Why suicide is always okay all of the time

[psychedelicsoul]

If I am morally required not to kill myself for the sake of people loving me, then does that mean if the majority of people hate me I'm morally obligated to kill myself?

Well, I don't think so. Why? Because morality only exists when one thing is done to another. Self-harm, suicide, and low self-esteem are all universally right, simply because they don't directly affect others. This is because morality is subjective.
Now, if I feel suicide is okay, and you feel it isn't... Who should have more authority on the issue? The person feeling that way or some onlooker? How can you apply your believe that suicide is wrong on other people.

And if you wanna say, "It'll affect your loved ones"... who decides how much a persons life is worth? I believe that an individual and that individual alone decide how much they matter. Your loved ones don't matter. Your life belongs 100% to you.

 

[Kilgore Trout]

Current, human, world population: 7.37 billion.

Reason enough.

 

[picnic]

I used to think that suicide was an individual choice and right, but now I think it's more complicated. Individuals have a duty to society and society has a duty to individuals. When a person is feeling depressed it's obvious that society is not taking its duty seriously enough.

 

[psychedelicsoul]

I used to think that suicide was an individual choice and right, but now I think it's more complicated. Individuals have a duty to society and society has a duty to individuals. When a person is feeling depressed it's obvious that society is not taking its duty seriously enough.

It's not the rest of the worlds responsibility to solve your problems. Nor is it your responsibility to help the rest of the world. You should live for yourself and not care about society.

 

[Quintessence]

I used to think that suicide was an individual choice and right, but now I think it's more complicated. Individuals have a duty to society and society has a duty to individuals. When a person is feeling depressed it's obvious that society is not taking its duty seriously enough.

This isn't dissimilar to where I stand on the issue. No biological organism exists within a vacuum. It is always part of a community. And while it is arguable whether or not there is any duty to be considerate of that community (such is up to your own personal code of honor in the end), it is much less arguable that wisdom rests in giving due consideration to one's impact on the community. This is the case not just for issues like suicide, but for pretty much any sort of behavior of any organism. Individual behaviors impact community, and the community impacts individuals. It's all interconnected.

 

[Revoltingest]

Current, human, world population: 7.37 billion.

Reason enough.

Seems like only yesterday it was just 7.36 billion.
We do have too many people here.
But I digress.
We each own our own lives.
We may continue or end'm as we see fit.

 

[Brickjectivity]

It is natural to desire to die; but just because it is natural does not make it 'OK'. It was ok maybe 20,000 years ago when that was a mechanism that helped humanity to survive, but its no longer a useful mechanism. Society should take note and try to address the problems that a person is having. It is an individual's choice, because you cannot keep someone from killing themselves. They really have to be a law for themselves, but you can try and save the person by making them feel better. It is an individual who decides to live, but society should value individuals and make us want to live.

 

[psychedelicsoul]

It is natural to desire to die; but just because it is natural does not make it 'OK'. It was ok maybe 20,000 years ago when that was a mechanism that helped humanity to survive, but its no longer a useful mechanism. Society should take note and try to address the problems that a person is having. It is an individual's choice, because you cannot keep someone from killing themselves. They really have to be a law for themselves, but you can try and save the person by making them feel better. It is an individual who decides to live, but society should value individuals and make us want to live.

I think it's wrong to stop someone from committing suicide by force. However, if you wanna try and convince them not to it's okay, so long as you don't violate their free will

 

[Kilgore Trout]

Seems like only yesterday it was just 7.36 billion.
We do have too many people here.
But I digress.
We each own our own lives.
We may continue or end'm as we see fit.

One way or anther, I suppose, we'll be committing a type of suicide (if not as individuals, then as a population) if we continue to let the population grow unchecked, as some type of die-off seems somewhat inevitable.

 

[Revoltingest]

One way or anther, I suppose, we'll be committing a type of suicide (if not as individuals, then as a population) if we continue to let the population grow unchecked, as some type of die-off seems somewhat inevitable.

Worse yet, we'll be committing loss of quality & diversity of life.
Death isn't as bad as the Earth becoming a less interesting & enjoyable place.

 

[AnnaCzereda]

Your loved ones don't matter.

That's a pity because they should matter. If you have a family or friends, your suicide will affect them even if you think there is no one there who cares for you. My acquaintance was mentally ill, she spent most of her time in the mental hospital. She had no family as she was an orphan and no friends except one girl whom she shared the flat with. One day she decided to finish with herself and overdosed on her meds. Her friend was totally devastated.

 

[psychedelicsoul]

That's a pity because they should matter. If you have a family or friends, your suicide will affect them even if you think there is no one there who cares for you. My acquaintance was mentally ill, she spent most of her time in the mental hospital. She had no family as she was an orphan and no friends except one girl whom she shared the flat with. One day she decided to finish with herself and overdosed on her meds. Her friend was totally devastated.

They matter as much as you think they matter. Sure it'll make them feel bad. But that doesn't mean they decide the value of my life.

Plus, if I killed myself without giving those around me a second thought, then obviously they must not have meant that much to me.

