Why would a god select only the few?

[Bear Wild]

My religion and also Islam make the claim that God has come to every region to address them. They in turn passed on their message to the others. In the Americas, there are some that believe, I think with good reason that Messengers of God came to the indigenous peoples here, to a tribe or confederation of tribes. This is not an official view of the Baha'i Faith, however, though I share this point of view. At BahaiTeachings.org there is a series called Indigenous Messengers of God:

Series: Indigenous Messengers of God

So are you saying that Odin and Thor are actually the same god as who addressed the people of the middle east but in a different presentation? Is Dagda and Morrigan the same god as the the Abrahamic god?

 

[Bear Wild]

I do not know why you believe this. God has presented Himself to various people all over the world at various times throughout human history. God presents Himself through Prophets who are sent to to various locations.
The Three Kinds of Prophets

It is however true that the God of Abraham only sent the universal Prophets like Moses, Jesus, and Muhammad to one place on earth and they spoke to one group of people, but that was the case because they had to appear somewhere in earth, they could not appear everywhere all at once.

Back in previous centuries the world was not all connected so the message of God could not spread from one continent to another but now that the world is connected and people can communicate across the world the message of God that was delivered to Baha'u'llah in the 19th century has spread around the globe.

So let me understand the Morrigan and Dagda are the same as the Abrahamic god but in the form a different form for the people to understand? Or did i miss your message.

 

[Bear Wild]

Because it makes Abrahamic god followers feel superior while dissing other religions

Ah, a person of my own belief. Now remember I tried to convince you who would make an fantastic pagan. The offer is still out their. You could be a druidess and connect with our amazing and wonderful world with amazing mythology and really excellent goddesses. Always appreciate your opinion. Thanks my friend.

 

[Trailblazer]

So let me understand the Morrigan and Dagda are the same as the Abrahamic god but in the form a different form for the people to understand? Or did i miss your message.

No, that is not what I am saying.
I said: "It is however true that the God of Abraham only sent the universal Prophets like Moses, Jesus, and Muhammad to one place on earth and they spoke to one group of people, but that was the case because they had to appear somewhere in earth, they could not appear everywhere all at once."

The way the world was back in those days the message of the Abrahamic God did not get out to everyone because the world was not all connected, so the message could not spread from one continent to another, and because not everyone got the message I do not believe that God held the people who did not get the message accountable for believing in the Abrahamic God. Meanwhile people had other God(s) that they believed in.

But once people had heard of the Abrahamic God owing to Christians and Muslims spreading their faith, people were held accountable, IF they got the message.

Now that the world is connected and people can communicate across the world, the message of the Abrahamic God that was delivered to Baha'u'llah in the 19th century has spread around the globe, and if people have heard the message they are held accountable. If not they are not blameworthy because that would not be just on the part of God.

 

[Bear Wild]

There are tall people and short people. The rain cools the tall people first, but eventually everyone is comforted.

I am speechless. Can you give just a little more explanation ? I understand the rain cool people off and I and my trees are very comforted by the rain. Hey why not it is raining outside right now so I am going outside to cool off in the rain. Thanks.

 

[Bear Wild]

God has reached out to all people in all cultures and times.
More was needed for salvation and so God worked in a special way through the Jews whom existed and still do for His purposes and as witnesses to Him and so He could send the Messiah through them, the promised one, the one prophesied about in their culture the one who came for the salvation of all people.
Jesus did what was necessary and now most of the whole world knows whom He is and why He came even though the deceiver blinds people to the truth.

Yah and ignore everyone else. Make perfect sense. Why bother with anyone else when you can present to only one type of people and ignore everyone else. Makes perfect sense. And Jesus appeared again to the same people. Clearly a god of favorites who cared nothing for most of humanity.

 

[Bear Wild]

Well, I know of one Christian denomination who believes He showed himself to other people, but they are ridiculed by everybody else for believing it. Anyway, your question is a really good one.

Thanks. You have surprised me before with a refreshing openness. I appreciate that.

 

[Bear Wild]

No, that is not what I am saying.
I said: It is however true that the God of Abraham only sent the universal Prophets like Moses, Jesus, and Muhammad to one place on earth and they spoke to one group of people, but that was the case because they had to appear somewhere in earth, they could not appear everywhere all at once.

I understand but he only presented to the same people and ignored everyone else. For those who believe in the God of Abraham and have that connection to the middle east the great. But for us who have not connection to that god their are others that have more meaning. It is fine for those who have a relationship for the god of Abraham but just drop the ridiculous pretense that their god is the one and only.

 

[Trailblazer]

I understand but he only presented to the same people and ignored everyone else. For those who believe in the God of Abraham and have that connection to the middle east the great. But for us who have not connection to that god their are others that have more meaning. It is fine for those who have a relationship for the god of Abraham but just drop the ridiculous pretense that their god is the one and only.

Those is us who believe in the Abrahamic God believe that He is the one true God, but that is just our belief, so we should not trample on the beliefs of others.... Everyone is entitled to their own beliefs.

