Why religion terrifies me.

[des]

so ,your religion doesn't encourage you to defend yourself ? :sarcastic

Well *Jesus* really didn't encourage this.(Love them that curse you, turn the other cheek, etc.). That said I don't know too many Christians that would NOT defend themselves. And some of them seem to like to go on the aggressive. (GWB for instance).


--des

 

[Muffled]

I don't know if this belongs in the debate forum, I couldn't really figure out where to place it. I wanted to write this because I want people to understand why I write the way I do, think the way I think. I do so because as a non-believer I am terrified of religion.

I am not afraid to say it, religion scares the hell out of me, no pun intended.

The reason it scares me is very simple: What a person believes happens to them after death invariably affects their opinion of it, and thus their ethics. This is the source of my fear. Let me explain.

I am an Agnostic, which means that I do not believe in god, or gods, but I do not claim to know there isn't one. I do not know all, I have never been presented with evidence that convinces me there is one, or with evidence that proves there is not. Therefore, I expect to live 1 life, and hope to live beyond my death in one form or another (Reincarnation, heaven, even hell would probably be better than nothingness.) Key word is hope, all evidence so far points to the fact that this is my only life. When I die, I'm gone. I hope that my dead mother is in the arms of a benevolent loving caring god, and that she is happy beyond measure, but I do not know that she is. No one does, as much as they may claim too. Being as that I have one life, my only life, this greatly influences my ethics. I very strongly believe in preserving life, not to the extreme of pacifism, if someone tries to kill me I will kill them if possible. I have no reason to end my own life in the service of any cause, because it is the only one I have. Religion however, at least most religions I've heard of, present an afterlife, or some form of continuation after death. That is the draw of religion, it offers and explanation of that which we do not understand, and death ranks #1 on that list. That is why I am terrified of religion. 99.9% of religious people, maybe even more, would never dream of harming me, because they do not think killing me would benefit them in any real way. Killing me would result in a stain on their soul against god, thus either damning them to hell, or whatever negative consequences their religion offers. However, that one guy, one person who either misinterprets his religious teachings, or truly believes them correctly (What mortal is to say they have the right interpretation?) decides that my very existence is blasphemous to their deity. They strap a bomb to their chest. They kill me and half a city block. Now I'm dead, my only life snuffed out. Done.

Now I know that there are other reasons for people to want to kill someone else, though religion ranks very very very high on that list. And I fear that when my life and the life of my loved ones hinges on my ability to instill a greater reason for the killer to live, rather than what his invisible perhaps non-existent benefactor has to offer, I stand no chance, none whatsoever. How could anything I promise, plead, or beg for sound better to them then eternal paradise next to a loving deity, their every whim answered? The sad truth is, it can't. And more frightening now is that instead of a city block, it may be a whole city, or more.

Do not assume that I am saying I think you are a backwards thinking crazy person because you have faith in a higher power. That was not the point, just realize you scare the hell out of me, because I do not and cannot understand why you think the way you do. Thank you, if anyone has any similar sentiments or comments let me know, I want to know if there is anyone else who thinks like I do, or thinks I'm an idiot because I think like I do

I doubt that you haven't been presented evidence. What is more likely is that you have chosen to not accept or believe the evidence.

I once considered the prospect of this being my only life. I did not find it to be a cause of fear. For me there was no harm done if there was no further life because I wouldn't be around to worry about it. Since I did not bring myself into existence, I have no real reason to feel compelled to continue that existence. I think what you are most likely experiencing is a God given instinct for self preservation. Without God there is no purpose for a life. Without God it makes no difference whether you live or die. Why do you think it is valuable to you to remain alive?

 

[neves]

"if you don't have the answer, look for it."... I think you said it best... and I most honestly hope you do find it... I know your not sure about god... but I am... and I prayed that you do indeed find the answers your looking for...

 

[roli]

I do look up at the heavens in awe, and this entire world. I just don't understand how people believe that all this, this absolutely awe inspiring wonderous place is A. Just a stepping stone to the real place we're going and B. Barely worthy of investigation. I look at it this way:

If I was god (here come the slings and arrows!), I am all knowing, all seeing, all powerful, all wise. Would I create a universe, place souls I created solely for the purpose of loving me and judge them? Or would I try to create companions, I would imagine an all-powerful being would be able to do anything but one thing, and that is create himself. If there is a god, it just seems more feasible to me that yes he created all this, but just so that we could worship him? Absolutely not, investigate! That's why he gave us such brilliant minds, the ability to question, adapt, learn. To create life just to judge it seems like such an abuse of power, and frankly if the biblical god is truly lord of the universe, I willfully deny him because he has done things that in my free will and interpretation of his universe deems to be wrong. Therefore I would greet him as a fellow being, but not as something worthy of worship. Worship implies slavery, I love my parents, but I do not worship him. Worship and love are mutually exclusive in my mind.