 

[Brickjectivity]

I think it's wrong to stop someone from committing suicide by force. However, if you wanna try and convince them not to it's okay, so long as you don't violate their free will

Its borderline to me. How can it be wrong to stop someone, yet it is presumptuous of the laws to 'Outlaw' suicide as if they have some sort of domain over it. They can't. They are exercising authority that they don't have. Laws are not people and so they shouldn't intervene in that, but people should. What I mean is if I see you killing yourself it should be legal for me to stop you, but there shouldn't be a law against suicide.

 

[psychedelicsoul]

Its borderline to me. How can it be wrong to stop someone, yet it is presumptuous of the laws to 'Outlaw' suicide as if they have some sort of domain over it. They can't. They are exercising authority that they don't have. Laws are not people and so they shouldn't intervene in that, but people should. What I mean is if I see you killing yourself it should be legal for me to stop you, but there shouldn't be a law against suicide.

I think it should be legal for you to stop me from killing myself. However, I don't think it's morally right as it would violate my free will

 

[picnic]

It's not the rest of the worlds responsibility to solve your problems. Nor is it your responsibility to help the rest of the world. You should live for yourself and not care about society.

A Christian missionary named Daniel Everett went to the Piraha tribe who are noteworthy for their lack of superstitions.

And as you know — anybody who’s got the remotest connection with the Christian church — giving a testimony is supposed to be a powerful thing. You talk about how once I was blind and now I see, how I went from this very bad background to this very good person that I am today.

So I gave them my testimony and I told them about my stepmother committing suicide. When I got done telling them, they all burst out laughing, and I said, “What are you laughing about?” I was really hurt. “Why are you laughing?” They said, “We don’t kill ourselves. You people kill yourselves? What is this?”

https://ffrf.org/publications/freet...rahae-people-who-define-happiness-without-god

My impression is that up until modern times suicide was usually an act of submission to the group. The Athenians disapproved of Socrates for his atheistic ideas, and Socrates drank hemlock in obedience to their disapproval. A general whose battle plan didn't work might commit suicide in an attempt to clear his family's honor.

I think the mobility of people has broken down traditional family and tribal relationships and people are slipping through the cracks. The social services of government are a poor substitute for relationships from being an integral part of a tribe of hunter/gatherers.

 

[Twilight Hue]

It's not the rest of the worlds responsibility to solve your problems. Nor is it your responsibility to help the rest of the world. You should live for yourself and not care about society.

I would say yes and no to that. Society as a whole provides an incalculable benefit as well as grief. Take care of society and it takes care of you, and not talking about welfare and benefits alone but the symbiotic interactions involving society and the individual. Both are important to each other actually.

 

[George-ananda]

Well, I come from a spiritual position that believes our souls advance through the wisdom gained from all the experiences of incarnations. Ending one early just cheats yourself and you will regret it deeply at some point.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

A Christian missionary named Daniel Everett went to the Piraha tribe who are noteworthy for their lack of superstitions.

https://ffrf.org/publications/freet...rahae-people-who-define-happiness-without-god

My impression is that up until modern times suicide was usually an act of submission to the group. The Athenians disapproved of Socrates for his atheistic ideas, and Socrates drank hemlock in obedience to their disapproval. A general whose battle plan didn't work might commit suicide in an attempt to clear his family's honor.

I think the mobility of people has broken down traditional family and tribal relationships and people are slipping through the cracks. The social services of government are a poor substitute for relationships from being an integral part of a tribe of hunter/gatherers.

Well said. Modern civilization and alienation go hand and hand. We're dehumanized cogs in the profit machine who are disconnected from ourselves, each other and nature.

 

[DawudTalut]

.....I believe that an individual and that individual alone decide how much they matter. Your loved ones don't matter. Your life belongs 100% to you.

Peace be on you.......You did not come to world by your choice. You did not make yourself too.

 

[Penumbra]

If I am morally required not to kill myself for the sake of people loving me, then does that mean if the majority of people hate me I'm morally obligated to kill myself?

Well, I don't think so. Why? Because morality only exists when one thing is done to another. Self-harm, suicide, and low self-esteem are all universally right, simply because they don't directly affect others. This is because morality is subjective.
Now, if I feel suicide is okay, and you feel it isn't... Who should have more authority on the issue? The person feeling that way or some onlooker? How can you apply your believe that suicide is wrong on other people.

And if you wanna say, "It'll affect your loved ones"... who decides how much a persons life is worth? I believe that an individual and that individual alone decide how much they matter. Your loved ones don't matter. Your life belongs 100% to you.

I don't particularly agree with any of that. I don't think morality is subjective, nor do I think suicide is even much of a moral question to begin with in many contexts. There are lots of philosophically complicated words like, "okay" or "wrong" or "right" in that post that I don't think have much relevance to the topic.

I mentally differentiate between two types of suicidal people. Those that are impulsively suicidal (the majority), and those that are purposely suicidal over an extended period of time and that will make long term highly successful plans to commit suicide (the minority). Most suicides fail. And most people that attempt suicide, once they get better, don't go on to succeed in suicide later. Many people claim to be happy that their prior suicide attempt did not work.

So I think it's proper to intervene to prevent suicides when possible. This will benefit the impulsively suicidal people. People that are more set on it over the long term, can't really be stopped.