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Why so unpleasant?

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
And you probably won't, but the feeling is there, sometimes just barely disguised. There are definitely people who take pride on being the ones with the correct, "non-damned" faith. That is why Left Behind makes any commercial success at all. It would tank big time if there weren't people with that obnoxious mentality.

I don't see that animosity at all....except for the kooks on the fringe. I don't judge a group by the nasty few. The Xtians I know don't want me to suffer.
They want to help me overcome my spiritual inadequacies precisely because they want to save me from suffering. The poor misguided believers...at
least their heart is in the right place. How can I fault'm for that?

Leaving aside the last sentense, I want to say that certainty may be a menace for critical thinking, but it sure has social uses. People with certainty are more appealing and have a far better chance of breeding and even of being listened to.

An unfortunate fact of social psychology, for sure. But a real one.

I don't buy that at all. One can believe things & hold values without being certain, & function quite well. The lack of certainty allows one to change
one's mind when appropriate. Look at how discussion degrades in this forum when a poster is obsessed with being right. Once we accept that our
opinions are just our opinions, it opens us to alternatives, & is less combative/threatening to others. Besides, just what can one say one is absolutely
right about, & that anyone who disagrees is absolutely wrong? (No fair using a priori stuff like math.)
 
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Reverend Rick

Frubal Whore
Premium Member
I am fortunate I leant to think for myself after my fundamentalist childhood, but it has still left me with mental scars that remain with me to this day!

The best revenge is living well. Make the most of the rest of your life instead of letting the past ruin your future.

I'm serious here, is it possible for you wounds to heal?
 

Misty

Well-Known Member
The best revenge is living well. Make the most of the rest of your life instead of letting the past ruin your future.

I'm serious here, is it possible for you wounds to heal?

I am making the most of my life, I have wonderful children and hobbies which I enjoy. However, my childhood is only a phone call away, when a certain old lady reminds me that she will be in heaven and I won't. Whilst the thought is pleasing, that I won't have her company for eternity, it still has the effect of setting my teeth on edge!
 

LuisDantas

Aura of atheification
Premium Member
Revoltingest, I can only say that I would love to reach the same conclusions that you do, but facts keep getting in the way.
 

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
Revoltingest, I can only say that I would love to reach the same conclusions that you do, but facts keep getting in the way.

Facts are over-rated & must not be trusted too much.
What are the incontrovertible facts anyway?
 
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Wotan

Active Member
I am making the most of my life, I have wonderful children and hobbies which I enjoy. However, my childhood is only a phone call away, when a certain old lady reminds me that she will be in heaven and I won't. Whilst the thought is pleasing, that I won't have her company for eternity, it still has the effect of setting my teeth on edge!

Misty, consider the source.:D
 

Reverend Rick

Frubal Whore
Premium Member
I am making the most of my life, I have wonderful children and hobbies which I enjoy. However, my childhood is only a phone call away, when a certain old lady reminds me that she will be in heaven and I won't. Whilst the thought is pleasing, that I won't have her company for eternity, it still has the effect of setting my teeth on edge!

Good for you Misty! Seriously, if I where in your shoes, I would be the bigger person and try to forgive your Mother for your raising.

Just for a moment, try to consider that right or wrong, she wants what she believes to be the best for you. No matter how misguided she may be, in her own way I believe she loves you. A Mothers love can be misguided some times.

You don't have to agree with someone to forgive them. If anything, do it for your own inner peace so you can put these inner demons to rest.

If my advice offends you, please accept my sincere apology.
 

Misty

Well-Known Member
Good for you Misty! Seriously, if I where in your shoes, I would be the bigger person and try to forgive your Mother for your raising.

Just for a moment, try to consider that right or wrong, she wants what she believes to be the best for you. No matter how misguided she may be, in her own way I believe she loves you. A Mothers love can be misguided some times.

You don't have to agree with someone to forgive them. If anything, do it for your own inner peace so you can put these inner demons to rest.

If my advice offends you, please accept my sincere apology.

You haven't offended me of course. I wonder though if you were unfortunate enough to have the 'pleasure' of her company if you would feel quite the same? Once you had fought down the urge to commit murder, I reckon you might utter some very naughty words when you had stopped beating your head against wall. She has that effect on most people including members of her church and clergy person.
 
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Zadok

Zadok
I will admit that as I have experienced life and traveled to many places I have encountered some unpleasant people. As a “Mormon” I have discovered that we are not the most popular item in the crowd or party. I have served in the military during a time of conflict – I have looked into the eyes of someone trying to kill me.

But for all the unpleasantness I have also discovered incredible compassion in complete strangers. I have seen individuals that have every excuse to return unpleasantness for unpleasantness instead return kindness when it was most unexpected. I have seen the noble acts of kindness change the bitterest landscapes. I believe there are enough unnecessary suffering here and now that I do not look forward for anyone to be in hell. I do not think I will be happy in heaven with anyone that enjoys the suffering of even the most deserving.

