Why learn about other faiths?

[Marcion]

Thank you for this explanation.

This sounds like the Universal Manifestation of God.

No doubt you’ve connected the dots by now and realised Baha’is believe (those who know something about Hinduism at least) that Bahá’u’lláh is the 10th avatar of Vishnu/God or the Kalki Avatar. Buddha was also an Avatar.

I don't know much about Hinduism. Anandamurti rejects the religious theory of avatarism because it is illogical (and therefore invalid). I'm sure serious buddhists won't agree with the idea of Lord Buddha as a Hindu avatar.

If we accept the historic Shiva as you believe and the Baha’is can not discount the possibility, then the Dharmic lineage becomes Shiva, Krishna, Buddha then Bahá’u’lláh.

We would then have to consider why an Avatar of God has come out of Persia, not India.
This is all consistent with Baha’i cosmology IMHO.
Obviously the Baha’is see a few more. I’m presuming Anandamurti references are to Lord Shiva and Lord Krishna? Who else?

If you see Lord Shiva and Lord Krishna through the Bahai cosmological lense, then that would be possible.
The third and last Mahakaula was Anandamurti as He demonstrated several times during the 1950's and 1960's.
He did not mention any more instances of a Mahakaula or personifications of Taraka Brahma.
If they had been there I am sure He would have mentioned them or written extensively about them.
Buddhistic teachings are also mentioned in some of the writings of Anandamurti but Lord Buddha was no Mahakaula.

So while we may learn from the Hindu mystics to access these potent forces the needs of humanity take precedence over an elite few attaining enlightenment.

That may well happen in the next religious era along with universal vegetarianism lol.
Bahá’u’lláh asked the monks to come out of seclusion and assist humanity. Mysticism and living a practical good life are complimentary. I think your focus is on mysticism. The focus for the Baha’is is to create a more cohesive just and unified world. Mysticism is the means through which we will affect that spiritual transformation both within ourselves and our communities.

There is nothing elitist about the teachings of Ananda Marga, anyone who has a human body can learn the meditation lessons and do the kiirtana. Without following Yama and Niyama sadhana is impossible but there are no special requirements to learn the yoga and meditation system. For people who prefer prayers and ritualism over sadhana, there are many religions to choose from instead.

I became a vegetarian only about six months after I got my initiation into sadhana, you are stimulated to only practise what you understand or actually experience as useful or positive and not take anything for granted.

As you can see from the yantra (pratiik) of AMPS, the mission stresses a balance between "innercises and outercises" (service to humanity) and discourages a lifestyle of turning your back on the needs of society. There is no place in AMPS for people who want to stay in a cave in the Himalaya or in a jungle and forget about the practical world.
It was the social service side of Christianity that was integrated into AMPS, so there is no "otherworldliness" in the path and also monks and nuns are hard workers.

 

[CG Didymus]

One who is raised a Hindu will have a very different experience of religion than one who is raised Christian. The leap from moving from one of these faiths to another will be too great for many. Most people who grow up with Hinduism don’t become Christians, just as most people who grow up Christians don’t become Hindus.



Beliefs are important, but practice more so. Practicing being fair and kind to others is much more important that a list of theological beliefs. What good is believing in God a particular way if you are unable to translate that faith into deeds? James 2:14-26. What good is the right faith if it doesn’t manifest as right living? Why have proofs if your faith doesn’t amount to anything? 1 Corinthians 13



That is true.



I’ve met good and bad Mormons. Baha’is don’t believe Joseph Smith was a prophet. It doesn’t matter. Some Mormons are great people and live by high moral standards. They believe in Jesus Christ so that’s gotta help.



That’s true. But there’s also a rise in religious fanaticism, and a decline in religious moderates.



We believe in the same God, Jesus and Bible. That’s a great starting point.



I agree.

So, if Joseph Smith is not a prophet according to the Baha'is, what about the Book of Mormon and the other things about the Church? It's a pretty profound story. But if it's all from the mind of a man, then how is it so successful... and why so many people believe in it, and follow it and are changed for the better? And, if the Book of Mormon is from a man, why not some or all of the stories of the Bible? Like, you know me, I think it's very probable that it is myth and legend.

But, those myths and legends are meant to teach and guide the Jewish people to follow and obey certain rules. Rules that have been given the added authority of being from their God... a jealous and wrathful God that did get involved with their lives by doing things like sending fire from heaven and flooding the whole Earth. Since Baha'is believe those things are symbolic, we're not really saying things that are that much different. You say they didn't happen literally. I say they might be myths and legends.

But, did the Jews, at the time, know it was only just myths? That is the problem. Especially for Fundamental-types of Christians, they have to take it all as the literal, infallible, inerrant word of God. They have to believe in a young Earth and Creation and the Flood and Jesus rising, physically, from the dead, or their theology and doctrines fall apart. So I'll put the Book of Mormon and the Bible in the same category... things that God and angels supposedly told people to write... or, things that people wrote and said it came from God and angels. Either one is okay with me, but I'm leaning to the latter.