Aasimar,I hear where your coming from and agree that it is difficult to comprehend some of the tenants of Christianity, but I think if we were meant to live with God ,fellowship with him and we messed up and broke that relationship or should I say our decendants, Adam/Eve did and we inhereited it,could you quite possibly see how we will forever be trying to find that place of true peace,hope and purpose.
Mind you many if not most usually find Jesus Christ and God through Him by experiencing some very perilous times along life's path.
It seems to take a tragedy ,misfortune for many to turn to God, 911 was an example ,the people filled the churches for 1 or 2 months then returned back to noraml, church leaders could not believe the influx of people.
People who never enetered church before,showing up, hopeless,in despair, void of any answers to such atrocities.
God did not create man oringianlly to judge them,that sounds ludicrous and most absurd, we were created in his image ,but when disobedience was carried out ,the nature of man fell away and needed to be redeemed.That is the whole objective of the scriptures which point to a Savior.
He claims in scripture he created us to worship him not as robots but as those in a love relationship.
Love ,last time I checked was a choice,I don't force my wife to love me by threatening her,or through intimidation.
God created us to choose to love him,sin came in defiled man and creation and we live in a fallen nature destined to rebell against authority and indulge in our fleshly carnal appetites and lusts

Agnostic =from the Greek a, meaning "without", and Gnosticism or gnosis, meaning knowledge)
It is without knowledge one is agnostic.
So what your saying is that your ignorant of knowledge or a lack thereof that points to a creator
I think it's free will he gave us to choose him or other gods and then expereince his outpouring of love and relationship and restoration.
The world is so full of opposition to God ,the influences and world views far outweigh those of Jesus day and restoration is very difficult in our philosophical and humanistic society,where man is god and we become createor's of our destiny .
To tell man there is a God who wants them to turn to him and serve him but they must be willing to give up their carnal pleasures to find purpose and redemption,is like asking a dog not to chase a cat

Man's struggle in turning to or trusting in God has always been in the arena of logic,intellect and last but not least ,ego.
Man has always trusted in the fact that what is seen can only be believed.
God's premise is without faith no one can please God.
Faith is first,experience follows,all the scientific and empirical proof will never be enough to convince a skeptic.
Yet we live in this world under principals and laws that are invisible and govern our very existence and we come to the conclusion we must live within them and accept them not because we clearly understand them, but because we can't change it.
It's a given and we learn to work within them laws
God's word to us is that the gospel message is the power of God unto salvation,not the gospel of the scientific facts or the opinions of man.
Faith lays down all refutations,logic,evidence and everything else that is associated with self and contrary to God.

God says just from what is created men will be without excuse in Romans1
If that is the case and this statement is true ,
the question is not where is God but why is one not looking to the things that exist naturally that prove his existence.

 

[Wandered Off]

Without God there is no purpose for a life.

We can't use our God-given free will to determine our own purpose?

Without God it makes no difference whether you live or die.

It makes no difference to whom?

 

[HopefulNikki]

We can't use our God-given free will to determine our own purpose?

By admitting that free will is God-given, you admit that the purpose we derive through that will is ultimately from God as well.

 

[The Seeker]

Without God there is no purpose for a life. Without God it makes no difference whether you live or die. Why do you think it is valuable to you to remain alive?

I strongly disagree. I have determined my own purpose and don't need a god to tell me what to do with my life. It is valuable for me to remain alive because I happen to love my life and have a son that I have a responsibility to raise.

 

[Wandered Off]

By admitting that free will is God-given, you admit that the purpose we derive through that will is ultimately from God as well.

Yes, to the extent that God is the source for everything. I see 'God-given' and 'controlled by God' as different. God could have set up an environment that allows us to choose our own purpose (free will). Of course, our choices are limited by our environment, so I guess you could read in some control there.

 

[InstigaterL7]

In my personal opinion, most religions are based upon the fear of the uknown and the unexplainable. Science can not prove it and it is not obvious to the human eye, so we must come to terms with a religious belief already in existance that is ideal to us. This de-mistifies death and offersa solution to these fears. Religion also serves the purpose of helping the loved ones of those who have passed on and offers them the comfort that they feel others can not give them. It gives them control over a situation that has spiraled out of their hands.
Charlie

 

[UnTheist]

Without God there is no purpose for a life.

That is mere ignorance. I am living without God and I am finding many reasons to live.

 

[lew0049]

If you find no meaning in death, then you cannot find meaning to life. It is that simple. Yeah, you might find moral responsibilities or things that give you pleasure as your meaning to life - but morality is not the underlying meaning to life.

 

[roli]

That is mere ignorance. I am living without God and I am finding many reasons to live.

The fact that your living is not evidence that your making it happen,your only living because God allows it.
You don't control any bodily function that causes you to live ,you are under laws and someday you will expire & die,it is out of your control ,that day could be any day as a matter of fact.

God created us to live forever,maybe your arguement is I don't want to live forever.
Regardless,we were created to live forever in relationship with God,sin separated that relationship.
It is in him we live and move and have our being, and it is through him we can live forever and the only reason your living now is that he is giving you time to turn to him and trust him as Savior.

 

[sojourner]

I don't know if this belongs in the debate forum, I couldn't really figure out where to place it. I wanted to write this because I want people to understand why I write the way I do, think the way I think. I do so because as a non-believer I am terrified of religion.

I am not afraid to say it, religion scares the hell out of me, no pun intended.