I was editing my post for a while and I added quite a bit to it so please go back and read it again because I had an incomplete answer to your post before.

#24 Trailblazer, 23 minutes ago
Last edited: 7 minutes ago

 

[Trailblazer]

Yah and ignore everyone else. Make perfect sense. Why bother with anyone else when you can present to only one type of people and ignore everyone else. Makes perfect sense. And Jesus appeared again to the same people. Clearly a god of favorites who cared nothing for most of humanity.

The God that Christians believe in is a God of favorites. He cannot help but be since He only allows for Jesus, who Christians believe is the Only Way to the Father (John 14:6)

 

[74x12]

If one claims as the Abrahamic religions do that god is the one and only creator, why would that god only present himself to just a few isolated people in this world? Were they the only humans he cared about? Did he not like the rest of the humans that occupied the Earth? Did he not even think to present himself to other people of the Earth? For those that follow this god and feel comfortable with him fine, but to claim him the one and only true god when he only presented to an extremely small group of people in only one location of the world seems cruel to ignore everyone else. That would imply that this perfect one god ignored most of the world of humans. On the other hand if this is just one god of many then fine but that is not the claim.

God can't change; only we can. God sends his Word to all the world but only the right heart receives it. (Isaiah 55:11) To everyone else it's seemingly nonsense. God promises
"And ye shall seek me, and find me, when ye shall search for me with all your heart." (Jeremiah 29:13)

Wisdom cries in public places where everyone can hear her (Proverbs 8) but most people choose to listen to foolishness.

 

[Jimmy]

No I am not! Followers of the Abrahamic religion claim they have the one true god that created everything but who only presented himself to only one group of people. Now if you are saying that the god of the Abrahamic faith is only one of many and know that theirs is not the only god that is fine. It is impossible to read to much into it when you are told their god was is the only true god. That is stated quite clear.

the one true God for them, yeah sure.Everybody knows that including them. They just don’t sugarcoat or pc it for you. No big deal

 

[Bear Wild]

the one true God for them, yeah sure.Everybody knows that including them. They just don’t sugarcoat or pc it for you. No big deal

Can you explain this more clearly. Who is sugarcoating anything? So are you saying the Abrahamic god is no big deal, meaning no more special than any other deity?

 

[Bear Wild]

God can't change; only we can. God sends his Word to all the world but only the right heart receives it. (Isaiah 55:11) To everyone else it's seemingly nonsense. God promises
"And ye shall seek me, and find me, when ye shall search for me with all your heart." (Jeremiah 29:13)

Wisdom cries in public places where everyone can hear her (Proverbs 8) but most people choose to listen to foolishness.

You still have not explained why this god would only present to one group of people. You site verses from a book that belongs to only one group of people and not sent to the world. I do not know of a single book written by god himself but if you are familiar with one let me know. It seems to me you must be aware that this god only presented himself to an isolated group of people thus ignoring the rest of the world. I just want to know why this god plays favorites.

 

[Bear Wild]

The God that Christians believe in is a God of favorites. He cannot help but be since He only allows for Jesus, who Christians believe is the Only Way to the Father (John 14:6)

I do appreciate your input. Thanks.

 

[osgart]

Yeah the consequences for not believing a God exists, and the consequences for not believing in God are ridiculous.

Perhaps if there were a God that used PSR I'd be more kind toward such God.

I see efforts by people to make the Abrahamic God all inclusive. But clearly scriptures differentiate between believers and infidels being non believers.

Sue me if I'm wrong.

It's a child's game to require belief not to be destroyed or eliminated from life.

 

[viole]

If one claims as the Abrahamic religions do that god is the one and only creator, why would that god only present himself to just a few isolated people in this world? Were they the only humans he cared about? Did he not like the rest of the humans that occupied the Earth? Did he not even think to present himself to other people of the Earth? For those that follow this god and feel comfortable with him fine, but to claim him the one and only true god when he only presented to an extremely small group of people in only one location of the world seems cruel to ignore everyone else. That would imply that this perfect one god ignored most of the world of humans. On the other hand if this is just one god of many then fine but that is not the claim.

Because societies and tribes tend to make up Gods who likes them above the rest.

Ciao

- viole

 

[Deeje]

If one claims as the Abrahamic religions do that god is the one and only creator, why would that god only present himself to just a few isolated people in this world? Were they the only humans he cared about?

Good questions.....
God did not choose Israel because they were a superior race of people....good grief!....he wanted to exterminate them at times because they could never do as they were told. But there was a reason why he chose just one small nation to make an example of....both in a positive and a negative way. It was a teaching exercise as well as a means to send his son in to the world with clear identification.

Abraham was the most righteous man in the world at the time, so he made a promise to him that through his offspring, the Savior would come.....in a specific tribe, at a specific location, and at a specific time, so that his people would be able to identify him.....but they didn't want him because he did not fulfill their false expectations, and hence, they made excuses to do away with him (as they had done to God's prophets previously.) But through his interactions with this nation, and their obligation to keep his laws (given to no other people) he provided a record so that future generations could see what was required of them, and in turn, what he would do for them if they followed his instructions.....and what would happen if they failed.