 

[Flame]

God is a Spirit, He is everywhere at once, He knows everything, He can do anything, He can create anything, He created everything that exists, He knows the whole of human history from it's begging and He sees it end, He created the earth and He will destroy the earth, He chooses to save some, while He leaves other like your self in darkness and confusion, He reveals the truth to His chosen people and He hides it from others like yourself, He never had a beginning and He will never have an end so He has always existed, Nothing happens in the universe without His approval, He is outside of time and space, so He is not effected by any physical or natural things.

If you knew Him, you would fear Him. You will bow down and worship Him on judgement day and you will beg for mercy but He will show you no mercy and you will be cast into hell to be tormented in flames forever.

The only hope you have is to get on your knees now and repent and ask Jesus to save you. He will save you if you truly repent and trust Him lead you, this means that He becomes the Lord of your life and you will no longer have the last word in any matter. You will become His prisoner or slave, but it's a good thing because He will lead you into a great life and you will be rewarded with eternal paradise after this life is over.

So, you have two choices in this life. You either live life your way or Gods way, your way will lead you into eternal torment in hell, Gods way will lead you to eternal paradise. The offer is only available in this life, the offer will end as soon as you die so don't gamble with your eternal destiny.

Proselytizing is not welcome on the forums. Just a heads up.

 

[Dragonslayer]

I've been around several different Christian groups and what do they say? Why we are right and the other groups are wrong... and that they'll pray for those others that they will see the truth someday. And...they butt heads with each other over doctrinal differences. Are you from a Charismatic or Pentecostal Church? Then what do you tell Christians that don't believe the "gifts" are for today? Or, are you on the other side of that argument? Do you argue "Sola Scriptura" with Catholics? Or, do you just tell them they are going to hell? Either way, I'm sure what you do with them could be called "butting heads".

You say: "You don't know what Christianity is, Christians don't butt heads"? and to Unveiled Artist: "I know you better than you know yourself"? We all know you too. That's why we are looking into other religions, because if your form of Christianity is the truth, then maybe we don't believe in your version of God and Jesus. Who would be so cruel as to make a flawed Creation and then blame them for screwing up?

Yeah, yeah, I know that you can say that God made it perfect but then Adam and Eve messed it all up. But, did God know what would happen? Yes. And did he create it that way anyway? Yes. Did he know Satan would rebel? Yes. Did God know by casting Satan to Earth that he would successfully tempt Adam and Eve into sinning? Yes.

But did any of that really happen? Is it just Jewish religious mythology? They don't even believe it like you believe it. Satan is not even a major figure in the Jewish Bible. So your "literal" beliefs about your "Old Testament" are different than a Jew's literal belief in those same Scriptures. Why are you right and they're wrong? Because of the NT? And you probably say you believe the NT literally also. But I doubt it.

In Matthew, Jesus, yes Jesus himself says, that if your eye or your hand offends you... do what? Cut it off. Let's just worry about your eyes for now, 'cause if you're like most men, your eyes have looked at things that God didn't want you to look at. So, do you take Jesus' words literally and gouge out your eye? No, because you think about it. You ponder it and come to the conclusion that maybe he's being figurative. Exactly.

That's all Baha'is are saying. Some things that you believe are literal, maybe, just maybe, only figurative. Is that so hard or too wrong for you to do? To think that maybe how you were taught to interpret the Bible might be too extreme and too literal?

And, unless you're a 7th Day Adventist, another thing you don't take literal is the Commandment about keeping the Sabbath. Where I think it says to keep those Commandments for all their generations; it might even say forever. And Moses says that they aren't too hard to follow, but Paul says they are impossible to follow. But regardless, if God wanted the Commandments to be obeyed, most Christians don't take that literal and find a verse or two to get out of keeping the Sabbath Commandment. So, in all honesty, most Christians can't even say they follow the Ten Commandments.

So sure, tell us what you believe and why you believe. But a lot of us are doing the same with many of the other religious groups too... and not blindly following any one of them, especially the more extreme groups. Which, actually, for me, includes Fundamental Christians and the Baha'i Faith, because, in their more gentle way, are saying that they are the "only way" too.

There is only One true God and only one truth. God has given us His Word through Holy Scripture, He used His prophets to communicate with us so we know exactly what God told us.

The Bible is clear that we should let every man be a liar and let God be true, so we can refer to Gods Word to expose lies and hypocrisy. Only Gods chosen people believe His Word, those who reject His Word or twist it to mean something other than He intended are reprobate.

Every single true believer will arrive at the same conclusion, after they study Gods Word. Gods Holy Spirit indwells His chosen people and gives them the ability to rightly discern Holy Scripture, those who don't have the Holy Spirit will never understand the truth of Holy Scripture. They abide in deception, they have given themselves over to serve sin so the Holy Spirit will not indwell a defiled temple.

All of Gods elect believe His Word and understand it in it's intended context, and everyone else will draw to a false conclusion. There are only two types of people in the world, true believers and unbelievers, those who claim to believe number in the billions but they have been deceived into thinking they have the truth but they abide in the lies of the Devil.

God is the One who imparts the ability to believe and understand His Word correctly, no person can understand it or believe it correctly unless God gives them the ability so it has nothing to do with how smart a person is. It all depends on if you are chosen by God, the things of God are foolishness to those who God has chosen to leave in their natural sinful state.

