves as a black mark against the reliability of the Bible.

.
Click to expand...

If thats unreliable, then me saying my day draged on forever is unreliable, wouldent it?
 
Skwim

Skwim

Veteran Member
Jollybear said:
If thats unreliable, then me saying my day draged on forever is unreliable, wouldent it?
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Only if I was convinced that you never engaged in hyperbole. So, do you believe the Bible engages in hyperbole or not? If you do then you can't be sure the blindness that Jesus is said to have cured was really blindness at all. Or that perhaps Lazarus wasn't really "dead" at all, but simply in a coma of sorts. If you don't believe the Bible engages in hyperbole then your left with looking at the "forever" in Exodus 21:6 as a mistake.

.
 
Jollybear

Jollybear

Hey
Skwim said:
Only if I was convinced that you never engaged in hyperbole. So, do you believe the Bible engages in hyperbole or not? If you do then you can't be sure the blindness that Jesus is said to have cured was really blindness at all. Or that perhaps Lazarus wasn't really "dead" at all, but simply in a coma of sorts. If you don't believe the Bible engages in hyperbole then your left with looking at the "forever" in Exodus 21:6 as a mistake.

.
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Well i do believe the bible uses hyperbole, but in some cases, not all cases.

Context i think dictates whether its hyperbole or not.
 
Skwim

Skwim

Veteran Member
Jollybear said:
Well i do believe the bible uses hyperbole, but in some cases, not all cases.

Context i think dictates whether its hyperbole or not.
Click to expand...
So, do you believe that wherever a word or statement in the Bible doesn't fit within its context it must be hyperbole?

.
 
Hockeycowboy

Hockeycowboy

Witness for Jehovah
Premium Member
Skwim said:
I agree the context certainly does favor

then his master will bring him before God. He will bring him to the door or the doorpost. There his master will pierce his ear with a pointed tool, and he will serve him as his slave for life.
​
over

Then his master shall bring him unto the judges; he shall also bring him to the door, or unto the door post; and his master shall bore his ear through with an aul; and he shall serve him forever.
​
which is why I said it's too bad the Bible plays so fast and loose with its wording. If one only reads one of the 20+ Bibles wherein Exodus 21:6 uses the word "forever" the reader is deceived into believing this is the truth (I don't believe it's what was meant to be believed). Why the Hebrew writers chose to use `owlam (וֹלָם ), meaning "forever," is beyond me, because it certainly doesn't make much sense, but there you are; they did and these 20 some translations picked up on it and passed it along.

To me, this serves as a black mark against the reliability of the Bible.

.
Click to expand...
@Skwim , I don't agree with every view this site promotes, but this is interesting...you might like it, too.

http://www.2001translation.com/NOTES.htm#_9

Take care.
 
Hockeycowboy

Hockeycowboy

Witness for Jehovah
Premium Member
Jollybear said:
And why would a loving, just God who says he takes no pleasure in even the very death of the wicked permit or cause eternal torture? Would that not rather make him sadistic?
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Yes, it would...so it must not be the case.

The Bible states that even Jesus was in Hell for a while, after he was killed!

Psalms 16:10, verified by Peter @ Acts of the Apostles 2:25-32.

Take care.
 
Jollybear

Jollybear

Hey
Skwim said:
So, do you believe that wherever a word or statement in the Bible doesn't fit within its context it must be hyperbole?

.
Click to expand...

Yes, it must be hyperbole in that case. And perhaps they used hyperbole and literalism together too. Thats possible.

For instence i can do it now.

My day draged on forever

My day draged on is the literal part and forever is the hyperbole part.

Or and all literal statement would look like this:

My day was boring.
 
Prometheus85

Prometheus85

Active Member
Do I think hell is eternal? No because, there’s no such thing. The notion of something like Hell, for example, is absurd on a number of levels.
 
dfnj

dfnj

Well-Known Member
Jollybear said:
Why do you believe hell is eternal and not temporary?
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At the moment of your death, if you choose to turn into the light and look into the face of God, then you will experience God's infinite beauty. At that moment, experience God's infinite beauty is the greatest possible experience a human consciousness can experience. All time ceases to exist. Since you are dead you do not need food. You do not have material needs. You are just permanently stuck staring into the face of God for the rest of eternity in a state of total and absolute bliss.

If you choose not to go into the light well it's not clear what your journey will be like. But at some point you will probably get another chance to turn back into the light.

Some people are really stubborn so for them hell would last a lot longer.
 
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