Did he not like the rest of the humans that occupied the Earth? Did he not even think to present himself to other people of the Earth? For those that follow this god and feel comfortable with him fine, but to claim him the one and only true god when he only presented to an extremely small group of people in only one location of the world seems cruel to ignore everyone else.

There was no point at that time because he was making history with this one nation and creating precedents for his future worshippers who would come out of all nations as he had promised Abraham in the beginning.

Those outside of that nation were virtually left to their own devices and gods as they lived and died for the thousands of years that have intervened. Since the Bible teaches that all who have died are still in their graves, he has promised a resurrection to all of them, no matter what gods they worshipped in their ignorance. Knowledge is what obligates one to worship the true God. If you don't know him, you can't worship him. If you are unaware of something then your actions are not deliberate. No ignorant person will pay for their sin. Jesus did it for them......but there will be obligation on all who become aware of their obligation after their resurrection, but who fail to fulfill it for whatever reason.

That would imply that this perfect one god ignored most of the world of humans. On the other hand if this is just one god of many then fine but that is not the claim.

His original promise to Abraham was.....(Genesis 22:17-18)
"I will surely bless you and I will surely multiply your offspring like the stars of the heavens and like the grains of sand on the seashore, and your offspring will take possession of the gate of his enemies. 18 And by means of your offspring all nations of the earth will obtain a blessing for themselves because you have listened to my voice.’”

So the family who came from Abraham's grandson Jacob, were going to become this great nation whom God would protect and bless as long as they obeyed his commands. No enemy would be able to defeat them in the name of its god, because Israel's God was superior. Time and again, he demonstrated this. But when Israel rebelled and disobeyed their God, he allowed their enemies to wipe the floor with them.

It was going to be at the time when this object lesson was nearing completion that he would cleanse a people out of all nations and have them declare the good news of his incoming Kingdom which will destroy all failed human rulership, and replace them with the rulership that humans should have had in the beginning.....the one we have never had the pleasure of enjoying. They threw that away in favor of ruling themselves, and we have been reaping the consequences ever since.....I don't think that most people have any idea what we lost.....

Instead of this.......................................................we have this.

God will take his planet back and reward those who never lost faith in him....that is what I believe....

God's Kingdom will "come" and only then will we see God's will "done on earth as it is in heaven" ....that is how the Bible explains it to me.

 

[Trailblazer]

Yeah the consequences for not believing a God exists, and the consequences for not believing in God are ridiculous.

It is always nice to see you again osgart.

I do not think anyone except God really knows the consequences of not believing in the afterlife.
People just 'claim' to know the consequences based upon 'their interpretation' of their scriptures...

Since our soul continues to exist in the spiritual world and carries all of our personality and character, which is the result of everything we believed and did in this world, I believe that when we cross over we will be whoever we had become in this world.

Since everything in life has consequences it makes sense that after we die there will be consequences for what we have done and what we have thereby become in this life

It has never been revealed in scriptures exactly what those consequences will be. It has not bee revealed what will happen to nonbelievers after they die. Although admittedly hellfire was in the Bible and the Qur'an, and I think it was used to scare people into believing, to put a fire under them so to speak.

Baha'u'llah never revealed the nature of the afterlife (spiritual world), so there is no way I can know what it will be like. All we have are certain assurances, if we are a confident believer.

“The mysteries of man’s physical death and of his return have not been divulged, and still remain unread. By the righteousness of God! Were they to be revealed, they would evoke such fear and sorrow that some would perish, while others would be so filled with gladness as to wish for death, and beseech, with unceasing longing, the one true God—exalted be His glory—to hasten their end.

Death proffereth unto every confident believer the cup that is life indeed. It bestoweth joy, and is the bearer of gladness. It conferreth the gift of everlasting life.

As to those that have tasted of the fruit of man’s earthly existence, which is the recognition of the one 346 true God, exalted be His glory, their life hereafter is such as We are unable to describe. The knowledge thereof is with God, alone, the Lord of all worlds.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 345-346

As for the form our soul will take on in the spiritual world, all we have been told is that it will not be a physical form, it will be a spiritual form.

“The answer to the third question is this, that in the other world the human reality doth not assume a physical form, rather doth it take on a heavenly form, made up of elements of that heavenly realm.” Selections From the Writings of ‘Abdu’l-Bahá, p. 194

 

[Subduction Zone]

Yeah the consequences for not believing a God exists, and the consequences for not believing in God are ridiculous.

Perhaps if there were a God that used PSR I'd be more kind toward such God.

I see efforts by people to make the Abrahamic God all inclusive. But clearly scriptures differentiate between believers and infidels being non believers.

Sue me if I'm wrong.

It's a child's game to require belief not to be destroyed or eliminated from life.

The old failed Pascal's wager argument. It fails by assuming your own god is the right god and that that god is so dense that he can't tell the difference between a true believer and someone merely saying that he believes.