 

[Dragonslayer]

You are not sharing the Gospel according to Jesus Christ, you are sharing the Gospel according to Paul, the Gospel according to the Church. That is a completely different Gospel than the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

You have been deceived by Satan and His Demons, Paul received the Holy Spirit and He spoke through Paul so everything Paul taught was from God. Paul never contradicted anything Jesus taught, you need to provide evidence if you are going to make such an outrageous accusation.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

God is a Spirit, He is everywhere at once, He knows everything, He can do anything, He can create anything, He created everything that exists, He knows the whole of human history from it's begging and He sees it end, He created the earth and He will destroy the earth, He chooses to save some, while He leaves other like your self in darkness and confusion, He reveals the truth to His chosen people and He hides it from others like yourself, He never had a beginning and He will never have an end so He has always existed, Nothing happens in the universe without His approval, He is outside of time and space, so He is not effected by any physical or natural things.

If you knew Him, you would fear Him. You will bow down and worship Him on judgement day and you will beg for mercy but He will show you no mercy and you will be cast into hell to be tormented in flames forever.

The only hope you have is to get on your knees now and repent and ask Jesus to save you. He will save you if you truly repent and trust Him lead you, this means that He becomes the Lord of your life and you will no longer have the last word in any matter. You will become His prisoner or slave, but it's a good thing because He will lead you into a great life and you will be rewarded with eternal paradise after this life is over.

So, you have two choices in this life. You either live life your way or Gods way, your way will lead you into eternal torment in hell, Gods way will lead you to eternal paradise. The offer is only available in this life, the offer will end as soon as you die so don't gamble with your eternal destiny.

That's silly. Im not swayed by this at all. Its a huge huge turnoff in evangalization and people leave jesus and god because of this stuff.

What is a spirit and how does it love?

I know what the bible says. What is the logistics in a spirit and how does it do anything???

 

[Dawnofhope]

You have been deceived by Satan and His Demons, Paul received the Holy Spirit and He spoke through Paul so everything Paul taught was from God. Paul never contradicted anything Jesus taught, you need to provide evidence if you are going to make such an outrageous accusation.

Just a quick note about the forum rules @Dragonslayer

9. Subverting/Undermining the Forum Mission
The mission of Religious Forums is to provide a civil, informative, respectful, and welcoming environment where people of diverse beliefs can discuss, compare, and debate. Content members create while debating and discussing must be done in the spirit of productivity. Bashing other forums, creating unproductive content or responses to others, attempting to use this site as a platform for campaigning for or against or furthering a personal agenda, and attempting to undermine the forum mission may result in moderation.

RF Rules

 

[Trailblazer]

You have been deceived by Satan and His Demons, Paul received the Holy Spirit and He spoke through Paul so everything Paul taught was from God. Paul never contradicted anything Jesus taught, you need to provide evidence if you are going to make such an outrageous accusation.

I have evidence, but I do not have time to type it up right now. Maybe I will type it later.
Paul changed Christianity and made it into His own religion. I have facts and citations.

 

[Dawnofhope]

I don't know much about Hinduism. Anandamurti rejects the religious theory of avatarism because it is illogical (and therefore invalid). I'm sure serious buddhists won't agree with the idea of Lord Buddha as a Hindu avatar.

You would need to explain why it is illogical. If viewed in regards to manifesting or incarnating, you will find it is quite a broad concept used in religions that are both Dharmic and Abrahamic.

Avatar - Wikipedia

Incarnation - Wikipedia

I agree that Buddhists would not use the avatar word in the way it is used in Hinduism or see the connection between Krishna and Buddha in an avatar of Vishnu way some Hindus do. However my point is sometimes a principle of one faith tradition can be applied another tradition if we look more closely at the concepts involved.

If you see Lord Shiva and Lord Krishna through the Bahai cosmological lense, then that would be possible.
The third and last Mahakaula was Anandamurti as He demonstrated several times during the 1950's and 1960's.

Thank you for making that clear. That is an incredibly bold claim of course, as is the Baha'i claim that Baha'u'llah is the Kalki avatar of Vishnu.

He did not mention any more instances of a Mahakaula or personifications of Taraka Brahma.
If they had been there I am sure He would have mentioned them or written extensively about them.
Buddhistic teachings are also mentioned in some of the writings of Anandamurti but Lord Buddha was no Mahakaula.

I suppose the next question would be what we would need to demonstrate that such a claim was true.

Here is an example of the criteria I would consider.

Can we prove or disprove the claims of any Messenger of God?

What are your criteria?

There is nothing elitist about the teachings of Ananda Marga, anyone who has a human body can learn the meditation lessons and do the kiirtana. Without following Yama and Niyama sadhana is impossible but there are no special requirements to learn the yoga and meditation system. For people who prefer prayers and ritualism over sadhana, there are many religions to choose from instead.

I would need to investigate the teachings of Ananda Marga more closely. If its is a system that an uneducated labourer from my country could follow I would accept that. From what I have read the theory and practice looks complicated. As an educated person I'm struggling with it, so others may as well. It is just my preliminary assessment and of course Baha'u'llah's writings take some getting used to.