As I have come to this forum I realize that many will not like my opinions. In truth my intension has been to comfort the afflicted and afflict the comfortable. Not to sorrow but for the comfortable but to look past all the bad, evil crappy stuff that afflict us – Get over all stuff of contention and see something good and do something kind. Extend kindness where there is bitterness. Yah – I know the old, point out faults, gets more praise, attention and agreement. But think about it. When was the last time we thanked anyone for criticism? When was the last time we saught rejection for a random kindness.

Zadok
 
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Eliot Wild

Irreverent Agnostic Jerk
The cross is offensive and that is about as unpleasant as it gets. Light is offensive to the dark.


Actually, there are some people who find the message within some versions of Christianity to be inherently offensive. I realize there are countless perspectives on the practice of Christianity, so it is unfair to generalize. But let me give you an example of what I'm talking about when referring to some versions of Christianity.

Some Christians hold the following to be true:

1. That everyone is unworthy of redemption through their own acts. That we are all wretched sinners who require spiritual salvation in order to connect with the divine creator and engineer of the universe. This can be quite offensive to a person who truly tries their best to be a good person, who never lies or cheats or steals or attempts to harm others, who is generous rather than selfish, who is merciful rather than hostile, who is tolerant rather than judgmental, who truly and sincerely tries to treat everyone the way they'd like to be treated. A person who behaves like this only to be told by certain Christians that their deeds still fall short of the glory of God . . . that can be offensive.

2. Most Christians hold to the belief that all humans are currently paying for the sin of Adam. Modern rationality tends to indicate that every individual should be evaluated personally on their own merit and not unfairly judged based on the behavior of another. Yet most Christians claim all humans since Adam are guilty of something that they didn't even do. That is offensive to some people. They find it insulting and irrational to be held morally responsible for something they themselves did not do, for an act they themselves did not commit.

3. Also, many Christians, and this is especially true for fundamentalists, believe there is only one mechanism for receiving spiritual redemption. They believe there is only one valid doctrine, only one divinely inspired text, only one dogmatic avenue for attaining salvation and if someone refuses to accept this singular way then they are bound for a firey eternal hell of pain and torment. Uhhhh, that tends to offend some people, as crazy as that may sound. Many Christians provide no provision in their dogma that others might be equally correct in their own faith.

So, I would respectfully disagree. The cross is just an image, a mere symbol, though I realize there are many Christians who idolize it and grant it a material status above symbolic representation. But I can see how how some others might find an offensive arrogance underlying the very belief system of certain Christians who provide that no others could possibly be 'right' with God if they don't hold to these Christian teachings.
 

logician

Well-Known Member
Quite a number of fundamentalist Christians seem to be highly unpleasant, not all of course. By fundamentalist I mean those who think only the so called 'saved' go to heaven, the rest of us to hell. I have come across quite a number of times on forums of this nature, the sentiment expressed by fundies that they will enjoy watching the 'unsaved' burning in the proverbial lake of fire. If there is a life after death in which Jesus features, I wonder if they might be in for a nasty shock if they discover Jesus doesn't want them for his buddies?

The main thing I dislike about evangelistic Christians (or any religion) is there are those that try to push their religion in non-religious settings. For example, I have had more than one representive of some construction company that we hired to do some work go on and on about how they love Jesus, etc. etc. This is very inappropriate in my opinion. I don't stand there pushing my lack of belief in a god on them.
 

Nerthus

Wanderlust
The main thing I dislike about evangelistic Christians (or any religion) is there are those that try to push their religion in non-religious settings. For example, I have had more than one representive of some construction company that we hired to do some work go on and on about how they love Jesus, etc. etc. This is very inappropriate in my opinion. I don't stand there pushing my lack of belief in a god on them.

Yeah, I'm the same. If people want to hear about Jesus, then I don't mind them talking about it - but when it's just anywhere and everywhere it's too much. Especially when they already know that you don't want them to preach at you. But, their argument is that they have to tell you, because it would be unloving not to.
 

Misty

Well-Known Member
The main thing I dislike about evangelistic Christians (or any religion) is there are those that try to push their religion in non-religious settings. For example, I have had more than one representive of some construction company that we hired to do some work go on and on about how they love Jesus, etc. etc. This is very inappropriate in my opinion. I don't stand there pushing my lack of belief in a god on them.

I agree
 

Misty

Well-Known Member
Yeah, I'm the same. If people want to hear about Jesus, then I don't mind them talking about it - but when it's just anywhere and everywhere it's too much. Especially when they already know that you don't want them to preach at you. But, their argument is that they have to tell you, because it would be unloving not to.

It is unloving to bang on about something, for which there is no evidence, when clearly their audience is uninterested.
 
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