The reason it scares me is very simple: What a person believes happens to them after death invariably affects their opinion of it, and thus their ethics. This is the source of my fear. Let me explain.

I am an Agnostic, which means that I do not believe in god, or gods, but I do not claim to know there isn't one. I do not know all, I have never been presented with evidence that convinces me there is one, or with evidence that proves there is not. Therefore, I expect to live 1 life, and hope to live beyond my death in one form or another (Reincarnation, heaven, even hell would probably be better than nothingness.) Key word is hope, all evidence so far points to the fact that this is my only life. When I die, I'm gone. I hope that my dead mother is in the arms of a benevolent loving caring god, and that she is happy beyond measure, but I do not know that she is. No one does, as much as they may claim too. Being as that I have one life, my only life, this greatly influences my ethics. I very strongly believe in preserving life, not to the extreme of pacifism, if someone tries to kill me I will kill them if possible. I have no reason to end my own life in the service of any cause, because it is the only one I have. Religion however, at least most religions I've heard of, present an afterlife, or some form of continuation after death. That is the draw of religion, it offers and explanation of that which we do not understand, and death ranks #1 on that list. That is why I am terrified of religion. 99.9% of religious people, maybe even more, would never dream of harming me, because they do not think killing me would benefit them in any real way. Killing me would result in a stain on their soul against god, thus either damning them to hell, or whatever negative consequences their religion offers. However, that one guy, one person who either misinterprets his religious teachings, or truly believes them correctly (What mortal is to say they have the right interpretation?) decides that my very existence is blasphemous to their deity. They strap a bomb to their chest. They kill me and half a city block. Now I'm dead, my only life snuffed out. Done.

Now I know that there are other reasons for people to want to kill someone else, though religion ranks very very very high on that list. And I fear that when my life and the life of my loved ones hinges on my ability to instill a greater reason for the killer to live, rather than what his invisible perhaps non-existent benefactor has to offer, I stand no chance, none whatsoever. How could anything I promise, plead, or beg for sound better to them then eternal paradise next to a loving deity, their every whim answered? The sad truth is, it can't. And more frightening now is that instead of a city block, it may be a whole city, or more.

Do not assume that I am saying I think you are a backwards thinking crazy person because you have faith in a higher power. That was not the point, just realize you scare the hell out of me, because I do not and cannot understand why you think the way you do. Thank you, if anyone has any similar sentiments or comments let me know, I want to know if there is anyone else who thinks like I do, or thinks I'm an idiot because I think like I do

I haven't read the whole thread, but it seems to me that it's not religion that you're afraid of. You're afraid of misguided fanatics who twist religions to suit their own agendas, and who perpetrate crimes upon people in the name of those religions.

 

[UnTheist]

The fact that your living is not evidence that your making it happen,your only living because God allows it.

You can't prove that I'm not making it happen.

God created us to live forever,maybe your arguement is I don't want to live forever.
Regardless,we were created to live forever in relationship with God,sin separated that relationship.
It is in him we live and move and have our being, and it is through him we can live forever and the only reason your living now is that he is giving you time to turn to him and trust him as Savior.

Nothing more than your beliefs. I am living because everything else that has DNA lives.

 

[lew0049]

"Nothing more than your beliefs. I am living because everything else that has DNA lives."
Interesting - I didn't know anyone claimed God was "alive" therefore needing DNA. So tell me, do you believe that there are rainbows? Is there evidence that a rainbow exists?

 

[Muffled]

We can't use our God-given free will to determine our own purpose?

It makes no difference to whom?

You can have your own purposes within a life but you can't use your free will to obtain a life and you can't choose your own environment or temporal events or the reason you have that environment and those events.

To anyone. To the person in the OP it makes a difference while he is alive but if there is no afterlife, it will make no difference to him then because He won't be alive to perceive a difference. After 10,000 years no one will remember that this person ever existed.

 

[lew0049]

The meaning of life is not based solely on morality. When you break down the true meaning of morality it is simply a mechanism for survival. Basically, a reason to live. Reasons to live does not encompass your meaning to life. Instead, even if you look at life from a morality perspective, you must realize that you will make the wrong decisions sometimes because we are human. Thus, the reason why so many are opposed to Christianity is that TRUE Christianity requires complete humbleness.
How is it possible to believe that your life is summed up by the inherent good/bad decisions you make? Logically, this makes no sense.

 

[Muffled]

The meaning of life is not based solely on morality. When you break down the true meaning of morality it is simply a mechanism for survival. Basically, a reason to live. Reasons to live does not encompass your meaning to life. Instead, even if you look at life from a morality perspective, you must realize that you will make the wrong decisions sometimes because we are human. Thus, the reason why so many are opposed to Christianity is that TRUE Christianity requires complete humbleness.
How is it possible to believe that your life is summed up by the inherent good/bad decisions you make? Logically, this makes no sense.

I don't agree with this statement. You can tell God where to get off as long as it isn't a big issue for Him. I wouldn't make it a habit though unless you have a good relationship with God.

It isn't that simple. In an evil world it is possible for those who are good not to survive. It is often the case that morality gives us a better shot at a longer and happier life.