Meditation is an essential part of the Baha'i faith. However we are free to choose how we approach that mediation without any formulaic guidance. We are free to use yoga or not and we don't see it as being essential.

Prayer is essential and obligatory for Baha'is. We can pray to the Manifestation of God, to God directly or through the Manifestation of God. In that sense there are perhaps parallels with Bhakti yoga in Hinduism, particularly as outlined in the Bhagavad Gita.

Bhakti yoga - Wikipedia

I became a vegetarian only about six months after I got my initiation into sadhana, you are stimulated to only practise what you understand or actually experience as useful or positive and not take anything for granted.

Interestingly I had a period of being vegetarian for about 2 years when I was practicing long periods of meditation morning and night. I do eat fish and chicken but continue to avoid red meat.

As you can see from the yantra (pratiik) of AMPS, the mission stresses a balance between "innercises and outercises" (service to humanity) and discourages a lifestyle of turning your back on the needs of society. There is no place in AMPS for people who want to stay in a cave in the Himalaya or in a jungle and forget about the practical world.
It was the social service side of Christianity that was integrated into AMPS, so there is no "otherworldliness" in the path and also monks and nuns are hard workers.

That makes sense and I am in agreement.

 

[Dragonslayer]

It is a great privilege to recognise Christ for certain. Your ideas about who is and isn’t a Christian and where the church begins and ends will change over time I hope. How long have you been a Christian?

I don’t believe for a second God has ever given you or anyone else the power and authority over the whole universe. Is that what you’ve been taught in your church? It sounds like something you would get out of too much gaming, certainly not out of the bible.



The problem with that approach is misunderstanding the sacrifice Jesus made and why. It leads to false complacency that you need make no further effort to work on being a better person tobe come genuinely Christ-like.



I had many faults before becoming a Christian, I had many faults when I was a Christian and have many faults now. I’ve never been a criminal nor someone whose consciencely wanted to hurt others so if you faith has made you a better person I’m all for it. I’ve seen too many religious hypocrites who don’t walk the talk.



I wasn’t expecting your acknowledgment but now you mention it, Jesus did speak of His Return and to turn to Him when that happened. For me Bahá’u’lláh is the Return of Christ. Your salvation may not be as assured as you think, especially if it leads to a belief you will rule over the universe.



You may wish to reassess how you stand in relation to your own words. It sounds like you've come from hell but your walk with Christ doesn't sound like any Christ I know and love from the bible.

God will give us Saints authority over all things in the universe. Some of us will rule over entire cities and some will have less authority but we will be given the ultimate authority over other creatures such as Angels and Demons. We can't yet imagine how much power we will receive, but it will be a lot to say the least.

As a saved person and Saint of God, I know that I don't need to do anything more to earn my salvation. It has been given to me already so, I have no fear of losing it and doing good works to earn it is out of the question because I already have it and nothing can change that fact.

All of my past present and all future sins have been paid for by Christ on the cross, I know that I will continue to sin everyday of my life until I die but all of my sins have been paid for so I have nothing to worry about. Most religions falsely claim that we must do all things to secure our promised salvation, but true believers know that our salvation is guaranteed no matter how much we sin.

I don't believe anyone who contradicts anything Jesus said or anything that the Bible says, I don't accept private interpretation of the scriptures by any person, you are presenting your view to me and I'm rejecting it and rebuking you as a false professor and a unbeliever. A true believer doesn't add or subtract anything from Holy Scripture, he receives it exactly as God meant it to be received.

God has hidden the truth meaning of Scripture from all those who are not His elect people, only the elect have been given the ability to truly understand Gods Word as He meant it to be understood, everyone else will fail to understand the true meaning of His Holy Word.

I recently converted to Christianity from Roman Catholicism, so I have been a Christian for 3 and a half years. God has revealed the truth to me and it has liberated me from bondage to deception, a deceived person is a prisoner and a slave to their sin. To believe in Christ liberates a person from bondage and gives that person eternal life in paradise and all the riches of the universe are given to him.

Christ will not share His glory with any other being, He demands nothing less than 100% commitment and 100% love and 100% obedience at all times. He demands that we forsake our family and friends if they get in the way of serving Him 100%, we must get rid of everyone and everything that hinders us from serving Him with 100% commitment.
99.9% is the same as Zero %, nothing short of 100% is acceptable so you can easily identify Gods people, because they put God above everything and everything they do and say is to serve Him.

 

[Dragonslayer]

That's silly. Im not swayed by this at all. Its a huge huge turnoff in evangalization and people leave jesus and god because of this stuff.

What is a spirit and how does it love?

I know what the bible says. What is the logistics in a spirit and how does it do anything???

A spirit is life itself, your body is a corpse without it's spirit. Gods Spirit gives you life, you die the very second He withdraws it from you and you find yourself standing before Him to give account of what you did with His Son.

God is Spirit and a Spirit is far more powerful than physical things, just look at a hurricane. It destroys everything in it's path yet you cant see the wind, Gods Spirit is what gives everything in the universe life. We have sinned and separated ourselves from Gods favor, so now we need to swat for our bread.

God came into the world into the person of His Son Jesus Christ, He paid for the sins of thew whole world but only those who trust in Him will be saved from hell. If you reject the free offer of salvation, then you deserve to spend eternity in hell.

Satan and His Demons were cast out of heaven down to the earth where they are busy deceiving people and causing them not to believe in Christ so they can all be cast into hell with them. Every person will be judged according to their relationship with Christ, all those who don't know Him as their savior will be cast into hell.

So, a spirit is powerful. If you have trouble believing in spirits, just think of emotions like love, anger, sadness, happiness, joy, sorrow and excitement. All of these are spiritual things, you can't physically touch them but they are very powerful.

 

[Dawnofhope]

So, if Joseph Smith is not a prophet according to the Baha'is, what about the Book of Mormon and the other things about the Church? It's a pretty profound story. But if it's all from the mind of a man, then how is it so successful... and why so many people believe in it, and follow it and are changed for the better? And, if the Book of Mormon is from a man, why not some or all of the stories of the Bible? Like, you know me, I think it's very probable that it is myth and legend.

How successful the Church of Jesus Christ of the latter day saints will become in the future, time will tell. They are seen as a small but significant group within Christianity.

List of Christian denominations by number of members - Wikipedia

Baha'is don't regard Joseph Smith as a prophet but we consider Jesus as a Manifestation of God. I really don't want to say too much more than that.

But, those myths and legends are meant to teach and guide the Jewish people to follow and obey certain rules. Rules that have been given the added authority of being from their God... a jealous and wrathful God that did get involved with their lives by doing things like sending fire from heaven and flooding the whole Earth. Since Baha'is believe those things are symbolic, we're not really saying things that are that much different. You say they didn't happen literally. I say they might be myths and legends.

Obviously as someone who holds Moses and Christ in high regard along with the Hebrew Bible and the New Testament that records their lives we will have a different emphasis.

But, did the Jews, at the time, know it was only just myths? That is the problem. Especially for Fundamental-types of Christians, they have to take it all as the literal, infallible, inerrant word of God. They have to believe in a young Earth and Creation and the Flood and Jesus rising, physically, from the dead, or their theology and doctrines fall apart. So I'll put the Book of Mormon and the Bible in the same category... things that God and angels supposedly told people to write... or, things that people wrote and said it came from God and angels. Either one is okay with me, but I'm leaning to the latter

Having a flexible approach that is mindful of modern biblical scholarship seems best.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

A spirit is life itself, your body is a corpse without it's spirit. Gods Spirit gives you life, you die the very second He withdraws it from you and you find yourself standing before Him to give account of what you did with His Son.

God is Spirit and a Spirit is far more powerful than physical things, just look at a hurricane. It destroys everything in it's path yet you cant see the wind, Gods Spirit is what gives everything in the universe life. We have sinned and separated ourselves from Gods favor, so now we need to swat for our bread.

God came into the world into the person of His Son Jesus Christ, He paid for the sins of thew whole world but only those who trust in Him will be saved from hell. If you reject the free offer of salvation, then you deserve to spend eternity in hell.

Satan and His Demons were cast out of heaven down to the earth where they are busy deceiving people and causing them not to believe in Christ so they can all be cast into hell with them. Every person will be judged according to their relationship with Christ, all those who don't know Him as their savior will be cast into hell.

So, a spirit is powerful. If you have trouble believing in spirits, just think of emotions like love, anger, sadness, happiness, joy, sorrow and excitement. All of these are spiritual things, you can't physically touch them but they are very powerful.

What do you mean by spirit is life itself? Whats its nature?

 

[Dawnofhope]

God will give us Saints authority over all things in the universe. Some of us will rule over entire cities and some will have less authority but we will be given the ultimate authority over other creatures such as Angels and Demons. We can't yet imagine how much power we will receive, but it will be a lot to say the least.

As a saved person and Saint of God, I know that I don't need to do anything more to earn my salvation. It has been given to me already so, I have no fear of losing it and doing good works to earn it is out of the question because I already have it and nothing can change that fact.

All of my past present and all future sins have been paid for by Christ on the cross, I know that I will continue to sin everyday of my life until I die but all of my sins have been paid for so I have nothing to worry about. Most religions falsely claim that we must do all things to secure our promised salvation, but true believers know that our salvation is guaranteed no matter how much we sin.

I don't believe anyone who contradicts anything Jesus said or anything that the Bible says, I don't accept private interpretation of the scriptures by any person, you are presenting your view to me and I'm rejecting it and rebuking you as a false professor and a unbeliever. A true believer doesn't add or subtract anything from Holy Scripture, he receives it exactly as God meant it to be received.

God has hidden the truth meaning of Scripture from all those who are not His elect people, only the elect have been given the ability to truly understand Gods Word as He meant it to be understood, everyone else will fail to understand the true meaning of His Holy Word.

I recently converted to Christianity from Roman Catholicism, so I have been a Christian for 3 and a half years. God has revealed the truth to me and it has liberated me from bondage to deception, a deceived person is a prisoner and a slave to their sin. To believe in Christ liberates a person from bondage and gives that person eternal life in paradise and all the riches of the universe are given to him.

Christ will not share His glory with any other being, He demands nothing less than 100% commitment and 100% love and 100% obedience at all times. He demands that we forsake our family and friends if they get in the way of serving Him 100%, we must get rid of everyone and everything that hinders us from serving Him with 100% commitment.
99.9% is the same as Zero %, nothing short of 100% is acceptable so you can easily identify Gods people, because they put God above everything and everything they do and say is to serve Him.

So looking at the OP question, is it valuable to learn about other faiths? Although you haven't directly answered the question, indirectly you have. You have indicated that there is no value in learning about other faiths and worldviews other than your own because you are right and everyone else is wrong. That's really all I was asking for with this thread. You obviously seem satisfied with your current choice of religion. You appear to be disinterested in engaging with anyone here other than telling them you are right and they are wrong. I can't see any point in continuing a discussion. All the best with your time on RF.

 

[Marcion]

You would need to explain why it is illogical. If viewed in regards to manifesting or incarnating, you will find it is quite a broad concept used in religions that are both Dharmic and Abrahamic.

I have explained it more than once on this forum.

I agree that Buddhists would not use the avatar word in the way it is used in Hinduism or see the connection between Krishna and Buddha in an avatar of Vishnu way some Hindus do. However my point is sometimes a principle of one faith tradition can be applied another tradition if we look more closely at the concepts involved.

If the founder does not claim any divine status, then who are you to stick it on him posthumously? I can understand why Bahai are eager to do these kind of things, but to me it seems a religious fantasy. Lord Buddha was a great soul, a very wise man, a Maharishi.

Thank you for making that clear. That is an incredibly bold claim of course, as is the Baha'i claim that Baha'u'llah is the Kalki avatar of Vishnu.
I suppose the next question would be what we would need to demonstrate that such a claim was true.
Here is an example of the criteria I would consider.

I will not comment on the criteria of the Bahai, that would not be a kind thing to do.

What are your criteria?

One important one has already been explained to you (Buddha and Bahaullah are no Mahakaulas)
The other ones can be found in the literature of AMPS some of which have been quoted on this forum (such as the one where the person needs to have possession of all the 'bhags', all the occult powers or he/she cannot be a Bhagavan). Another criterium is that He needs to have shown that He is fully knowledgable about all the important spiritual philosophy (without having studied it).

I would need to investigate the teachings of Ananda Marga more closely. If its is a system that an uneducated labourer from my country could follow I would accept that. From what I have read the theory and practice looks complicated. As an educated person I'm struggling with it, so others may as well. It is just my preliminary assessment and of course Baha'u'llah's writings take some getting used to.

Religious fundamentalism is quite easy to understand if you have an illogical mindset whereas spiritual philosophy is not always easy but more logical and systematic. There are many simple people in AMPS with less education but there is no need at all to be an intelectual or educated to follow the practices and in Tantra that is all that is important, the theoretical side is only supportive to a limited extent.

Meditation is an essential part of the Baha'i faith. However we are free to choose how we approach that mediation without any formulaic guidance. We are free to use yoga or not and we don't see it as being essential.

Prayer is essential and obligatory for Baha'is. We can pray to the Manifestation of God, to God directly or through the Manifestation of God. In that sense there are perhaps parallels with Bhakti yoga in Hinduism, particularly as outlined in the Bhagavad Gita.

It is perhaps not essential in Bahai because you are more a religion (more vedic cult) than a tantric cult like AMPS . AMPS is more like mystical Sufism. In AMPS the tantric cult is seen as more advanced than the vedic cult. People start approaching God in the vedic way and when they evolve more they develop the desire to find Him more through intuitional or introspective practices rather than through extrovertive practices.

Perhaps the Jewish prophets and maybe also Yeshua could be seen as the equivalents of Rishis? But I'm not at all sure about Muhammed or Bahaullah.
The Bahai ideas about prophets and successive manifestations remind me a little bit of the Mormon ideas except that the Bahai try to expand this type of thinking outside of their own religious sphere which is quite remarkable.
Also the Christians were doing this when they started projecting Jesus as someone whose authority trumped that of "earlier prophets".
They all do it in different ways just like different Hindu sects also have diverse ways of ordering their revered personalities (both mythical and historical ones).

 

[CG Didymus]

God will give us Saints authority over all things in the universe. Some of us will rule over entire cities and some will have less authority but we will be given the ultimate authority over other creatures such as Angels and Demons. We can't yet imagine how much power we will receive, but it will be a lot to say the least.

As a saved person and Saint of God, I know that I don't need to do anything more to earn my salvation. It has been given to me already so, I have no fear of losing it and doing good works to earn it is out of the question because I already have it and nothing can change that fact.

All of my past present and all future sins have been paid for by Christ on the cross, I know that I will continue to sin everyday of my life until I die but all of my sins have been paid for so I have nothing to worry about. Most religions falsely claim that we must do all things to secure our promised salvation, but true believers know that our salvation is guaranteed no matter how much we sin.

I don't believe anyone who contradicts anything Jesus said or anything that the Bible says, I don't accept private interpretation of the scriptures by any person, you are presenting your view to me and I'm rejecting it and rebuking you as a false professor and a unbeliever. A true believer doesn't add or subtract anything from Holy Scripture, he receives it exactly as God meant it to be received.

God has hidden the truth meaning of Scripture from all those who are not His elect people, only the elect have been given the ability to truly understand Gods Word as He meant it to be understood, everyone else will fail to understand the true meaning of His Holy Word.

I recently converted to Christianity from Roman Catholicism, so I have been a Christian for 3 and a half years. God has revealed the truth to me and it has liberated me from bondage to deception, a deceived person is a prisoner and a slave to their sin. To believe in Christ liberates a person from bondage and gives that person eternal life in paradise and all the riches of the universe are given to him.

Christ will not share His glory with any other being, He demands nothing less than 100% commitment and 100% love and 100% obedience at all times. He demands that we forsake our family and friends if they get in the way of serving Him 100%, we must get rid of everyone and everything that hinders us from serving Him with 100% commitment.
99.9% is the same as Zero %, nothing short of 100% is acceptable so you can easily identify Gods people, because they put God above everything and everything they do and say is to serve Him.

You don't accept any "private" interpretation of scriptures by any person? Then where did you get your interpretation? Nobody told you about what the NT taught about Jesus? You didn't read any books or commentaries?

The Baha'is have the same problem. They can't have people going around interpreting their scriptures in ways that they went meant to be interpreted. So, they have authoritative people that were authorized by their prophet. But who do Christians have? The Pope? Billy Graham? R.C. Sproul? or any other Christian Bible teacher or scholar? Or, is it just you and the Holy Spirit? Whatever you think the Holy Spirit is telling you? And then, I suppose, the Bible. But which translation? And beyond that, which Bibles in their original languages do you use? Do you go back to the fragments to check how reliable those Bibles are? Or, do you trust people and their study of the languages and their translations and their commentaries?

And then about commitment. A rich young ruler supposedly asked Jesus what he needed to do and Jesus told him to get rid of all his possessions and follow him. That man didn't do that. He walked away. How about you? Would you go that far? God also told another man to sacrifice his son. Would you go that far? Would you really think that was God's voice telling you to do that? And would you really follow that voice 100%? And, I already asked about plucking your eye out if it offends you. That Jesus saying that. Did he want people to follow 100% of everything he said to do? Or, was he being figurative and not literal?

It's great that your willing to be so committed, but are you 100% sure you are right and won't change your beliefs in some areas in the coming years? 'Cause, I've pointed out a couple of times, God changes the rules on those who wanted to believe 100%.

Suppose you were a Jew a few years before the time of Jesus, you'd be keeping the 10 commandments perfectly, or at least trying to. Suppose a neighbor of yours did some work on the Sabbath and you and some other witnessed it. To follow the law perfectly, wouldn't you be obligated to report him? And then what? Because of your report he was found guilty and stoned to death.

A few years later, Jesus is preaching on a mountainside and you believe he is the Messiah. A few years after that, you and other believers stop keeping the Sabbath. In fact, pretty much, you stop keeping most of the laws. 'Cause now you believe the law doesn't and can't save you. But a few years before that, you believed it was absolutely imperative to keep 100% of God's laws. What changed? It was God and what he wanted you to do and believe.

 

[Dragonslayer]

What do you mean by spirit is life itself? Whats its nature?

Nature is dead material, without God's sustaining spirit. All living things turn into corpses the second God withdraws His life giving spirit to them, everything depends on God for it's life every moment.

Gods Spirit is the only life source in the entire universe, every living thing relies on Him for every breath of life. He is the One who decides when you live and when you die and where you go after this life.

 

[Dragonslayer]

You don't accept any "private" interpretation of scriptures by any person? Then where did you get your interpretation? Nobody told you about what the NT taught about Jesus? You didn't read any books or commentaries?

The Baha'is have the same problem. They can't have people going around interpreting their scriptures in ways that they went meant to be interpreted. So, they have authoritative people that were authorized by their prophet. But who do Christians have? The Pope? Billy Graham? R.C. Sproul? or any other Christian Bible teacher or scholar? Or, is it just you and the Holy Spirit? Whatever you think the Holy Spirit is telling you? And then, I suppose, the Bible. But which translation? And beyond that, which Bibles in their original languages do you use? Do you go back to the fragments to check how reliable those Bibles are? Or, do you trust people and their study of the languages and their translations and their commentaries?

And then about commitment. A rich young ruler supposedly asked Jesus what he needed to do and Jesus told him to get rid of all his possessions and follow him. That man didn't do that. He walked away. How about you? Would you go that far? God also told another man to sacrifice his son. Would you go that far? Would you really think that was God's voice telling you to do that? And would you really follow that voice 100%? And, I already asked about plucking your eye out if it offends you. That Jesus saying that. Did he want people to follow 100% of everything he said to do? Or, was he being figurative and not literal?

It's great that your willing to be so committed, but are you 100% sure you are right and won't change your beliefs in some areas in the coming years? 'Cause, I've pointed out a couple of times, God changes the rules on those who wanted to believe 100%.

Suppose you were a Jew a few years before the time of Jesus, you'd be keeping the 10 commandments perfectly, or at least trying to. Suppose a neighbor of yours did some work on the Sabbath and you and some other witnessed it. To follow the law perfectly, wouldn't you be obligated to report him? And then what? Because of your report he was found guilty and stoned to death.

A few years later, Jesus is preaching on a mountainside and you believe he is the Messiah. A few years after that, you and other believers stop keeping the Sabbath. In fact, pretty much, you stop keeping most of the laws. 'Cause now you believe the law doesn't and can't save you. But a few years before that, you believed it was absolutely imperative to keep 100% of God's laws. What changed? It was God and what he wanted you to do and believe.

God appointed shepherds to lead us sheep and we hear the shepherds voice and follow. The shepherd is responsible for our souls before God, so he's not going to teach anything that's false or he knows that he will burn in hell forever if he did.

Every single elect person, will believe the truth when they hear it. We have been given the gift of the truth, Jesus said "I am the truth" so the truth is a person and His name is Jesus the Christ. So His elect are given the gift of the truth which indwells them in the person of the Holy Spirit, so they cannot be deceived because the Holy Spirit exposes every lie and false teaching.

The Bahais are just another cult or sect, there are many thousands of such false religions. Jesus warned us that many false prophets would come after Him and deceive all those who don't have the Holy Spirit. They will even try to deceive us but they will fail, so I have no fear of any powerful deity. My God has defeated all the other false gods, He has given us victory over all the dark powers of the universe so we have authority over them.

That incident with the young ruler was a specific case where the person was suffering with the disease of "the love of money". You can't serve the Lord while your god is mammon, you need to get rid of your false god before you can serve the true God. So Jesus commanded him to sell everything, that doesn't apply to me because my God is not mammon so I don't need to sell my possessions.

If God changes His rules, I will follow His new rules but He hasn't done it in my life time so I will continue to follow exactly what He has commanded me to follow. The canon of scripture was closed with the book of revelation, God has said everything He wanted to say to us so His Word has remained the same for every generation for the past 2000 years. I rebuke anyone who tries to add or remove a single word.

If I was a Jew just before Christ came, I would follow everything Christ taught. He came to fulfill the law on our behalf so we don't need to anymore, yes following Christ may cost my life but He's worth losing my life for.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Nature is dead material, without God's sustaining spirit. All living things turn into corpses the second God withdraws His life giving spirit to them, everything depends

The word and phrase (the) Nature (of something or someone) meaning the essense of what something is. Its identity or what makes it, he, she, etc who it or that person is. It is described as who that person or thing is apart from material things that is said to be its shell; the body.

So, what is the nature of god?

What is its identity that makes god a spirit and not something else?

Gods Spirit is the only life source in the entire universe, every living thing relies on Him for every breath of life. He is the One who decides when you live and when you die and where you go after this life.

That is its function. It is what it does.

But, what specifically is a life source?

What is its nature?

 

[Dragonslayer]

So looking at the OP question, is it valuable to learn about other faiths? Although you haven't directly answered the question, indirectly you have. You have indicated that there is no value in learning about other faiths and worldviews other than your own because you are right and everyone else is wrong. That's really all I was asking for with this thread. You obviously seem satisfied with your current choice of religion. You appear to be disinterested in engaging with anyone here other than telling them you are right and they are wrong. I can't see any point in continuing a discussion. All the best with your time on RF.

I have been instructed to learn as much as I can about other religions, particularly the more popular religions like Islam and Buddhism and Hinduism and Roman Catholicism. Our Pastor instructed us to learn about them them so we would know how to connect with people of those faiths when we share the Gospel of Jesus Christ with them.

Jesus commanded us to go into all the world and preach the gospel, I can see you hate Him and His Gospel but you are not alone, most of the world hates Christ and His people. It has been this way since the beginning, and it will remain that way until Jesus comes back to take revenge on all those who haven't given Him their lives.

Eternity is a very long time to burn in hot lava, I'm trying to warn people to avoid that fate. Everyone who hasn't given their life to Christ will be cast into that hot lava to be tormented forever. There's no more important or urgent message than how to avoid it.

People hate hearing the truth about themselves, they love listening to the lies of their enemy. The Bible warns us that this is exactly what would happen just before the return of Christ, we can see that the world is lost in confusion. Christ could came back at any moment to judge the whole world, He will not accept any excuses when you face Him. People will see a different Jesus this time, He's not coming back as a savior, He's coming back to take revenge on all those who rejected Him.

I have listened to your views, you told me about your religion and I told you what Christ said about all other religions. He does not tolerate other faiths, He will cast all those who rejected Him into the lase of fire.

I would rather be hated for telling you the truth than loved for lying to you and seeing you end up in hell. You take my love and turn it into hatred, because the truth is not in you. If Christ was in you, then you would love the truth. I told you it's not too late to repent, so it's up to you. Your choice has eternal consequences so choose wisely.